Talk:List of blues musicians/Archive 1

Archive 1

categories

I'm thinking more categories. The "early country blues" list is half early country blues, half nightclub performers like Memphis Minnie. Later, gator, Ortolan88

Convention in books is to sort a list of names by last name if an individual, and by first name if its a group. For easier finding a name, we might want to list individuals by last name. Comments? --Blainster 10:17, 11 Apr 2005 (UTC)

Sounds good - I've done the first half, and found that the second half was already done. Thanks for suggesting it. JesseW 1 July 2005 08:53 (UTC)

Seems like the ABCizing was rather inconsistent. I've done some work on it. In addition to what's been stated earlier, let's say that for artists who have a nick name that serves as their full name (like Bumble Bee Slim), let's have them listed by the first letter of the nickname (so in the Bumnle Bee Slim case, under B[u]). Theshibboleth 19:55, 23 October 2005 (UTC)

Dates

Any particular reason only some of the artists have dates next to their names? I'm going to go ahead and add them for those I can. Theshibboleth 18:01, 23 October 2005 (UTC)

Artist in more than one category?

Is it ok that at least one artist (Bessie Smith) is listed in more than one of the categories? I could understand why this might make sense for someone with a particulary long or dynamic career, but for the sake of functionality shouldn't an artist be listed in only one category? Theshibboleth 18:53, 23 October 2005 (UTC)

Limited and Misleading Categories

This is a bit long, so I broke it up into smaller pieces. I intend, over the next few days, to get started on some of the points I have made, specifically with brushing up on my blues history to break up the early blues artists. I would really prefer some concensus was made on criteria before those get edited. Please let me know any thoughts on my suggestions, positive or negative.Crazytonyi 19:49, 3 January 2007 (UTC)

Not specific sometimes, Too specific othertimes

The problem I have with the categories is that some are too vague while others are too confined. For example, post-WWII blues jazz only allows for "blues jazz", thereby leaving out many artists who were not blues jazz but don't fit into any other time slot. On the other hand "early country blues" crams all early blues artists (other than those from the north) together. There is a significant difference between delta blues, Texas blues, and other early southern blues forms, and if nothing else, being more specific would make the lists shorter and more precise.

Redundant

Also, I think the reason why we see some artists getting repeated is because 1) some of the categories are redundant, and 2) some of the artists are getting grouped by style, rather than period. I already noticed and fixed the Seasick Steve listing and put him with "post 1950's blues" artists. Reading his article, it would definitely seem that he is not "early". His date of birth is unknown, but his appearance and the fact that he is living, as well as the release dates for his music, suggest that he was put in early blues because he has an early blues sound.

When is it blues?

Is it Blues or Early Rock'n'Roll?
Also, there is much overlap (in the genre), between blues, jazz, and rock and roll. I don't just mean artists like Clapton, who played blues and rock and some of his music could be either, but early rock musicians like Bo Diddley and Louis Jordan who were playing what they considered blues but what became rock and roll.
Artists can be blue, but not blues artists
Also, some singers, such as Billie Holiday are considered Jazz or blues, depending on your definition, but are considered by most listeners and musical historians to be relevant as jazz musicians more than blues singers, as opposed to someone like Bessie Smith.

Blues from Europe? Or Blues influenced Rock'n'Roll?

I think it's impressive to have categories on this article for rock musicians and other genres that have a heavy blues influence, but the list, if it were accurate, would be so much longer that it would overpower the page. Therefore I think that either those lists should be removed altogether to avoid the possibility of it becoming too long, or we should agree on some criteria (a list of 3-5 factors that a band must meet) to limit who can be listed. Right now, we have a category of "Blues in late 1960s rock music" and "Blues from Europe", both of which include bands like Led Zeppelin and Cream. Perhaps it would simplify things to have one category, such as "Rock and Roll artists heavily influenced by Blues", which could be sub-categorized by decade. I hesitate to use this exact title, as I don't care of the phrase "heavily influenced" since bands like The Beatles were influence by the Blues, but they didn't make very many blues songs. The Rolling Stones made significantly more blues sounding songs (and covered quite a few blues standards), but they still are not as "heavily influenced" as Clapton or Led Zeppelin. The other problem that this article manages to avoid yet is compromised by is the issue of race. Many people might consider Blues music something only African-Americans can make, while any white person who plays the blues is only "influenced" or simply performing. I agree that Eric Clapton 'is' a blues-guitarist, since he has made entire original blues albums. However, simply because he was in Cream doesn't make Cream a blues band. Led Zeppelin very much has strong blues elements, but putting them under blues from Europe opens this race debate up, since most people do not consider them "blues" and it's questionable whether they considered themselves blues or just a rock band with a lot of blues influence. Once again, I think that avoiding this issue creates both the problem of misleading classification but also redundant list entries. I again think a good solution to this would be better categories for the sub-lists as well as criteria for lists that lend themselves to ambiguity.

My vision for this list

Finally, I think the overall direction this page should take, one that would clear up many of the above mentioned issues as well as making the page more valuable to those that visit and use this article, would be to organize the list by the following factors: geography, style or "sub-genre", and time. If it were set up right, someone visiting this page could get not only a list of musicians, but an accurate yet quick look at the history and development of blues music. In the "Early Blues" section at the top, the lists could be broken up by regions. After that, we would see sub-genre lists emerge, in order of historical significance. Finally, we would see post-60's blues, and how blues has maintained into the present. After this (I think), we would have the "Direct Influence" list, with, for example, rock and roll from the 50's through now, broken up by decade. I think this page can be more than just a list of lists of Blues artists. I think that if it was organized well, it could be the backbone of the wikipedia blues pages, tying them together and making a central hub for all other articles related to blues music. Crazytonyi 19:49, 3 January 2007 (UTC)

Other problems I have, and would really like feedback on, are certain artists such as Muddy Waters, who essentially created the Chicago blues scene, but were originally Delta blues. Do we go ahead and assume that artists who were founders of a new sub-genre should be listed with that genre, as most of them probably "learned the ropes" in an earlier sub-genre? Shall we leave it to those that are using the list to click on a name and find out the whole story?Crazytonyi 19:49, 3 January 2007 (UTC)

Musicians or bands: Considering this page is titled 'blues musicians', should bands be listed at all? Merlin 42 02:51, 24 January 2007 (UTC)

Possible correction

Not sure if this requires a revision, but R.L. Burnside was first recorded by George Mitchell in 1967, so I don't think he belongs in the "Blues Since 1990" section.

Catrina Pinehurst (talk) 23:21, 18 December 2013 (UTC)

• Kazumi Watanabe, Yavuz Cetin? Maybe me too...92.243.182.199 (talk) 21:13, 31 January 2014 (UTC)

Jimmy Dotson

I added Dotson in the section "Early country blues", because that is where his performing partner Silas Hogan is listed. If this is not the appropriate section for Dotson, please move his listing to a more appropriate section.

Jwicklatz (talk) 18:26, 7 April 2017 (UTC)

Archive 1