Talk:List of Malayalam films of 2016

Request for addition of list of Dubbed Movies

Dear editors, please discuss the need of adding a list of Malayalam dubbed films that have been released. Pokkiri Police is an example. Cheers, Nairspecht (talk) 08:24, 1 February 2016 (UTC)

You can do that. No need to discuss.--Charles Turing (talk) 18:01, 1 February 2016 (UTC)

@Surabhy: Can you start a table? I will join you.. Cheers, Nairspecht (talk) 06:39, 2 February 2016 (UTC)

Orphaned references in List of Malayalam films of 2016

I check pages listed in Category:Pages with incorrect ref formatting to try to fix reference errors. One of the things I do is look for content for orphaned references in wikilinked articles. I have found content for some of List of Malayalam films of 2016's orphans, the problem is that I found more than one version. I can't determine which (if any) is correct for this article, so I am asking for a sentient editor to look it over and copy the correct ref content into this article.

Reference named "ReferenceB":

• From List of Telugu films of 2013: "Movies releasing this week - October 4, 2013"
• From List of Tamil films of 2013: "Friday Fury – Diwali Dhamaka". Sify. 2013-11-01. Retrieved 2013-12-14.
• From List of Telugu films of 2014: Shameer Shaik. "Movies releasing this week - November 21, 2014". sakshipost.com. Retrieved 28 February 2015.

I apologize if any of the above are effectively identical; I am just a simple computer program, so I can't determine whether minor differences are significant or not. AnomieBOT⚡ 05:15, 23 March 2016 (UTC)

There are 12 more releases in malayalam in 2016. I can give the list Jinsjm (talk) 11:43, 16 January 2017 (UTC)

These are the films not included in the list of malayalam films of 2016. Celebrations -12/3/16 Sambar-25/3/16 Mission-11/7/16 Real fighter-29/7/16 Crayons-19/8/16 Aadam -30/9/16 The lovers-28/10/16 Athijeevanam-28/10/16 Girls-4/11/16 Elecktra-11/11/16 Munraoe thuruthu-11/11/16 Shivapuram-25/11/16 Neelima nalla kuttyaanu -16/12/16

    Jinsjm (talk) 10:25, 19 January 2017 (UTC)

Upcoming films

Continuation of a discussion started at my talk by @Nairspecht:
"Hi Charles! I have reverted your edits on this page due to the following two reasons:

• 1. As per WP:CRYSTAL, which you provided as a condition for your removal of content, "...events should be included only if the event is notable and almost certain to take place..." All films that you removed have been covered by verifiable and multiple sources and are almost certain to take place.
• 2. The idea of the sub-section list is to provide primary details about future films, which is valid as per WP:NFF.

You may raise your query in the article's talk page, but please do not revert the edit without reaching a consensus. Best," - User:Nairspecht

These were the edits ([1],[2],[3],[4],[5]) which Nairspecht instantly reverted.

• 1. First of all, how is an upcoming film (than even including announced, pre-production and filming films) is almost certain to take place ?. Sometimes even completed films are not released, some are kept unreleased forever. Most of the sources are from Nowrunning.com and Filmibeat.com, which are unreliable per WP:ICTF (and 2 poor sources from cinemapranthan.com and onlinepeeps.com) and some films are unsourced. Release dates are the most frequently changing and most unstable thing regarding an Indian film, especially a Malayalam film. And not all films in the list are 2016 films, let me take two examples of some "so called" announced films listed - Aadu 2 (ref) and CBI 5 (ref), the sources not even mention they are 2016 films and as per sources the writers have not even started writing the screenplays. There are lots of other films listed like this in the table. There is also a question about the order, in what chronology this upcoming films are listed.?

• 2. WP:NFF is about article creation. In the table, out of 49 films, 15 have release dates (including unreliable sources). In the remaining 34, only 6 films have their own articles. So how is WP:NFF applicable here. (Not to mention that, out of the 6, only one source mention it as a 2016 release).?

• 3.Next thing is about reverting this edit. The sentence is "....A comprehensive list of Malayalam movies that are in production is available from the official Malayalam Movies Database, Malayalasangeetham". This is a promotion, an external link of en.msidb.org (reliable ?) is placed on the content space and direct the readers to visit the site. And by these reverts ([6], [7]), you also removed the "citation needed" template I added to the unsourced contents.

In no way this upcoming film list and the reverts are justifiable. (@Cyphoidbomb: any thoughts ?)--Charles Turing (talk) 17:02, 24 August 2016 (UTC)

Hi Charles! Thank you for raising this here. Why is not an upcoming film almost certain to take place? I understand when you say that films could end up in development hell and may never be released. And I understand all your statements mentioned in point 1. But, that is the point of the list. Upcoming films which have received considerable coverage in the media. If not 2016, they will be continued in the list of 2017 (whenever that's created). If Nowrunning.com and Filmibeat.com are not verifiable sources, then we can possibly add better ones, if they are available. Coming to your second point: it doesn't mean that since better sources are not listed (as opposed to not available), it shouldn't be there. So, do you mean the list should only contain films which have their own articles? I don't understand. If so, we should remove the whole sub-section. How would you justify this article or latter parts of this then? If better sources are your only problem, give me a day or two. You may also argue that all films listed in the previous two articles have their own pages. Of course, that cannot be a reason. And coming back to your first point: you say that Malayalam films are highly unreliable when it comes to their release. Does it mean then that we should just do away with them, too? I understand there can be fluctuations regarding the release dates, but that shouldn't come in the way of it being listed here. Should it? In any case, we should start with studying the existe nce of such a sub-section. Why did it exist in the first place? What are the policies regarding lists? And I'm sorry regarding your third point. Other than the removal of the list of films, all your edits were justified. I reverted them because the script was showing an error that I couldn't undo that specific edit, don't know why. These edits were honestly not intended, but were just collateral victims. That Malayalasangeetham bit was added by Surabhy and I was struck down sometime in the past when I had tried to remove it. Conclusively, I think we should advocate addition of content in a neutral way especially when such lists are only purported to be informative and not promotional in any way. Best, Mr. Nair Talk 17:34, 24 August 2016 (UTC)

Showing other articles are not helpful here. See WP:OTHERSTUFFEXISTS. Also you missed a good point, all films in both the lists (other stuff) have started principal photography (just pick one). I don't know if you clearly understand what I said above. The WP:NFF was your point for the sub-section, only 6 films have their own articles, out of which only one have started filming, which means only one film comply with the WP:NFF policy, that is "Films that have not been confirmed by reliable sources to have commenced principal photography should not have their own articles" (films that started filming and not having an article can be excluded). And there is nothing called giving time in Wikipedia, unsourced, unreliably sourced, poorly sourced upcoming films will be deleted. No discussion or consensus is needed for that, does it? (without reliable sources, predicting upcoming events are against our policy, hence the WP:CRYSTAL). Also compare the sourcing of the other stuff you showed and the list here. Also I strongly urge to use only highly reliable sources for upcoming event, film or not. Charles Turing (talk) 19:22, 24 August 2016 (UTC)

I'm just taking examples here. Valid examples. And just like Cyphoidbomb has mentioned below about 2020 in film, there are countless other articles which have lists of films that have just been announced. I don't know what animosity, if at all, you have against this list. It's a fairly normal list of upcoming films. I understand your argument about NP:NFF, but this is not an article about one film. It's an article about hundreds of films with its most basic information that is sorted. And your statement about "giving time in Wikipedia" upsets me as a fellow Wikipedian. This is a community-driven encyclopedia largely edited by humans like you and me. So, "giving time" is essential here, especially since we are having this discussion. Again, to reiterate my point, let's advocate addition of content rather than removal of them (in the most basic sense of the words). Please see below for my take on a swift solution here. Best, Mr. Nair Talk 06:55, 25 August 2016 (UTC)

In a situation like this, I think it's always a good idea to 1) Check MOS:FILM to see if there is an existing guideline and 2) if not, to go to the largest discussion forum possible to get the best possible input, since we're talking about something that doesn't just affect this list of Malayalam films, rather, it affects a number of related list articles. WT:FILM would be a good place to discuss this to see if there is existing community preference. (Remember, Indian film articles are still under the scope of WikiProject Film...) Faisal Saif's For Adults Only was a planned venture that never went anywhere. I don't see anything specific about this at WP:FILMYEAR, but the issue of WP:NPP is a good one, regardless of whether it refers to the creation of articles or not. The spirit of the guideline is (as has been noted) that any planned film can get canceled, so why clutter up the encyclopedia? I think WP:CSC might provide some guidance here, but also from my editing experience I know that it's often unwise to include list items if there is no article for the item. If you have a list of notable people in an article like Moradabad (and I'm not saying that's a great section...) you wouldn't want every random person from Moradabad to add their names. You'd want some indication that the people are actually notable. Wikipedia is not a date planner--we're not here to plan our movie-watching four years down the line. I personally might err on the side of omitting planned projects. On the other hand we have 2020 in film. So in short, I don't know. I can see both sides of the coin here, and it seems the community doesn't object that much to the inclusion of future content. (However, I will also note that I've tried to discuss those lists articles before at WT:FILM and got no responses, so they may just not care about those articles.) Cyphoidbomb (talk) 04:04, 25 August 2016 (UTC)

Partially my point, yes. I think the best solution we have here is to clean up the list according to the basic guidelines i.e. remove titles that do not have reliable sources backing them. This can become slightly messy, so I will suggest we'll do this in parts. Best, Mr. Nair Talk 06:55, 25 August 2016 (UTC)

I don't know what animosity, if at all, you have against this list. It's a fairly normal list of upcoming films.: This list here cannot be compared with 2020 in film, those films have specific release dates and are reliably sourced as films scheduled for a release in 2020. The list here is too far away from it (that's why I earlier said you to compare with others). This list mentions a lot of planned projects, which does not cite it as a "scheduled 2016 release", this list is for Malayalam films of 2016, right.? In what chronology would you arrange planned projects ?. Mass removal is required for films that is not scheduled for 2016 release, and that have not started principal photography (films that has not started principal photography, but have scheduled dates and strong sources as like the entries in "2020 in film" can be included), challenged content about upcoming events cannot be allowed, WP:CRYSTAL. If you haven't read WP:CSC, list should satisfy, "Every entry meets the notability criteria for its own non-redirect article in the English Wikipedia", which is also parallel to what WP:NFF says.--Charles Turing (talk) 07:27, 25 August 2016 (UTC)

So, your issue is that these films do not have a steady release date unlike it's Hollywood counterparts. Well, in that case, I don't have a counter-argument. However, if we consider this as a reliable source, it has listings (with proposed release years) for almost all the films listed here. Films that have been listed under 2017 can be shifted to a new page. Best, Mr. Nair Talk 07:46, 25 August 2016 (UTC)

Don't know the reliability of en.msidb.org. It doesn't matter, as all entries in a list should be independently notable and sourced, again mentioning WP:NFF and WP:CSC (and WP:LISTVERIFY). About the chronology, see WP:SALORDER, which makes listing unscheduled films in vain. As I said in my above comments, per verifiability, all current entries are challenged and so it should be removed (WP:WONTWORK). Also, please don't misuse rollback right, the privilege will be compromised. Charles Turing (talk) 09:05, 25 August 2016 (UTC)

I wave a white flag here as it has become too nitty-gritty and pointless. Best, Mr. Nair Talk 10:25, 25 August 2016 (UTC)

Table style

In 'Released films' table, most of the 'Title' is in italics, but some are let out. Those are with Sl. No: 46, 60, 61, 62 & 63. Are there any special meaning for those entries ? Couldn't find any reference in the page. Or just typo ? — Preceding unsigned comment added by Dixoncx (talk • contribs) 10:56, 1 January 2017 (UTC)

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