Jump to content

Talk:List of former transcontinental countries/Archive 1

Page contents not supported in other languages.
From Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
Archive 1

Argentina

During the Falklands War with the United Kingdom, Argentina was a de facto example of a transcontinental country, as were Israel and Eritrea during their border disputes with Egypt and Yemen, respectively. These examples all received limited international recognition, but not from the United Nations, and arguably may have been illegal. The Argentine government always has claimed the Falkland Islands as well as South Georgia and the South Sandwich Islands as irredenta and refers to the former as Islas Malvinas. Although the map link includes a slice of Antarctica, land claims south of 60°S are terra nullius and held in abeyance by the Antarctic Treaty System. Heff01 01:08, 30 May 2007 (UTC)

Of course, de facto recognition of a transcontinental occupation by a third-party nation does not necessarily mean its approval. Heff01 01:12, 30 May 2007 (UTC)

During the Falklands War, Argentina added its occupied irredenta islands to its Tierra del Fuego Province, temporarily making it transcontinental. Heff01 23:01, 30 May 2007 (UTC)

Argentina to this day continues to name its southernmost province officially as Tierra del Fuego, Antarctica, and South Atlantic Islands Province as its way of telling the world that its irredentist claims, although not actively being pursued, remain regarded by itself as legitimate and ideal. Heff01 01:29, 5 October 2007 (UTC)

Which continent do the Falkland Islands belong to, I might ask? Str1977 (talk) 08:46, 16 July 2018 (UTC)

The Argentinian claims to portions of Antarctica are valid. When Argentina got freedom from Spain, she took possession of portions of Antarctica which had been granted to Spain by the Pope, who was then a recognized mediator of international disputes, in the treaty of Tordesillas. Wandavianempire (talk) 01:30, 16 April 2020 (UTC)

Tobago

Tobago had been a colony of the Duchy of Courland until the Northern Wars, which pitted Courland, Poland-Lithuania, and Denmark against Sweden, the Netherlands, Ukraine, and Russia. Although Sweden overran Courland at home, it was their Dutch allies who temporarily took Tobago, so I removed South America from the Swedish Empire's list. Heff01 16:28, 11 June 2007 (UTC)

Later on in that war, the Dutch found themselves on the Dano-Polish side when the Swedes seized New Netherlands. The Netherlands was known to waver alliances between Denmark and Sweden. Heff01 20:02, 21 July 2007 (UTC)

Vichy French territories

Vichy France was the pro-Axis government left after Hitler's defeat of France. Nazi Germany and Fascist Italy recognized its empire as consisting of the portion of metropolitan France not directly occupied by them and the French overseas territories minus French Indochina (under Japanese and Thai occupation.) Over the course of the Vichy Empire's existence until 1943, it gradually lost its territories to Free French uprisings and British and American occupations. It continued France's presence on all continents, a feat only duplicated by the British Empire. Heff01 04:09, 19 June 2007 (UTC)

Japanese Empire at its peak

At its peak of eastward advance, the Empire of Japan extended halfway across the Pacific Ocean and briefly occupied the western Aleutian Islands. The islands covered by this occupation of American territory are the Near Islands, which are on Asia's continental shelf, and the Rat Islands, which are disputed whether they are associated with Asia or North America. A clear consensus is needed before the Japanese Empire is credited with a North American presence. Although I am a lifelong American, I have no bias on this issue against the nation which directly confronted mine in World War II.

Also disputed as to which continent:

St. Lawrence Island---Asia or North America

Prince Edward Islands---Africa or Antarctica

Antipodes Islands, Auckland Islands, and Campbell Islands---Oceania or Antarctica Heff01 14:39, 22 June 2007 (UTC)

Greek Aegean islands

Although Greece is a geopolitically European nation, it controls some islands on the continental shelf of Asia Minor that are geographically Asian. See the parent article and its discussion for more detail. Due to such a classification of these Greek eastern Aegean islands, the Aragonese, Italian, and Nazi Empires are also credited in this article with an Asian presence. I am not positive of the extent of the Greek island possessions of the Navarrese Company, but if it included some of these islands, that gives the Navarrese Empire a presence in Asia as well as Europe and North America. Heff01 02:01, 16 August 2007 (UTC)

Greece also occupied a small area of the Asia Minor mainland between 1919 and 1922 during the Turkish War of Independence. Heff01 02:26, 16 August 2007 (UTC)

The Genoese Empire remained in control of the Greek eastern Aegean islands during the time of Navarrese and Aragonese holdings in Greece until driven out by the Ottoman Empire. Heff01 03:14, 21 August 2007 (UTC)

Pantelleria and the Pelagie Islands

Pantelleria and the Pelagie Islands are the Italian islands on Africa's continental shelf. The Kingdom of Sicily, Austrian Empire, Parthenopaean Republic, and Kingdom of the Two Sicilies are credited with an African presence since each controlled these islands, which passed to the Kingdom of Italy during the Risorgimento. Heff01 02:07, 16 August 2007 (UTC)

Delian League

The Delian League was an association of ancient Greek city-states under Athenian leadership in which its members were not free to leave. Read the Delian League article to find out what happened to the few members which tried to assert their independence. It wasn't at all pretty. This was ironically enough much closer to being an "Athenian Empire" than what Wikipedia refers to as the Second Athenian Empire, which was a looser and freer association of Athenian-aligned city-states for the continued purpose of mutual defense against raids by Sparta and the Achaemenid Empire. Heff01 01:27, 16 October 2007 (UTC)

Phoenicians

The Phoenician Empire was wrongly removed as "Atlantean nonsense." If North America or South America had been included, the case for such an argument would be strong due to the lack of solidly-established historical ground behind such settlements. However, settlements around the Mediterranean on its three bordering continents are well-established. The only question remaining is whether it actually was an empire, or more likely a confederation of city-states working in cooperation. Keep in mind that not all lands shown to be Phoenician-controlled on the map actually were, but their outposts were widespread on coastlines and undeniably on three continents. Heff01 (talk) 00:19, 15 June 2008 (UTC)

It was removed because of the source that was used. And I removed it again just now before I saw you'd added the above. If you can find a reliable source, ok. Glenn Markoe - whose book is a reliable source - calls them a confederation. I guess if we can get a form of wording that makes it clear this was not an empire or a unitary state, but a confederation, I'll add a citation from Markoe. But I really don't think we can call it an empire. I appreciate your bringing this to the talk page. Doug Weller (talk) 16:44, 15 June 2008 (UTC)
I removed it again. Phoenicia was an assembly of city-states, of which only one, Carthage, could be called an empire. Such an assembly - not even a confederation - does not amount to a "Phoenician Empire" - the source (url=http://www.ancient.eu/phoenicia/) contains no claim to that extent. Str1977 (talk) 08:07, 16 July 2018 (UTC)

Egypt

I cannot find anything about Egyptian dominions in Europe in the given source, can anyone verify? +Hexagon1 (t) 12:14, 13 August 2008 (UTC)

I agree this must be in error. Ancient Egyptian empires were certainly a two continent polity but never three. The Ptolemy's do however qualify as they were on three continents at the height of their power (thanks to their navy). — Preceding unsigned comment added by 24.12.152.8 (talk) 03:35, 29 June 2013 (UTC)

Absurd subtitles

I don't have time to address this right now, but dividing a list of empires into "pre-colonial" and "colonial era" seems slightly ridiculous. All empires, without exception, are "colonial" in some sense of the word.

To me it would make much more sense (and be more useful) to dividing the list by broad time periods, designated by the approximate year when the empire became multi-continental (e.g. Before 1000 BCE; 1000 BCE-1 BCE; 1 CE-500 CE; 500-1000; 1000-1450; 1450-1700; 1700-1900; since 1900). —Preceding unsigned comment added by Potosino (talk • contribs) 14:36, 30 September 2010 (UTC)

I know it's a bit late but I just noticed exactly the same problem as Potosino. The labels colonial and pre-colonial make no sense to me in this context. If it needs to be broken down by time period, then it should be done as Potosino suggests. --Boreas74 You'll catch more flies with honey 21:47, 1 April 2016 (UTC)
I gave it a shot. I'm not sure that I got the cut-offs right, however. TompaDompa (talk) 21:29, 8 May 2018 (UTC)

Hello fellow Wikipedians,

I have just added archive links to 2 external links on List of former transcontinental countries. Please take a moment to review my edit. If necessary, add {{cbignore}} after the link to keep me from modifying it. Alternatively, you can add {{nobots|deny=InternetArchiveBot}} to keep me off the page altogether. I made the following changes:

When you have finished reviewing my changes, please set the checked parameter below to true to let others know.

This message was posted before February 2018. After February 2018, "External links modified" talk page sections are no longer generated or monitored by InternetArchiveBot. No special action is required regarding these talk page notices, other than regular verification using the archive tool instructions below. Editors have permission to delete these "External links modified" talk page sections if they want to de-clutter talk pages, but see the RfC before doing mass systematic removals. This message is updated dynamically through the template {{source check}} (last update: 5 June 2024).

  • If you have discovered URLs which were erroneously considered dead by the bot, you can report them with this tool.
  • If you found an error with any archives or the URLs themselves, you can fix them with this tool.

Cheers.—cyberbot IITalk to my owner:Online 18:55, 20 January 2016 (UTC)

Retrieved from "https://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=Talk:List_of_former_transcontinental_countries/Archive_1&oldid=1253292910"