Talk:Kwon Yu-ri/Archive 1

Archive 1

Move discussion in progress

There is a move discussion in progress on Talk:Jessica Jung which affects this page. Please participate on that page and not in this talk page section. Thank you. —RM bot 13:45, 11 June 2010 (UTC)

Move discussion in progress

There is a move discussion in progress on Talk:Jessica (entertainer) which affects this page. Please participate on that page and not in this talk page section. Thank you. —RM bot 19:30, 4 July 2010 (UTC)

Name

She is generally known as Yuri. As stated at the beginning of the article, Kwon is the family name. Therefore I'm editing all the parts of the article where she is referred to as just Kwon to Yuri. If anyone disagrees with this, feel free to revert, but I think it makes more sense this way. Jakjawagon (talk) 21:58, 29 August 2010 (UTC)

If her stage name is Yuri, then the page should not be at Kwon Yuri, hence my previous arguments. However, since it's where it is right now, she should be referred by her last name. SKS (talk) 06:54, 30 August 2010 (UTC)

Yes but the name Yuri (disambiguation) is taken on Wikipedia, so it only makes sense to use her full stage name which is Kwon Yuri. Please compare Yuri to Kwon Yuri using a Google search to see which name is most common. 189.17.16.130 (talk) 08:44, 2 September 2010 (UTC)

I don't think that this google name comparison works here, because Yuri lists all Yuris, but Kwon Yuri lists all sites with Kwon and Yuri in it, so also sites that feature Kwon Boa etc. --Dr. Crisp (talk) 11:56, 2 September 2010 (UTC)

If you use the advanced search then Yuri is more popular. Yuri Kwon Yuri --Dr. Crisp (talk) 12:01, 2 September 2010 (UTC)

Yuri	Kwon Yuri
Yuri 112,000,000 results	Kwon Yuri 84,900 results
yuri snsd 84,200 results	kwon yuri snsd 61,500 results
yuri girls generation 59,000 results	kwon yuri girls generation 50,200 results
유리 13,000,000 results	권유리 1,110,000 results
유리 소녀시대 855,000 results	권유리 소녀시대 268,000 results

Actually, I would rather refer to their official websites, where she is just called Yuri [1] [2] + the official Invincible Youth webpage. --Dr. Crisp (talk) 12:42, 2 September 2010 (UTC)]

That's if you use the "Advanced Search". The first 3 pages of Yuri do not show anything related to the Korean singer Kwon Yuri. So those results aren't accurate. The point is you are more likely to find more on her faster when you use Kwon Yuri and again Yuri (disambiguation) is already taken on Wikipedia, so it makes better sense to use her full stage name (which is also very common). 189.17.16.130 (talk) 15:51, 2 September 2010 (UTC)

What matters is what reliable sources use. If in general a reliable source article about her uses ONLY "Yuri" like an article about Madonna will only use "Madonna" and not once "Madonnca Ciccone" or an article about Prince will only use "Prince" and not once use "Prince Rogers Nelson". If you can show that it is standard practice of reliable sources, then that is what we use. hence our articles "Prince (entertainer)" and "Madonna (entertainer)".Active Banana ( ^bananaphone 21:11, 2 September 2010 (UTC)

You do know that Madonna Ciccone is here real name same for Prince. Kwon Yuri is her full stage name. And look http://www.kwonyuri125.com/ and http://kwonyuri.com/. Here are news articles Hankooki and Newsen. But I am also basing this on what Wikipedia has as well not just news articles. Wikipedia does not have the available name space for Yuri so Kwon Yuri (full stage name) would be better as next best name, as it is just as popular as her first name Yuri. 189.17.16.130 (talk) 21:35, 2 September 2010 (UTC)

All sites of Kwon Yuri#references (this article sources) call her just Yuri. The hankooki site you referring to has just "Yuri" in the headline and write in the article "유리(본명 권유리)" -> Yuri (birthname Kwon Yuri). She is generally called only Yuri: Segye Korea Star Daily, Korea Times, Sportsseoul only a few sites mention her full additionally in brackets. For the Newsen site, which calls her "Kwon Yuri" in headline, Ihave to say that this is the first article I saw that feature her full name. But within the article it's only "Yuri".

Google News results:
Kwon Yuri So Nyeo Shi Dae = 0 [3]
Kwon Yuri = 1 [4]
Yuri So Nyu Shi Dae = 224 [5]
Yuri = 2426 [6] --Dr. Crisp (talk) 22:05, 2 September 2010 (UTC)

I will chime in here and say I really dislike reading "Kwon" in this article. She is known to fans and everyone by her stage name Yuri. Sometimes even "Kwon Yuri" to distinguish from other Yuri's. But never as "Kwon" only. Artists like Rihanna and Lady Gaga have pages which reflect their common stage name - so why not Yuri? Evaders99 (talk) 06:17, 25 February 2011 (UTC)

Singer-songwriter?

As far as I know, she only wrote the lyrics for Mistake, but not the melody. But in the Wikipedia article for singer-songwriter, it states that singer-songwriters are "musicians who write, compose and sing their own musical material including lyrics and melodies." Mistake was composed by Cheryl Yie and Jean Na (as stated in the album info section of the group's website), therefore Yuri didn't compose it, but only wrote the lyrics. So I think Yuri being a singer-songwriter is questionable. As also mentioned in the singer-songwriter article, "a number of other well-known musicians may write some of their own songs, but are usually called singers instead," and Yuri is considered more of a singer since she wrote lyrics to only one song (as of now). Regards, Ellysse ♥ (talk) 16:41, 1 February 2011 (UTC)

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File:Yuri Girls Generation Tour in Seoul 2011.jpg Nominated for speedy Deletion

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Requested move: Yuri (South Korean singer) → Kwon Yuri

The following discussion is an archived discussion of the proposal. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made in a new section on the talk page. No further edits should be made to this section.

No consensus to move. Vegaswikian (talk) 06:28, 19 December 2011 (UTC)

Yuri (South Korean singer) → Kwon Yuri – The proposed form removes a nasty three-word disambiguator, and also puts this Korean singer's name in a more conventional format. Fans may call celebrities by their given names, but full names remain appropriate usage in more formal situations. On her Web site, her profile is entitled "All about Kwon Yuri". Her KBS profile gives her as "Kwon Yoo-ri". So it is hardly unusual to see her family name given. Kauffner (talk) 02:52, 12 December 2011 (UTC) Here are the relevant guidelines, although these must be adjusted for the fact that Korean names are conventionally given with the "last name" first:

• To avoid the use of parenthetical disambiguation, "choose a different, alternative name that the subject is also commonly called in English, albeit, not as commonly as the preferred but ambiguous title." (WP:PRECISION).
• "don't use a first name (even if unambiguous) for an article title if the last name is known and fairly often used," (WP:NCP) Kauffner (talk) 20:28, 11 December 2011 (UTC)

Survey

• Oppose: None of the SNSD members use their surnames professionally, for one thing. Yes, she was born "Kwon Yuri", but she's rarely referred to that way in public — Korean news media refer to her as simply Yuri. Instead of using surnames, they say "SNSD's Yuri" or "Cool's Yuri" to differentiate between the two Yuris. That website you gave is not her official site, but a fanpage. SM's page here simply lists "Yuri". This may not be logical, but this is Wikipedia convention: see pages on Madonna (entertainer), Usher (entertainer), Mario (entertainer), Eve (entertainer), Jewel (singer), and many others. SKS (talk) 05:14, 12 December 2011 (UTC)

Discussion

The "We Love Yuri" site is professionally produced, so I assume it is her official fan site. Pretty much every celebrity is referred to by some sort of short form or given name. The guidelines give the example of Oprah Winfrey, who is not at Oprah, although that moniker is probably more common. On Google News, English-language references to this subject as "Yuri" are restricted almost entirely to the allkpop site. In Wiki-lingo, a parenthetical disambiguator indicates a secondary topic. That Madonna and company get them is not some sort of honor. It is because many editors don't think such pop culture figures "deserve" primary topic status, even when the number of readers interested in them is quite high. Kauffner (talk) 03:01, 13 December 2011 (UTC)

Many fan sites are "professionally produced", whether that's Korean or English, so that's irrelevant. When the last move discussion came up, there was a Google search result list that was compiled, and it's clear that "소녀시대 유리" (Girls' Generation Yuri) is most predominantly used. If we're going by English results, "Yuri" includes more results than "Kwon Yuri", especially when removing blogs such as Soompi and Allkpop. Again, this page move goes against Wikipedia conventions. All of the Girls' Generation members go by their first names professionally. News media refers to them by their given names. Yuri's last name is rarely used. As such, the page should be under the first name, with a clarifier in brackets. I don't mean to be rude or anything, so please don't read that into my comments, but pages moves are somewhat common for this page, and it all boils down to the fact that she doesn't use her surname professionally, and if she doesn't, then neither will Wikipedia. This may not seem logical, but as indicated in my examples above, it's established. If she starts doing activities under her full name, then it would be a different case, but until then.... Also, Korean Wikipedia lists her as Yuri (but apparently they disambiguate based on birth year). SKS (talk) 04:50, 13 December 2011 (UTC)

If there is anything new here, I missed it. So, from the top: WP:NCP says, "don't use a first name...for an article title if the last name is known and fairly often used". There is nothing in the guidelines about whether a subject, "uses her surname professionally." There are thousands and thousands of bios on the Wiki, and the overwhelming majority have titles a conventional given-name-plus-surname format. It's Ozzy Osbourne, even though just plain "Ozzy" is more common. Is Yuri as well-known as Ozzy? What about Ludwig van Beethoven and the many others who are most commonly referred to by surname only? Kauffner (talk) 05:46, 13 December 2011 (UTC)

From WP:COMMONNAME: Wikipedia does not necessarily use the subject's "official" name as an article title; it prefers to use the name that is most frequently used to refer to the subject in English-language reliable sources. As I've showed, in this case (and the examples I give), the mononym is by far most commonly used. Also, please see WP:CONSENSUS. This page's name has been debated many times in its history; consensus has dictated that it stay under this title. As an aside, I noticed that Hyuna's article is back at Hyuna. SKS (talk) 06:27, 16 December 2011 (UTC)

The above discussion is preserved as an archive of the proposal. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made in a new section on this talk page. No further edits should be made to this section.

editsemiprotected request

Please revert the following - [7] - unreferenced. This is exactly why the article was semi-protected yesterday - [8]. All other edits made today by User:Forestlicious have been reverted for the same reason. 92.40.225.117 (talk) 20:04, 2 January 2012 (UTC)

Already done by Jim1138 (talk · contribs). Thank you for keeping an eye on the page. --Bryce (talk | contribs) 02:13, 3 January 2012 (UTC)

File:Kwonyuri.jpg Nominated for speedy Deletion

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File:Fashion Queen Yuri.jpg Nominated for speedy Deletion

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File:Yuri 2012x.jpg Nominated for speedy Deletion

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Requested move

The following discussion is an archived discussion of a requested move. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made in a new section on the talk page. No further edits should be made to this section.

The result of the move request was: moved. Jenks24 (talk) 12:19, 12 June 2012 (UTC)

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Yuri (South Korean singer) → Kwon Yuri –I open this renaming discussion again as I think that this article should be renamed to Kwon Yuri. Most of Girl's Generation members are given in this style and per WP:NCP. And Yuri is also a Korean name Morning Sunshine (talk) 12:08, 4 June 2012 (UTC)

Survey

• Support. Before anyone claims that the current title is the subject's stage name, I note that she recently appeared on the TV drama Fashion King credited in the form proposed above. Here is her credit on the show's site. (Click "Character" and then the fourth profile picture.) She is also given by full name for her 2007 cameo in the sitcom Unstoppable Wedding, in her KBS profile, and on her fan site. The current three-word parenthetical disambiguator is most awkward. To avoid this monstrosity, we may "choose a different, alternative name that the subject is also commonly called in English, albeit, not as commonly as the preferred but ambiguous title," per WP:PRECISION. In addition, the full name is certainly "known and fairly often used," as stipulated by WP:NCP. Kauffner (talk) 04:02, 5 June 2012 (UTC)

The above discussion is preserved as an archive of a requested move. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made in a new section on this talk page. No further edits should be made to this section.

Signature in infobox

I've seen this on several K-pop artists' pages, and am wondering if it is really necessary. There is not a signature field in the musical artist infobox, and I don't think a signature should be in the website field. It seems like Template:Infobox person should be used instead.

Examples:

Infobox person with musical artist module

Kwon Yuri
Born	(1989-12-05) December 5, 1989 Goyang, Gyeonggi, South Korea
Occupation(s)	Singer-songwriter, actress
Years active	2006–present
Musical career
Origin	South Korea
Genres	K-pop, dance
Instrument(s)	Vocals, violin, piano, guitar
Labels	S.M. Entertainment
Website	Girls' Generation
Signature

Infobox person with musical artist and Korean name modules

Kwon Yuri
Born	(1989-12-05) December 5, 1989 Goyang, Gyeonggi, South Korea
Occupation(s)	Singer-songwriter, actress
Years active	2006–present
Musical career
Origin	South Korea
Genres	K-pop, dance
Instrument(s)	Vocals, violin, piano, guitar
Labels	S.M. Entertainment
Korean name
Hangul	권유리
Hanja	權俞利
Revised Romanization	Gwon Yu-ri
McCune–Reischauer	Kwŏn Yuri
Website	Girls' Generation
Signature

I wouldn't mind if the Korean name infobox was on its own (not a child module) because it changes the margin widths and doesn't always look good. --Random86 (talk) 00:53, 2 December 2014 (UTC)

I've been trying to improve Girls' Generation's pages in recent days, and I have noticed the same thing. I wanted to remove the signatures altogether because I don't find them necessary, but then because it was only according to my own preference, so I haven't changed anything and left them like that.

Agree with the "Korean name infobox" as well. They look better separately, if no one disagrees, we'll change it back.--TerryAlex (talk) 01:12, 2 December 2014 (UTC)

Glad to see you agree on the signatures. I thought you wanted Yuri's signature in the infobox because you put in back after I moved it (at least, I think you did). Signatures definitely shouldn't be in the musical artist infobox so I'm going to remove them and other editors can put them somewhere else in the articles if they think it is necessary (e.g. Jessica Jung).

I am the main editor who made Infobox Korean name a child module on K-pop pages. I have come to the conclusion that the infoboxes look better separately, so feel free to separate them. --Random86 (talk) 01:48, 2 December 2014 (UTC)

It was because I saw other GG's pages having the signatures in the infoboxes, so I was trying to make all pages look uniform, but I actually didn't like seeing the signatures there. So Thank you so much for removing them. Thanks for fixing the grammatical errors as well.--TerryAlex (talk) 02:28, 2 December 2014 (UTC)

Requested move 20 November 2016

The following is a closed discussion of a requested move. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made in a new section on the talk page. Editors desiring to contest the closing decision should consider a move review. No further edits should be made to this section.

The result of the move request was: Moved (non-admin closure) Fuortu (talk) 14:26, 27 November 2016 (UTC)

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Kwon Yuri → Kwon Yu-ri – I'm requesting this move to be in consistency with Korean naming convention on Wikipedia. TerryAlex (talk) 02:23, 20 November 2016 (UTC)

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The above discussion is preserved as an archive of a requested move. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made in a new section on this talk page or in a move review. No further edits should be made to this section.

Removal of dating news

I started a discussion about this topic here. Please help to discuss. Thank you.--TerryAlex (talk) 14:32, 19 January 2017 (UTC)

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