Talk:List of Serbian painters/Archive 1

Archive 1

Forcing POV through ethnic bias

This was article on painters from Serbia, just like any other in the category "Lists of painters by nationality". Then, I removed painters with no connection with the said country, and then editor Sadko, after one back-and-forth revert session upon my edits and my rational given in the edit-summaries, decided to "bend reality", sort of speak, by reshaping sentence at the top of the page usually posing as a topic description in all of them. So, just to force a particular ethnic bias on the list, editor phrased the sentence in most incredible way, using in the process language which discriminate between Serbs and all other Serbians on ethnic basis. I hope this won't become another page for the exercise in ethnic bias.--౪ Santa ౪^99° 00:47, 29 August 2020 (UTC)

Further, these three persons which I removed from the list (and I can only imagine how many others shouldn't be on it), what is editor's rational for their inclusion? Do we know why should they be on the list and what sources have been provided for verification of whatever rational / basis is?--౪ Santa ౪^99° 00:58, 29 August 2020 (UTC)

There is not a single Wiki rule or guideline which says that we can't have a list this one. Quote one - if there is one. This is just a major WP:IDONTLIKEIT and that's that. Sadkσ (talk is cheap) 08:13, 29 August 2020 (UTC)

In Antidiskrimnator's, whom editor mentions in edit summary, and Sadko's mind everything that is said and done in suppression of blatan nationalistic editing is "(You) don't like it" - well, it's not "I don't like", although I generally abhor all discriminations on any basis, rule(s) that apply here is usual NPOV, but also what we can sensibly derive from few other guidelines, like MOS:ID, MOS:BIO with MOS:ETHNICITY, MOS:NCGLOSSARIES, WP:BLPCAT with WP:CATEGRS, probably few other that will atune us to general article tone and acceptable narrative direction, or in this case list description wich gives it its scope, and so on. And for Antidiskriminator, since he earned his indefinite Balkan editing restriction exactly because of ethno-religious bias and pov-pushing, his opposing view on my edit expressed with a revert is irrelevant.
Scope of this list is broad enough, it does not discriminate citizens of Serbia on ethnic basis, and is expressed in clear manner: list concerns painters from or associated with Serbia (born, gained citizenship, etc). By insisting on one particular ethnicity over all other in the list's scope description is blatan discrimination on identity basis. We need to suppress discrimination on ethno-religious or racial grounds, not promotie it or affirm it. I won't pretend that I can't imaging reason why would anyone insist on adding one specific ethnicity in description of a list that should include all people of predefined category in predefined locality.--౪ Santa ౪^99° 19:00, 15 September 2020 (UTC)

Followup - fixation on ethnicity

I am not spinning anything, as claimed in edit summary. This list's scope is clear and in accordance with the usual practice of the English Wikipedia for list of painters - bottom line, the list is not based on ethnicity of the individual painters, instead it's based on national affiliation so it can include all ethnicities from Serbia, Serbs, Montenegrins, Jews, Hungarians, Czechs, and so forth, and you can't have both ways - you can't have a list of all the ethnic Serb painters of the world, and on the side a few other ethnic painters, like Montenegrins, Jews, Hungarians, Czechs, and so forth but only Serbia's Montenegrins, Jews, Hungarians, Czechs, and so on.--౪ Santa ౪^99° 12:10, 26 September 2020 (UTC)

1) What is "the usual practice"? And if it is "usual" why do you think that it's any more correct or true? 2) Montenegrins are not considered to be other ethnic group until recent decades, and very few painters have claimed otherwise. That is irrelevant. 3) We can have a list of Serb painters and we shall. 4) Are you opposed to Serbs having a list of their painters? I hope that this is not another case (generally speaking) of severe discrimination... Sadkσ (talk is cheap) 13:03, 15 October 2020 (UTC)

Again changing scope

First, you can't change scope on your own opinion and whim, every time you can't win over discussion with your arguments; second, all other article are based on painters national or country of origin, or where they spent most of their careers and lives. Further, where do you think that we should list painters who aren't Serbs but they were born, lived and worked in Serbia, or how you intend to prove that listed painters are infect Serbs in the first place.--౪ Santa ౪^99° 19:13, 19 February 2021 (UTC)

First of all, learn to work with other editors and read WP:CIVILITY. I have disagreed with your viewpoint and disputed it, that is nothing bad per itself and there are also articles which go with ethnic scope.

That does not mean that several notable Serb painters, who are probably the greatest painters to be born in modern-day Bosnia and Herzegovina, can't be in other lists. Do not forget that WP:WINNING and do not be aggressive. Thank you. Bb. Sadkσ (talk is cheap) 19:55, 24 February 2021 (UTC)