Talk:Lancelot Barrington-Ward

A fact from Lancelot Barrington-Ward appeared on Wikipedia's Main Page in the Did you know column on 16 July 2019 (check views). The text of the entry was as follows:

Did you know... that Sir Lancelot Barrington-Ward performed surgery on Prince Albert, who later became King George VI?

A record of the entry may be seen at Wikipedia:Recent additions/2019/July. The nomination discussion and review may be seen at Template:Did you know nominations/Lancelot Barrington-Ward.

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The following is an archived discussion of the DYK nomination of the article below. Please do not modify this page. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as this nomination's talk page, the article's talk page or Wikipedia talk:Did you know), unless there is consensus to re-open the discussion at this page. No further edits should be made to this page.

The result was: promoted by Cwmhiraeth (talk) 06:34, 11 July 2019 (UTC)[reply]

Lancelot Barrington-Ward

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... that Sir Lancelot Barrington-Ward won four England rugby union caps while still a medical student? Source: "In 1910 he played four times for England, playing in the very first International match played at the new stadium at Twickenham. Source: Lancelot Edward Barrington-Ward.
- ALT1:... that Sir Lancelot Barrington-Ward removed the appendix of Prince Albert, later King George VI? Source: "...in 1918 he operated on the then Prince Albert (later King George VI) for appendicitis." Source: Plarr's Lives.
- ALT2:... that Sir Lancelot Barrington-Ward performed an appendicectomy (appendectomy) on Prince Albert, later King George VI? Source: "...in 1918 he operated on the then Prince Albert (later King George VI) for appendicitis." Source: Plarr's Lives.

Reviewed: HMS Imperieuse (1805)

5x expanded by Iainmacintyre (talk). Self-nominated at 16:56, 8 June 2019 (UTC).[reply]

Conciesly written account of a life full of incident. Free from copyvio and neutrally written. Intresting hook. Newly written and meets length requirements. Three great hooks, but I like the original. Image is claimed fair use to to subjects death, it is small in size. Brilliantly cited. No Swan So Fine (talk) 12:12, 9 June 2019 (UTC)[reply]

Many thanks, @No Swan So Fine: for that review and your comments. Papamac (talk) 15:00, 9 June 2019 (UTC)[reply]

Promoting ALT1 because I am not sure he was still a medical student in 1910. Cwmhiraeth (talk) 06:34, 11 July 2019 (UTC)[reply]

Doubts have now been raised about whether he did indeed remove Prince Albert's appendix. As a result of the following discussion it seems certain that he did not and that the 2 cited sources were for some reason mistaken. I have aamended accordingly. Papamac (talk) 08:35, 17 July 2019 (UTC)[reply]

"I love DYK, but sometimes wonder about... things. So I start from the DYK entry for Lancelot Barrington-Ward with its hook that Sir Lancelot Barrington-Ward removed the appendix of Prince Albert ... and read the article. Didn't know Albert had an appendectomy, so link off to George VI and get to George_VI#Military_career_and_education which in the second paragraph informs me that his appendix was removed by John Marnoch. and find in section John_Marnoch#Operation_on_the_Duke_of_York Marnoch performed an appendectomy on Albert ... So, friends, who was that masked surgeon? Shenme (talk) 03:56, 16 July 2019 (UTC)

@Shenme: your comment underscores the "extra step" that page creators need to take, and DYK reviewers should check: to follow through on subjects linked in the article and especially the hook, checking that the same information is included in the linked source. Pinging @Iainmacintyre: and @No Swan So Fine: re this hook. Yoninah (talk) 11:10, 16 July 2019 (UTC)

@Shenme: @No Swan So Fine: @Yoninah: What an interesting discovery after some impressive detective work. I used 2 sources for this information. Plarr's Lives and B-W's BMJ obituary, both of which state that Barrington-Ward performed the procedure in 1918. As Plarr's is derivative I imagine that they simply lifted the information from the BMJ. There is no mention of the operation in B-W's DNB entry. I have to say that I find the account on the Aberdeen Med-Chi website much more convincing. It describes in some detail Prince Albert's journey from Collingwood to Aberdeen, giving the year as 1914, and describes post-operative telegrams to King Edward VII. On checking Lamont-Brown's Royal Poxes and Potions p227 I found that the operation took place in Aberdeen on 9 Sept 1914 and was performed by Marnoch. Sir John Reid was in attendance and wrote the official bulletin. There is no mention of B-W. Could he have been present at the procedure, as he would have had time to travel from London while the Prince was heading for Aberdeen? That seems highly unlikely as he had only been appointed assistant surgeon at Great Ormond Street that year. I'm in no doubt now that Plarr's and the BMJ were wrong. Marnoch was the surgeon and I'll amend the article accordingly. Many thanks for pointing this out. Papamac (talk) 14:59, 16 July 2019 (UTC)"