Talk:Leslie Stuart

Birthdate

Find-A-Grave has a different birthdate. Lincher 03:46, 13 March 2006 (UTC)

According to the 1871 and 1881 census, he was born to Irish parents in 1863 in Southport though I can't find him registered there. In 1891 and 1901 (After he had changed his name) he has taken a couple of years off! Brakn (talk) 11:51, 22 July 2008 (UTC)

The Lamb biography is definitive and says 1865. -- Ssilvers (talk) 00:42, 12 August 2010 (UTC)

I guess the census must be wrong or maybe his parents forgot that he was really only six and not eight in 1871. Brakn (talk) 12:13, 1 September 2010 (UTC)

I beg your pardon. I was entirely wrong. Lamb discusses the issue at some length here. He says that even Stuart's daughter was not sure. He quotes Stuart as saying that his parents didn't think it was the census takers' business how old the children were. He said that his christening records were destroyed in a church fire. Lamb agrees that the 1881 census is the most reliable reference, and that the best evidence is that Stuart was born in 1863. -- Ssilvers (talk) 17:52, 1 September 2010 (UTC)

Is there any mention of what happened to his sisters Catherine, Agnes and Mary Ann? Brakn (talk) 18:12, 1 September 2010 (UTC)

Also his age is given as 66 when he died in 1928!! Brakn (talk) 06:30, 2 September 2010 (UTC)

Pen Names.

I don't think he had a brother called Lester. Brakn (talk) 11:53, 22 July 2008 (UTC)

Sorry, just found out that his brother Stephen did use the name Lester sometimes. Brakn (talk) 12:09, 22 July 2008 (UTC)

Written as "The Soldiers of the Queen" in the 1890's

There is a picture of sheet music distributed in Canada in 1898 entitled "The Soldiers of the Queen"; song words and music by Leslie Stuart. Ref: http://www.goldiproductions.com/angloboerwarmuseum/Boer93o5_sheet5_canada.html The reigning monarch of Great Britain during the 1890's when the song was written was Her Majesty, Queen Victoria. Why was this article changed to appear as if the work was originally entitled "Soldiers of the King". Clearly the name of the song was changed some time after the death of Queen Victoria. There is also a suggestion the music was originally written as a march to celebrate the opening of a canal -- is there any reference for this? —Preceding unsigned comment added by 58.170.185.230 (talk) 09:33, 8 November 2009 (UTC)

More on Stuart

Lamb's bio on Stuart is here on Google Books. It is only excerpts, but it seems that more than half the book is available there. Here is a good review of the book. The book is pretty expensive, but most university and research libraries have a copy. Feel free to take this article further. Here is a good series of materials on Stuart and Peggy. Best regards, -- Ssilvers (talk) 19:17, 1 September 2010 (UTC)

Family?

You mention a daughter and 'family problems'. But no names or dates of marriage. Valetude (talk) 22:15, 6 July 2017 (UTC)

Now added. -- Ssilvers (talk) 00:09, 7 July 2017 (UTC)

Elder brother

Stuart's elder brother, Stephen (1855–1924), became a music-hall performer, appearing under the stage name Lester Barrett. Gradually the music Stuart composed for local shows, and his popular ballads and music-hall songs began to supersede the composition of serious and religious music. He composed music hall songs as "T. A. Barrett" and under the pseudonyms "Leslie Thomas", "Lester Barrett" and, most notably, "Leslie Stuart".

Some confusion between the brothers here. They couldn’t both have been called Lester Barrett. (added by Valetude, 7 July 2017)

Please remember to sign your Talk page posts. The source states that they each used the pseudonym (made from each of their parents' last names) at some point. Probably the music hall songs he composed under that pseudonym were for his brother's act. But Stuart predominantly came to use the pseudonym "Leslie Stuart", under which he wrote all of his famous shows. -- Ssilvers (talk) 17:48, 7 July 2017 (UTC)

Thank you, Ssilver for notifying me about this most unusual arrangement. For this very reason, you ought to amend the story for the enlightenment of ordinary site-visitors like myself, who were unaware of such bizarre practices. And of course, I apologise for not signing my contribution - a rare oversight, as my file will confirm. Valetude (talk) 21:57, 7 July 2017 (UTC)

I'm not sure what you're suggesting, but you do not seem to be offering any well-referenced encyclopedic content. -- Ssilvers (talk) 03:00, 8 July 2017 (UTC)

W. Augustus Barratt

In an 1890s song book I found a couple of references to a composer/arranger called "W. Augustus Barratt". There is a WP redirection from that name to this article, which is well credible, but do we have a WP:RS of any sort for that identification? SamuelTheGhost (talk) 19:57, 5 November 2017 (UTC)

Stuart (whose birth name was Thomas Augustine Barrett) is supposed to have composed several things under that name, including a song from The Girl Behind the Counter. See this (#17) and this.

Compare that to this, which has an Augustus Barratt as musical director of shows such as The Sunshine Girl and The Quaker Girl, which were similar to the shows that Stuart composed. It may be that this musical director is actually another musician of the same era. See this, this.

Some compositions were written under "W. Augustus Barrett", with an "e" instead of an "a". see this and this and this. I would be grateful if you could try to chase this down! -- Ssilvers (talk) 21:12, 5 November 2017 (UTC)

Many thanks for this informative and surprising reply - my previous assumption of the situation was quite wrong. So there are two distinct musicians to discuss, the English T A Barrett with several pseudonyms and the Scottish W.. Augustus Barratt who used only that name. We need an article, if only a stub, about the latter. Then it remains only to allocate material to the right guy.

Any confusion between Barrattt and Barrett can be discounted as a typo. By contrast Augustus and Augustine are two different names and not interchangeable. In fact neither man is cited as using Augustine as a professional name, and Augustus is not given as a pseudonym for T A Barrett in the Leslie Stuart article or its sources. This means that sorting out which is which is straightforward, with just one exception, namely the authorship of the song in The Girl Behind the Counter. I think that this is just a mistake made by whoever created that source. If so we can either just omit it or find some way of recording our doubt. SamuelTheGhost (talk) 18:03, 6 November 2017 (UTC)

There is not only doubt about The Girl Behind the Counter, but I think there is still some doubt in the other direction as to whether Stuart had anything to do with The Little Michus, The Sunshine Girl, The Quaker Girl, Kitty Grey, etc. (at least their NY productions). These were Edwardian musical comedies; exactly the same genre of musicals that Stuart composed. It seems highly suspicious to me that Augustus Barr[a]tt could be composing/arranging/music directing the exact same genre of musical comedy as Stuart at the same time! Perhaps some of the work in this genre that is attributed to the Scot was actually Stuart using an alias when music directing/conducting in NYC after his composing career wound down? Or maybe the Scot purposely adopted a pseudonym similar to the older, more famous Stuart's real name? Maybe they were cousins -- even though Stuart's parents were from Ireland, Stuart is a Scottish name. Anyhow, thanks for raising the issue. -- Ssilvers (talk) 19:31, 6 November 2017 (UTC)