Talk:Lemurs' Park

Lemurs' Park has been listed as one of the Geography and places good articles under the good article criteria. If you can improve it further, please do so. If it no longer meets these criteria, you can reassess it.
Review: September 24, 2014. (Reviewed version).

This is the talk page for discussing improvements to the Lemurs' Park article.
This is not a forum for general discussion of the article's subject.

Put new text under old text. Click here to start a new topic.
New to Wikipedia? Welcome! Learn to edit; get help.

Article policies

Find sources: Google (books · news · scholar · free images · WP refs) · FENS · JSTOR · TWL

A fact from Lemurs' Park appeared on Wikipedia's Main Page in the Did you know column on 9 October 2014 (check views). The text of the entry was as follows:

Did you know... that one of the founders of Lemurs' Park near Antananarivo is the grandson of Pierre Boiteau, the Founding Director of the Tsimbazaza Zoo?

A record of the entry may be seen at Wikipedia:Recent additions/2014/October. The nomination discussion and review may be seen at Template:Did you know nominations/Lemurs' Park.

Wikipedia

Articles for creation

	This article was reviewed by member(s) of WikiProject Articles for creation. The project works to allow users to contribute quality articles and media files to the encyclopedia and track their progress as they are developed. To participate, please visit the project page for more information.Articles for creationWikipedia:WikiProject Articles for creationTemplate:WikiProject Articles for creationAfC articles
	This article was accepted on 5 September 2014 by reviewer Coin945 (talk · contribs).

Africa: Madagascar Low‑importance

	Africa portal This article is within the scope of WikiProject Africa, a collaborative effort to improve the coverage of Africa on Wikipedia. If you would like to participate, please visit the project page, where you can join the discussion and see a list of open tasks.AfricaWikipedia:WikiProject AfricaTemplate:WikiProject AfricaAfrica articles
Low	This article has been rated as Low-importance on the project's importance scale.
	Madagascar portal This article is supported by WikiProject Madagascar (assessed as Low-importance).

Zoo

This article is within the scope of WikiProject Zoo, a collaborative effort to improve the coverage of topics related to zoos, aquaria, and aviaries on Wikipedia. If you would like to participate, please visit the project page, where you can join the discussion and see a list of open tasks.ZooWikipedia:WikiProject ZooTemplate:WikiProject ZooZoo articles

GA Review

This review is transcluded from Talk:Lemurs' Park/GA1. The edit link for this section can be used to add comments to the review.

Reviewer: Lemurbaby (talk · contribs) 00:57, 24 September 2014 (UTC)[reply]

Is it reasonably well written?
A. Prose quality:

B. MoS compliance for lead, layout, words to watch, fiction, and lists:
Is it factually accurate and verifiable?
A. References to sources:

B. Citation of reliable sources where necessary:

C. No original research:
Is it broad in its coverage?
A. Major aspects:

B. Focused:
Is it neutral?
Fair representation without bias:
Is it stable?
No edit wars, etc:
Does it contain images to illustrate the topic?
A. Images are copyright tagged, and non-free images have fair use rationales:

B. Images are provided where possible and appropriate, with suitable captions:
Overall:
Pass or Fail:

Comments

- I will be reviewing this article shortly. Hi, Maky - great to see you coming back to the Mada articles again. I've been beefing up the List of National Parks of Mada article the last few weeks, and hope to start working on the articles for the parks themselves. This park should be added to the list under private parks. - Lemurbaby (talk) 00:57, 24 September 2014 (UTC)[reply]

Thank you for taking the time to do this review! It's good to interact with you again! – Maky ^« talk » 08:10, 24 September 2014 (UTC)[reply]

In the infobox, it is noted there are 9 lemur species. Please also reference the other types of animals there - maybe "numerous endemic reptile, amphibian and other species" or something similar.

Before I do, I should note that my sources are very vague about these reptile species. No numbers are given, and the sources only seem to mention them in passing when noting the existence of the vivarium. It could be as few as 3 or 4 species for all I know. – Maky ^« talk » 08:10, 24 September 2014 (UTC)[reply]

I only recall seeing turtles in July SurreyJohn (Talk) 09:24, 24 September 2014 (UTC)[reply]

Let's leave it as is, and improve later if other sources come available. - Lemurbaby (talk) 11:11, 24 September 2014 (UTC)[reply]

Any chance you can find the total number of lemurs at the park?

In all honesty, I suspect this number fluctuates regularly. Between my sources, which cover 2010 to 2013, it was reported they had 8 or 9 species, and one of those 9 mentioned species (a diademed sifaka, represented by a single individual) appears to have been replaced by a nocturnal species not named by any source. Between their breeding program, handling very specialized lemurs, and the difficulties of taking in former exotic pets, I'm sure it would be hard to pin such a number down, even with an estimate. Either way, no sources even attempt an estimate. – Maky ^« talk » 08:10, 24 September 2014 (UTC)[reply]

Let's leave it as is, and improve later if other sources come available. - Lemurbaby (talk) 11:11, 24 September 2014 (UTC)[reply]

Conservation: "helped plant 170 native trees" - trees, or tree species? Seems a lot of hands to plant so few trees. The next sentence mentions 11,000 trees planted. Could you clarify this section?

The source on this confused me a bit as well. It reads (translated): "During the rainy season, more than 170 native trees (Terminalia, rosewood, amontana ...) were planted by each class by carefully following the advice of the park's gardeners." (original: "Durant la saison des pluies, plus de 170 arbres endémiques (terminalia , palissandre, amontana ...) ont été plantés par chaque classe en suivant scrupuleusement les conseils des jardiniers du parc.") I'm not certain if that means that each class planted 170 trees each or if each of the 170 visiting classes planted a tree. It's probably the former... so you're probably right. But what do you think? – Maky ^« talk » 08:10, 24 September 2014 (UTC)[reply]

I read the source and I suspect the author isn't being precise. My guess is 170 plant species, and 11,000 plants (not all trees). Alternatively, 170 trees planted and 11,000 plants (including trees). but since we can't be sure, and since the info is contradicted elsewhere on the same website (albeit from older info - the website dates to 2012, and this environmental ed program was running through 2013 when the article was written), let's leave it as is and hope to improve it with additional references. - Lemurbaby (talk) 11:11, 24 September 2014 (UTC)[reply]

There's another source (from Colas) that states: "During the last leg of the visit, the children plant an endemic tree (366 trees planted so far)..." So it sounds like the classes each plants one tree... though the numbers are confusing since this source says 366 (in 2011) and the other says 170 (in 2012). Oh well... hopefully SurreyJohn can convince them to update their website. – Maky ^« talk » 18:24, 24 September 2014 (UTC)[reply]

I made a couple other minor edits. Everything else looks good to go. I'm sure it's not easy to find references or content on this park, and you've covered all the most important points for an article of this type. Great work. Fingers crossed you might be enticed to do similar work on Isalo, Ranomafana, Andringitra, Ankarana or any of the other protected areas in Mada... - Lemurbaby (talk) 01:40, 24 September 2014 (UTC)[reply]

I'd love to... though I'm probably first going to be devoting my writing time for the next few months to a couple of lemur research articles I've been fighting to get published for the last 4 years. I'm also wanting to writing a book about my research and lemur work. Maybe when I need breaks I'll come write an article. But as you know, with me there's no such thing as "a little bit of work". I'm a WikiDragon, and when I stir, pages get completely overhauled and sent to straight to GAN... and sometimes FAC. I'm sure those parks have just as much information about them as Marojejy National Park did... so that would be a lot of work, each. Anyway, I will always come back to Wikipedia to write about lemurs. I just need a bit more time... partly for the aforementioned work, and especially to heal after the way the zoo and lemur communities have treated me professionally. – Maky ^« talk » 08:10, 24 September 2014 (UTC)[reply]

I should add that the parks location is much closer to west than southwest of Tana (see location a map), and to note its midway between Tana and the airport is useful additional information for tourists planning to visit, so should have been left in. I realise the reference says southwest, but its more important information is accurate than copying an error. SurreyJohn (Talk) 09:24, 24 September 2014 (UTC)[reply]

Thanks for your work on this, both. I'll pass it now. - Lemurbaby (talk) 11:11, 24 September 2014 (UTC)[reply]

Thanks Lemurbaby for the review! Also, SurreyJohn, I double-checked my sources and none mention the airport and all say southwest (which can include west-southwest and west by south). For the former, it might be good to contact Lemurs' Park (through their website) and ask them to update their website with the host of things we wanted clarified or mentioned (including mention of the airport). Just tell them that we've been using their website as a source for a high-quality Wikipedia article. In the case of the latter, I suspect that following RN1 is all that most tourists need to worry about. – Maky ^« talk » 18:14, 24 September 2014 (UTC)[reply]

I dont agree with you SW or WSW directions, but I was wrong about the airport. Ivato International Airport is north of Tana, so it's a moot point!
Do you want to follow up with the email or shall I? Also, if they provide more details by email can that be used as verification? I feel my work on this page is done now, I've achieved my goal, and I would like to thank you for your efforts. We may not have agreed on all the detail, but I'm sure we both agree that this is now a really good article. Thanks. SurreyJohn (Talk) 11:10, 25 September 2014 (UTC)[reply]

Thanks. Unfortunately, private emails are not reliable sources. However, if you can convince them to update their website, we can use the website as a reliable source. – Maky ^« talk » 17:24, 25 September 2014 (UTC)[reply]