Talk:Kurt Cobain/Archive 5

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Genre

Im adding Punk Rock to his Genre's since he was in a Punk band called Fecal Matter and was a Punk. 81.96.254.143 (talk) 21:32, 8 November 2009 (UTC)

I agree. While Nirvana should be regarded as a grunge band, Cobain himself was a punk musician, before the grunge genre was specifically defined. Punk should be included in the genre's of his infobox, in the same way hardcore punk is included in Dave Grohl's for his work in Scream. Sir Richardson (talk) 21:58, 8 November 2009 (UTC)

It's hard to define some of these definitions, sub genres of rock and music. Metal rock glam rock could be hair metal. In Cobain's case both grunge & punk rock fits, but Nirvana itself is grunge!

No not Nirvana itself but who removed it? sombody removed Punk from this section? he was in the Punk Rock band Fecal Matter and they were Punk Rock. Megabar09 (talk) 14:19, 30 November 2009 (UTC)

Oh, somebody removed punk rock! Anyway, I'm pretty sure that Nirvana had some hardcore punk songs. And Kurt Cobain is considered punk my the punk "community". —Preceding unsigned comment added by 212.71.91.63 (talk) 19:34, 27 June 2010 (UTC)

If songs like Territorial Pissings aren't punk songs then what is? Cobain himself even called his second album "Punk rock gold". I forgot where I read or heard that quote, but I'm sure you can find it if you look. If not ask me and I'll find it for you. My email is fukshtpss@gmail.com 77.97.78.44 (talk) 00:56, 20 September 2010 (UTC) —Preceding unsigned comment added by 77.97.78.44 (talk) 00:30, 20 September 2010 (UTC)

"There is no reliable source categorically considering Kurt Cobain with Nirvana to be a punk rock band"..What? But Cobain wasn't only in Nirvana. This is the Kurt Cobain article, not the Nirvana one. I'm adding punk rock back. And I'm going to search for a source too.--Revilal90 (talk) 01:54, 8 January 2011 (UTC)

In an interview, Kurt said they were more of a "Sub-Pop sound". Wath this video. http://www.youtube.com/embed/7WRjnZwL658 http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/User:Childress293133

• I don't think that would qualify as a reliable source though. A genre being red-linked is always a good clue that it isn't a real one too. --John (talk) 23:30, 14 February 2011 (UTC)

Alias

Kurdt Cobain? Surely that is a mistake right?96.246.52.215 (talk) 14:35, 16 June 2010 (UTC)

No he called himself that sometimes :) —Preceding unsigned comment added by 92.28.34.180 (talk) 16:40, 23 June 2010 (UTC)

wasn't it Kurdt Kobain? --Connelly90[AlbaGuBràth] (talk) 13:12, 30 August 2010 (UTC)

Yeah I've seen it with the two K's. It is even printed like that on the back of at least one album. Although he may have used Kurdt Cobain as well. 77.97.78.44 (talk) 00:57, 20 September 2010 (UTC) —Preceding unsigned comment added by 77.97.78.44 (talk) 00:44, 20 September 2010 (UTC)

He used the Kurdt Cobain version on the Bleach album. I think Chad Channing and Krist Novoselic may have done a different spelling of their names too. (Childress293133 (talk) 00:02, 15 February 2011 (UTC))

On Kurt and Courtney, they went to a club or bar and found a place that he signed. It said Curt Cobain, but I'm not 100% sure that it WAS him. (Childress293133 (talk) 00:02, 15 February 2011 (UTC))

Influences

Kurt Cobain was hugely influenced by The Beatles especially John Lennon. —Preceding unsigned comment added by Jongudni (talk • contribs) 20:43, 1 July 2010 (UTC)

Kurt Cobain also played the drums. It may not say that on this page but it is a fact that he played the drums. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 71.175.208.188 (talk) 07:14, 10 July 2010 (UTC)

Wasn't the drums his prefered instrument originally (i.e. When he was a kid) before he had a guitar? I may be wrong I'm just asking; I'm sure I read that somewhere before --Connelly90[AlbaGuBràth] (talk) 13:36, 20 August 2010 (UTC)

He also played bass on the Sappy-song, as well on many of his early demos. bit.ly/bs3OgX --User:Marnches 22:38, 18 November 2010.

Book Kurt Cobain by Christopher Sandford states that:

the book "Kurt Cobain" by Christopher Sandford states that Kurt was born at Grays Harbor Community hospital in Hoquiam Washington not Aberdeen. 108.1.241.94 (talk) 05:10, 20 July 2010 (UTC)AJK

It also says that he was full blooded irish on his father's side108.1.241.94 (talk) 05:12, 20 July 2010 (UTC)

is noone going to take these into consideration at all? 108.1.241.94 (talk) 03:51, 26 July 2010 (UTC)

If one source says one thing and all the rest say another, we generally go with the "many" side. Tarc (talk) 11:57, 26 July 2010 (UTC)

From what little i've read of this book it shouldn't be considered a reliable source Jack Endino a producer of Nirvana's early work has called it "pure fiction". —Preceding unsigned comment added by 70.134.73.17 (talk) 03:25, 6 August 2010 (UTC)

the book is not fiction its biography and the author did all his own research and interviewed members of the cobain family —Preceding unsigned comment added by 108.1.241.94 (talk) 06:02, 11 August 2010 (UTC)

It's officialy a biography, but many books about Cobain's life have been so full of discrepancies that they are quite unreliable. Cobain himself used to tell a lot of lies to make his life seem either more exciting or more challenging (see the "guns in the river" story) he even said that himself. and whats to say people close to him knew the truth or didn't gloss over a lot of the facts to make it seem like Cobain was more presentable, he was a Heroin addict after all.--Connelly90[AlbaGuBràth] (talk) 09:46, 1 September 2010 (UTC)

fuck the beatles!! he was actually more influenced by punk rock bands in his time and the ones he would talk to like REM and The Melvins

wrong section? lol plus saying "fuck the beatles" then going on to praise any kind of rock band is a bit of an oxymoron; most of the newer guitar bands (ie 80s-2000s) can be traced back to influence by the Beatles. Listen to "Helter Skelter" you'll get the idea. --Connelly90[AlbaGuBràth] (talk) 09:46, 1 September 2010 (UTC)

There IS no Grays Harbor Community Hospital in Hoquiam, Washington: The hospital of that name is (only) in Aberdeen, Washington: http://www.ghchwa.org/index.php?page=about-us (See also http://www.ghchwa.org/index.php?page=contact-us). That is always where it has been (and btw, "Community" is a non-optional part of its name; it is not "Grays Harbor Hospital"). ThunkingOutLoud (talk) 05:14, 14 September 2010 (UTC)

Edit request from Jayeffnz, 13 August 2010

{{editsemiprotected}} In the section titled 'Nirvana', a sentence in the second-last paragraph needs editing to correct a grammar issue. Sentence reads: He began to harbour resentments for people claiming to be fans of the band, yet refused to acknowledge, or misinterpreted, the band's social and political views. Correction should be: He began to harbour resentments for people claiming to be fans of the band yet refusing to acknowledge, or misinterpreting, the band's social and political views. or: He began to harbour resentments for people who claimed to be fans of the band yet refused to acknowledge, or misinterpreted, the band's social and political views.

Jayeffnz (talk) 01:47, 13 August 2010 (UTC)

 Done Thanks, Stickee (talk) 01:51, 13 August 2010 (UTC)

Ancestry

Cobain isn't Scottish, Irish or German, it's ENGLISH Anglo-saxon originating from Kent, is it not cool enough to be mainly or English descent, its obvious Kurt was, millions of Americans with English ancestry deny it, btw im not being Anti-American (I love americans their our closets allies, along with the rest of the union countries), I'm prmoting Americans point of view of the possibility of being of English descent, and the ones that do they should respect it and not override it, peace...Davido488 (talk) 17:01, 18 August 2010 (UTC)

The name comes from a combination of the Old Norse Kobbi meaning "large" and the Gaelic Bain meaning "a fair person" --Connelly90[AlbaGuBràth] (talk) 13:44, 20 August 2010 (UTC)

No its an old English name for someone who lived in Cobham, surrey, kent thankyou, it's English not Scottish references http://cobainsurname.com/history/family_crest_name_history.html, http://www.houseofnames.com/fc.asp?sId=&s=cobain+.86.186.3.245 (talk) 00:26, 30 August 2010 (UTC)

While I tend to take these surname/family crest websites with a pinch of salt (most make no mention of my last name, Connelly, originating from O'Connell and gives my family a crest, which I know to be made up as I have seen 3 or 4 family crests for my name from these sites.) I am enclined to believe you. I am not 100% sure about it but I had just always thought the name came from "Kobbi" and "Bain". I managed to find a reference for this after a bit of searching. http://www.surnamedb.com/Surname/Cobain, Your explanation sounds to be a bit more plausable though. --Connelly90[AlbaGuBràth] (talk) 10:45, 30 August 2010 (UTC)

I have an edit request too. It says, "Dave Grohl stated Cobain believed "Music comes first, lyrics come second"". I'm not even sure that is a Grohl quote. It's Kurt himself who said that, and that isn't even the exact quote. Nirvana were asked in an interview which comes first, music or lyrics, and COBAIN said, "Music is number 1" and held up one finger. I even have the interview on my computer. 77.97.78.44 (talk) 00:57, 20 September 2010 (UTC) —Preceding unsigned comment added by 77.97.78.44 (talk) 00:42, 20 September 2010 (UTC)

Can you please provide the citation? it would be helpful.

Category:People who attempted suicide

I recently saw that the category "People Who Attempted Suicide" was removed from Kurt's categories. I believe it would make sense to keep it, considering he had attempted (without success) suicide in the past, such as in Rome with the pills and such. Does anyone agree? ISeriouslyNeedALife (talk) 02:56, 28 August 2010 (UTC)

I saw that too and thought of the Rome incident, yea. The descriptino at the top of the cat does say "This category is for people (living or dead) who attempted suicide but did not succeed for whatever reasons. For those who succeeded, see Category:Suicides" so it seems it was meant as an either/or categorization. Tarc (talk) 03:52, 28 August 2010 (UTC)

People frequently remove categories for no valid reason. The Rome incident was a suicide attempt according to Love and Cross. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 70.134.71.19 (talk) 23:45, 29 August 2010 (UTC)

I didn't know the guy; but I would say that in his state (i.e. drugged up to the eyeballs and slightly insane) he would have been looking for some attention in Rome. Also, I wouldn't really take Cross' opinion into account when discussing Cobain; He's only a biographer and never spoke to Cobain face-to-face. Likewise, my opinion I suppose. --Connelly90[AlbaGuBràth] (talk) 09:51, 1 September 2010 (UTC)

Does anyone have his journal? I read it and I'm pretty sure he talked about a silly failed attempt in that, where he lays on some train tracks and waits for a train, but it never comes so he gives up. I am pretty sure I read that in his journals. Either way though I prefer the article not to dwell TOO much on the suicide thing, but whatever. 77.97.78.44 (talk) 00:57, 20 September 2010 (UTC) —Preceding unsigned comment added by 77.97.78.44 (talk) 00:52, 20 September 2010 (UTC)

I did buy a copy of his journals; but inside it says something like "Don't read this and judge me when I'm gone" so I've never read them --Connelly90[AlbaGuBràth] (talk) 09:41, 27 October 2010 (UTC)

Nevada

why their no mention of his work with the alternatave band nevada  ?! —Preceding unsigned comment added by Brendan Whittington-Jones (talk • contribs) 12:34, 1 October 2010 (UTC)

I don't know, is it trivial? --CrohnieGal^Talk 13:03, 1 October 2010 (UTC)

Homophobic bullies?

This article states that "homophobic" kids bullied him at school because he hung out with a gay student. I don't doubt that he was bullied, and I don't doubt the reasons, but it is very speculative to call the students homophobic. Calling them homophobic assumes that we have in depth knowledge and understanding of the psychology and/or mental processes/ and world views of these students. We don't even know their names. I am not saying they (the students who bullied him) were or were not homophobic, but it is not Wikipedia's job to label people homophobic. That is all. 128.223.56.88 (talk) 18:47, 25 October 2010 (UTC)

Gay bashing is a pretty clear indication of homophobia. I would say by definition bullies who specifically target gay people would be properly termed "homophobic bullies." This kind of argument is often made by people who are against gay rights because they don't like being called homophobic. They insist that they are not afraid of gay people and beat them up. Rifter0x0000 (talk) 05:59, 22 November 2010 (UTC)

Rolling Stone link update

Hi, I was looking at the links in the Notes section and found an updated location for a reference that was marked as a dead link. As I've never edited a Wikipedia page, I decided I probably shouldn't make my first edit under the influence of Ambien.  ;)

So in case someone wants to fix it...

Note #101
rollingstone.com, "Cobain Unseen": Rare Photos, Artwork and Journal Entries
Old link: http://www.rollingstone.com/photos/gallery/23454963/cobain_unseen_rare_photos_artw/photo/17
New link: http://www.rollingstone.com/music/photos/8549/48642 Pisceschickus (talk) 10:14, 22 November 2010 (UTC)

Dead external links to Allmusic website – January 2011

Since Allmusic have changed the syntax of their URLs, 1 link(s) used in the article do not work anymore and can't be migrated automatically. Please use the search option on http://www.allmusic.com to find the new location of the linked Allmusic article(s) and fix the link(s) accordingly, prefereably by using the {{Allmusic}} template. If a new location cannot be found, the link(s) should be removed. This applies to the following external links:

• http://www.allmusic.com/cg/amg.dll?p=amg&sql=Blhud6j6h71q0

--CactusBot (talk) 10:59, 2 January 2011 (UTC)  Done--Cactus26 (talk) 11:06, 2 January 2011 (UTC)

Untitled

This article is ridiculously long and full of trivial crap like what his first concert was, the fact he "travelled to Olympia to go to concerts", 5 paragraphs about his "artistic intentions" (which all reads like opinion and POV BS, even with the Grohl and Love quotes). Can someone make this article more encyclopedic and less fanboy? —Preceding unsigned comment added by 98.194.105.109 (talk) 02:39, 17 December 2010 (UTC) It should definitley be trimmed down a bit, and there should definitley be more about his life before the band and childhood. It really helps to illustrate the influence for all of his music. — Preceding unsigned comment added by Zman19 (talk • contribs) 03:45, 3 March 2011 (UTC)

Edit request from Barbieskull, 22 January 2011

{{edit semi-protected}} Wendy Fradenburg is also of Dutch descent. She is from the Fradenburg/Vredenburg family which originated in Utrecht Holland, from Van Vredenburch (from what I understand means "from Peace Castle"), Dutch nobility. Barbieskull (talk) 03:52, 22 January 2011 (UTC)

Not done: please provide reliable sources that support the change you want to be made. Skier Dude (talk) 05:54, 23 January 2011 (UTC)

Edit request from Loltrolling, 9 March 2011

{{edit semi-protected}} Kurt Cobain was a relatively unknown scat porn adult film star before becoming a celebrity rock star. Loltrolling (talk) 01:30, 9 March 2011 (UTC)

Not done: please provide reliable sources that support the change you want to be made. —GƒoleyFour— 02:04, 9 March 2011 (UTC)

Nirvana creation date

In the article for Nirvana it says the band was created in 1987, but on the page for Kurt Cobain it says the band was created in 1985.— Preceding unsigned comment added by [[User:{{{1}}}|{{{1}}}]] ([[User talk:{{{1}}}|talk]] • [[Special:Contributions/{{{1}}}|contribs]])

It may just be the difference in the date they began writing material as Nirvana and the day they first performed as Nirvana; in which case there is an argument to say that both dates are correct. Personally, I would go for the date they started writing material as Nirvana, if this is the case. --Connelly90[AlbaGuBràth] (talk) 12:32, 31 May 2011 (UTC)

Once again, punk rock edit-warring

This pointless bickering about whether Nirvana is punk or not feels a lot like fanboys arguing how hairy hobbit toes get -- obviously they're very passionate about it but not very interesting for the rest of us. Just out of curiosity I decided how quickly I could find a legitimate news source that calls Nirvana a punk band. It took 00.4 seconds. Time Magazine (NOT YOUR PARENTS' PUNK By CHRISTOPHER JOHN FARLEY Monday, Oct. 16, 1995) which reads:

"Green Day is indisputably the most popular punk band since the demise of Nirvana ..." http://www.time.com/time/magazine/article/0,9171,983584,00.html

So here is a mainstream news source calling Nirvana, Hole and all the other Grunge bands of Seattle punk. And really, I didn't realize the guidelines of what made a band punk were so dogmatic and rigid! So what if Fecal Matter was only around for 3 months? it was still a band and still played punk music -- the life span of most punk bands is shorter than that, but I'm not a self-proclaimed fanboy rock journalist so what do I know ... meh. Himeyuri (talk) 14:40, 2 July 2011 (UTC)

Can we get some definitive input and end this stupid debate once and for all? IMO, being in a "punk" band with a few friends for a few months does not qualify Cobain's genre to have "punk rock" listed there as well. This is a perennial thing that gets reverted, here and at other related articles, but there's a very persistent new editor who has been at it for weeks, genre-warring on this and many other pages judging by the edit history. Tarc (talk) 12:59, 15 March 2011 (UTC)

The fact that the band themselves called themselves a Punk Rock band is enough for them to be listed as Punk rock here. Punk Rock is what they considered themselves. Grunge and Alternative Rock is what the media lablled them. All three probably are correct, but I would certainly go with Punk Rock, as that is what Kurt Cobain actually said on many recorded occasions as what type of music Nirvana actually were.mjgm84 (talk)

I have plenty of sources where Kurt referred to Nirvana as an alternative rock band. Grunge was the genre label he rejected. Regardless, what an artist labels their music as has no bearing on how they are actually labeled. WesleyDodds (talk) 01:19, 19 March 2011 (UTC)

Tarc, I totally agree with you. The punk rock genre does not belong and should be stopped already. I too think it's been going on too long. Did you notify the editor of this discussion? If not, please do so they can respond. If it continues I am of the mindset to ask for administrator help to make it stop. Enough editors have reverted this to make it unacceptable to keep adding it back in. Thanks, --CrohnieGal^Talk 13:10, 15 March 2011 (UTC)

Kurt Cobain was a punk rocker. He described himself as a punk rocker. And anyway, Grunge wasn't like a genre itself. It was just a style developed in Seattle during the early 90's. Each band had other influences: Alice in Chains was more heavy metal style, Soundgarden was very close to Alternative Rock and Nirvana was close to punk. Nirvana have a lot of obvious punk songs, like Breed and Territorial Pissings. Nirvana was a group made of 3 punk rockers! Krist and Dave were part of punk rock bands too. And the media label is often incorrect. (example: people who think AC/DC is heavy metal or Avril Lavigne as punk..) Also, why isn't Punknews a reliable source? --Revilal90 (talk) 08:04, 18 March 2011 (UTC)

Close to punk isn't actually punk. All of this rests on the existence of Fecal Matter, a 3-month old garage band. Tarc (talk) 13:50, 18 March 2011 (UTC)

You people don't think Nirvana is punk because of the "grunge" label. They were a punk rock band, with the Seattle style in their music. --Revilal90 (talk) 17:13, 18 March 2011 (UTC)

No, I think they're not punk because they...aren't; not fooled by any "grunge" tag. Not to toot my own horn much, but I was a DJ in the early 90's, in regular contact with record labels such as Sup Pop as we reported our charts to CMJ and whatnot. I'm pretty comfortable with my own ability to assess and classify music genres; sounding a little like punk and having one's roots in it does not make it so. They evolved past a simple 3-note shtuck. Also, there's 3 different places you've tried to add this tag, and we/you keep munging this all together. We have Kurt Cobain, which is not applicable IMO, but at least its in the realm of possibility via the Fecal Matter connection. We have Nirvana, which is a far stretch. Finally we have Nevermind, which, sorry, is outright laughable. Tarc (talk) 17:30, 18 March 2011 (UTC)

In any event, it doesn't matter what we think or know, or what our backgrounds are. Wikipedia's guideline for inclusion is verifiability, not truth. What matters is what we can find sourcing for. If there's sourcing for "punk rock", provide it. If not, it's inappropriate for inclusion. Doniago (talk) 18:38, 18 March 2011 (UTC)

Interestingly enough, it's on his death certificate listed under what looks like "Kind of Business or Industry."68.7.4.181 (talk) 08:58, 23 March 2011 (UTC)

Here's the source for punk rock. http://www.punknews.org/bands/nirvana --Revilal90 (talk) 09:09, 24 March 2011 (UTC)

Please stop the edit warring about this. Use this talk page and gain a concensus to add it to the article. The BRD cycle should be followed and we are way past the discuss part of it. I don't think that it is notable or important enough to add to the article so I think it should not be added. Next please, --CrohnieGal^Talk 14:25, 24 March 2011 (UTC)

• Per Tarc and Crohnie, this does not qualify the description to be added. Find some reliable sources (and I don't think punknews.org qualifies), and we can usefully revisit this. --John (talk) 01:38, 25 March 2011 (UTC)

Well if your looking for sources, Wikipedia guide lines state that books are prefered as sources rather than websites. I am sure there are loads of books out there that refer to Nirvana and Kurt Cobain as punk rock. Just check out the books Come As You Are or Heavier than Heavan. I'm sure there must be countless surces out there which state Nirvana and Kurt were punk. It is silly to suggest that they are not.mjgm84 (talk) 09:46, 25 March 2011 (UTC)

Please read burden. You are the one who says it belongs in the article. As one of the editors here, I have an open mind about this so if you find a reliable source showing that this is important thus notable I'll support the addition to the article. Right now I just don't see it as necessary to comment on per trivia. Sorry, --CrohnieGal^Talk 10:44, 25 March 2011 (UTC)

I'd be curious to see where "books are better sources than websites" is from, as I cannot recall seeing that in a guideline. WP:RS itself has nothing of the sort, unless in re-reading it I have missed it. Really, the issue here IMO is people confusing being influenced by punk with being actual punk, and how grunge and alt rock in general evolved from the 70's-80's punk scene. As noted above, there are 3 areas in which this is battle is being waged;

• This.
• The band.
• Albums.

Getting the band and album articles labeled "punk" is just going to lead to a dead-end. They simply weren't, that's all there is to it. I still disagree with the label being placed on Cobain himself, but at least it is plausible, if debatable. Tarc (talk) 13:10, 25 March 2011 (UTC)

You would believe it if you'd watch some Nirvana interviews. You'd see that they actually were punk rock. Also, @John: you "don't think" punknews.org is notable enough? I think it is. And we aren't getting anywhere if we keep dping things just because we think so. The guys from punknews know very much about music, they aren't just some random rockers..--Revilal90 (talk) 19:20, 25 March 2011 (UTC)

The "guys from punknews" are just a bunch of fans, not legitimate journalists, judging by the website. It consists of user-submitted content, which is generally a failure of reliable source guidelines. Your edits history shows a fair bit of genre edit-warring at other articles as well, so it would be a very good idea if you simply knock it off and stop reverting to get your way, especially when MULTIPLE editors have raised objections to your content. Tarc (talk) 19:29, 25 March 2011 (UTC)

Yes, while others have agreed. And also, "judging by the website"...? I could say the same thing about Almusic then! You're against the punk label because the media came up with "grunge", as they needed something new for the society.--213.233.101.253 (talk) 08:50, 26 March 2011 (UTC)

allmusic.com isn't a good source for genres either, e.g. the list Frank Sinatra as "soft rock". Allmusic is a catalog/database website, not an establisher of notability. Tarc (talk) 13:44, 26 March 2011 (UTC)

Punknews IS a reliable source. They're not "just a bunch of fans", I don't know why you're saying that.--Revilal90 (talk) 13:20, 26 March 2011 (UTC)

See this; http://www.punknews.org/submit ? That means that any yahoo can submit articles to the website, which is what we call WP:USERGENERATED content. Tarc (talk) 13:44, 26 March 2011 (UTC)

The main articles are written by the administrators. And notice that you need to have a source, just like here on wikipedia.--Revilal90 (talk) 21:20, 27 March 2011 (UTC)

Sorry, its really little more than a punk-oriented blog. If your sole argument is hanging by a single, questionable source, then I really don't see much else to do here. Tarc (talk) 15:16, 28 March 2011 (UTC)

Sorry, but I believe they had a heavy punk sound. Some of their songs were outright punk, like Territorial Pissings, a great example. And Cobain said Nirvana was a punk band. I don't know, but I tend to take a band's word for their genre over the damn media's word. Can someone explain how the media is more reliable for classifying a band than the freaking band itself? I don't know about you, but it doesn't make any sense to me. Logan The Master (talk) 14:46, 22 May 2011 (UTC)

Before they made their music, and even sometime during, there was pretty much no such thing as Grunge as it was so obscure; so it was easier for the band to classify themselves as "Punk rock" so people would have an idea what their sound was like. There is no argument that Kurt took most of his insperation for Nirvana from Punk rock bands and also based a lot of his philosophy on it (with the whole "punk rock is freedom" thing etc.) but I personally would say that Grunge is a sub-genre of punk rock, so a mention of punk rock as the genre that Kurt played in shouldn't really be needed. --Connelly90[AlbaGuBràth] (talk) 09:44, 23 May 2011 (UTC)

Yeah, but grunge is also a sub-genre of alternative rock. Therefore, going by your logic, alternative rock shouldn't be mentioned either. And IMO, Nirvana is more punk than alternative. Logan The Master (talk) 14:23, 23 May 2011 (UTC)

that's true, I suppose both grunge and punk rock are seperate sub-genres of "Alternative Rock" and so it could be written as something like "Alternative Rock (Grunge)" but, seeing as the wording has been decided on many times before, it should probably stay as-is. --Connelly90[AlbaGuBràth] (talk) 14:45, 23 May 2011 (UTC)

Well, since Fecal Matter was a punk band, why don't we just put either "early" or "Fecal Matter" in parentheses. I think that would make everyone happy. Here's how it would look with both "early" and "Fecal Matter": Logan The Master (talk) 15:07, 7 June 2011 (UTC)

(Later collapsed to fix page formatting)

Kurt Cobain Cobain (right) performing with Nirvana at the 1992 MTV Video Music Awards Background information Birth name Kurt Donald Cobain Also known as Kurt Cobain Genres Alternative rock, grunge, punk rock(early) Occupation(s) Musician, songwriter, artist Instrument(s) Vocals, guitar Years active 1982–1994 Labels Sub Pop, DGC/Geffen Kurt Cobain Cobain (right) performing with Nirvana at the 1992 MTV Video Music Awards Background information Birth name Kurt Donald Cobain Also known as Kurdt Kobain Genres Alternative rock, grunge, punk rock(Fecal Matter) Occupation(s) Musician, songwriter, artist Instrument(s) Vocals, guitar Years active 1982–1994 Labels Sub Pop, DGC/Geffen

Date of death

Resolved

It says in the first line that his date of death is "c. April 6, 1994" and in the Background information section (beneath the picture) that his date of death is "c. April 5, 1994". The more accurate one is the latter. Can someone please take care of that? —Preceding unsigned comment added by 84.108.12.23 (talk) 22:42, 3 April 2011 (UTC)

Edit request from 112.135.134.131, 25 May 2011

No grunge band, rock band

112.135.134.131 (talk) 19:28, 25 May 2011 (UTC)

I assume this is supposed to be saying "they aren't grunge, they're rock", to which I would say "um, no". Tarc (talk) 19:48, 25 May 2011 (UTC)

Minor edit

Resolved

I don't have permission yet to make this change, but the following doesn't entirely make grammatical sense:

Cobain also had a period of consuming "notable" amounts of LSD, as observed by Tracy Marander,[76] and "really into getting fucked up: drugs, acid, any kind of drug"

Should at least be a 'was' before '"really...', or at best the sentence should be restructured.

(Above text added by Nottrobin at 15:02 [parts added at 15:01] on the 18th of July 2011)

The edit has now been made. Thank you for pointing out that it was necessary. Nlemslu Phlyshi (talk) 18:10, 20 July 2011 (UTC)

Edit request from SquedgeGrommet, 25 July 2011

At the beginning of the Artistry section Dave Grohl is quoted as stating that Kurt believed "Music comes first, lyrics come second". the citation needed is the same as the next citation i.e 50 - Classic Albums - Nirvana: Nevermind 2004. I just watched it. Dave is interviewed on camera. The complete quotation is " Kurt used to say that music comes first and lyrics comes second, and I think Kurt's main focus was melody".

SquedgeGrommet (talk) 02:45, 25 July 2011 (UTC)

Done Good find. I've removed the tag, reworded the sentence and added the full quote into the citation. Thanks, Adrian J. Hunter^{(talk•contribs)} 13:15, 25 July 2011 (UTC)

Kurt can actually be heard saying approximately that in a video interview. Although he says, "Music comes first. Music is number one, lyrics are secondary." A clip of that interview can be found here: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YZdIaCGHf-g — Preceding unsigned comment added by 98.82.253.25 (talk) 18:59, 6 August 2011 (UTC)

Dead links

This article has a total of 10 references to dead links.

• Inside the Heart and Mind of Nirvana (Rolling Stone) (two refs)
  • [1]
• Even in His Youth (A Healthy Me)
  • [2]
• Courtney Love: Life After Death (Rolling Stone)
  • [3]
• The 100 Greatest Guitarists of All Time (Rolling Stone)
  • [4]
• Search Articles, Artists, Reviews, Videos, Music and Movies (Rolling Stone)
  • [5]
• Top-Earning Dead Celebrities (Forbes)
  • [6] The 2007 list doesn't include Cobain, though. For 2006, see [7].
• Park’s four-letter controversy erased (The Daily World)
  • Nope.
• Kurt and Courtney: Interview with Nick Broomfield (MiniReviews.com)
  • [8]
• Everett True (Magnet Magazine)
  • [9]

Anyone have updated/additional refs to replace these dead links? Sottolacqua (talk) 14:24, 22 August 2011 (UTC)

See above. Cheers, Prayer for the wild at heart (talk) 21:17, 23 August 2011 (UTC).

Edit request from 97.101.199.236, 17 September 2011

{{edit semi-protected}} The Wikipedia page of Kurt Cobain has the wrong information. He was nine years old when his parents got divorced, not eight. Kurt Cobain also even quoted "I had a really good childhood up until I was nine, then a classic case of divorce really affected me." So there is some proof. You may search "Kurt Cobain quotes" on BrainyQuote.com for further information.

97.101.199.236 (talk) 02:52, 17 September 2011 (UTC)

You have not cited a reliable source - "BrainyQuote.com" is not an RS; also, you have not explained what exactly should be changed - thus, for now, I'm cancelling this request; please feel fre to discuss it further below.  Chzz  ►  03:09, 17 September 2011 (UTC)

Done per Charles Cross. Prayer for the wild at heart (talk) 11:25, 17 September 2011 (UTC)

File:Kd cobain.jpg Nominated for speedy Deletion

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Kurt's own words about the song "Rape Me"

Kurt himself said the song "Rape Me" has nothing to do with the media treating him in any certain way. In a video interview of Kurt in 1993 (available on YouTube.com) Kurt clearly explains what he intended for the song to convey by stating "it's an anti-rape song" (period). — Preceding unsigned comment added by Maristy (talk • contribs) 01:25, 19 October 2011 (UTC)

Cool, is there a point to this comment? Do you want to put the information somewhere?P0PP4B34R732 (talk) 01:28, 19 October 2011 (UTC)

Edit request from , 10 November 2011

The following is to request that some facts in Cobain's lifes likes his rise of fame post-mortem.

Thanks.

Chinopalquepida

Chinopalquepida (talk) 14:21, 10 November 2011 (UTC)

Could you please be more specific in terms of what changes you are looking for, and whether you have reliable sources to back up any information you would like added or changed? As is, I think your request is a little too general to be actionable. Thanks. Doniago (talk) 15:17, 10 November 2011 (UTC)

We have a section Kurt Cobain#Legacy that covers this. Tarc (talk) 15:18, 10 November 2011 (UTC)

Edit request on 31 December 2011

There's an obvious error in the "Also known as" wich says "Kurdt Kobain" instead of Kurt Cobain

2.81.241.149 (talk) 17:15, 31 December 2011 (UTC)

He was sometimes credited as "Kurdt", such as the liner notes' credit for Incesticide's cover art. Tarc (talk) 17:19, 31 December 2011 (UTC)

Replace refs

For reference 93 in Kurt_Cobain#Legacy, replace the dead link with http://www.rollingstone.com/music/lists/100-greatest-guitarists-of-all-time-19691231/kurt-cobain-19691231 and ref 94 with http://www.rollingstone.com/music/lists/100-greatest-singers-of-all-time-19691231/kurt-cobain-19691231 Alukah (talk) 02:37, 29 January 2012 (UTC)

 Done Thanks. I've replaced them quickly with bare urls, which I will now go expand... Dru of Id (talk) 03:14, 29 January 2012 (UTC)

Allegation that Kurt Cobain sexually molested a mentally impaired girl when aged sixteen

According to "Heavier than Heaven" and Kurt's journals, he sexually molested a girl when he was a teenager. It can also be read in this short review http://www.livenirvana.com/official/hthrev.html Isn't this an important point for an objective overview of Kurt Cobain's teenage years? I would really like to see this added to the article but don't know how to express this in the right way, without doing harm to the idol. On the other hand, this IS something to be written about, even though the fans will not like the idea, I guess... But an objective article should deal with darker sides of persons as well and in this particular case, the person is a very ambivalent character. 83.135.99.151 (talk) 11:44, 25 February 2012 (UTC)

Anyone? — Preceding unsigned comment added by 212.23.140.110 (talk) 15:17, 27 May 2012 (UTC)

If I recall correctly, Heavier Than Heaven says she got naked, and Kurt became so repulsed and ashamed that he left. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 108.224.140.141 (talk) 18:15, 27 May 2012 (UTC)

Edit request on 2 March 2012

12th greatest guitarist of all time (list provided by rolling stones). not the 72 or something. Please refer the official rolling stones link below.

http://www.rollingstone.com/music/lists/100-greatest-guitarists-of-all-time-19691231/kurt-cobain-19691231 115.241.213.114 (talk) 12:02, 2 March 2012 (UTC)

Not done: The source in the article is a newer Rolling Stone list. Celestra (talk) 15:51, 2 March 2012 (UTC)

Edit request on 5 April 2012

The paragraph states that he was found dead on April 8, 1994. Needs to be corrected to April 5th.

168.251.2.42 (talk) 19:51, 5 April 2012 (UTC)

On April 8, 1994 an electrician came to the house and discovered the body. An autopsy revealed that he had shot himself on April 5. Heymister14 (talk) 18:25, 9 September 2012 (UTC)heymister14

Get this to FA in time for Today's Featured Article on April 5, 2014

It would be great if the editors would make improvements to this article (maybe with some help from the GA and FA articles in other languages run through Google Translator) and put it through the FA process in time for it to be the front page article on April 5, 2014. Fortunately that leaves two years to get it done. It would really be beautiful to commemorate Cobain that way, and I"m sure it will be one of the TFAs with the highest number of hits (for those who are motivated by that kind of thing). Lemurbaby (talk) 05:17, 6 April 2012 (UTC)

Edit request on 27 June 2012

he play drums too, don't believe me look it up

99.160.220.160 (talk) 20:37, 27 June 2012 (UTC)

Not done: please provide reliable sources that support the change you want to be made. Ryan Vesey Review me! 21:46, 27 June 2012 (UTC)

He actually did. As a kid he played drums and piano, and he played drums in a CCR tribute band with Krist Novoselic. Heymister14 (talk) 18:22, 9 September 2012 (UTC)heymister14

Edit request on 14 July 2012

There is proof that he has Irish heritage. There is no proof that he has any Scottish ancestry. Wikipedia is a joke.

Unless a reliable source can be found, I would question the claim of Scottish ancestry too. However, Heavier than Heaven (page 7) states Cobain had French and Irish roots on his father's side and German, Irish and English roots on his mother's side. Cobain is a deriative of the Irish surname "Cobane," after all. Idiotchalk _(t@lk) 20:11, 25 July 2012 (UTC)

Wrong age

The quote they use for his age when his parents divorced is 9. Why does it say SEVEN on wikipedia? — Preceding unsigned comment added by 60.224.160.192 (talk) 20:08, 8 August 2012 (UTC)

Breanne O'Connor

I think it should also be stated that Kurt had a half sister too. Breanne was born in 1985 to his mother. Kurt was very close to her and even mentioned her on the thanks on In Utero. Also it seems unfair to mention Chad and not Breanne.

60.224.160.192 (talk) 19:33, 9 August 2012 (UTC)

I think it is already stated. Kurt also had various stepsiblings, including a biological younger sister named Kimberley. Heymister14 (talk) 18:20, 9 September 2012 (UTC)heymister14

Edit request on 13 August 2012

editing out "art on cobain".

artist kites unverified claim he was cobain's friend in life while his wiki page appears to be self-produced. 67.168.89.158 (talk) 12:44, 13 August 2012 (UTC)

 Done Agreed, it seems to be a self-promotion edit which is prohibited per WP:SOAP. Idiotchalk _(t@lk) 13:32, 13 August 2012 (UTC)

Edit request on 7 September 2012

Please change the following sentence in the Nirvana section:

Cobain began learning guitar with a few covers, including "Louie Louie", The Cars' "My Best Friend's Girl", and Jesus Don't Want Me For A Sunbeam and soon began working on his own songs.

To (suggested options of change in order of preference):

1. Remove the last cover completely:

Cobain began learning guitar with a few covers, including "Louie Louie" and The Cars' "My Best Friend's Girl" and soon began working on his own songs.

2. Change the name of the cover to "Jesus Wants Me for a Sunbeam" (and add quotes)

Cobain began learning guitar with a few covers, including "Louie Louie", The Cars' "My Best Friend's Girl", and "Jesus Wants Me for a Sunbeam" and soon began working on his own songs.

3. At the very least, correctly name the cover "Jesus Doesn't Want Me for a Sunbeam" (and add quotes). "Jesus Don't Want Me for a Sunbeam" is not the name of any song. It's the lyrics of the song.

Cobain began learning guitar with a few covers, including "Louie Louie", The Cars' "My Best Friend's Girl", and "Jesus Doesn't Want Me for a Sunbeam" and soon began working on his own songs.

Reason: It's suggested that Cobain began mastering the guitar after receiving a used one in 1981, and he did so by learning the listed covers. Currently The last song listed Jesus Don't Want Me For A Sunbeam (incorrect capitalization; no quotes) was originally released by The Vaselines in 1987 and was called "Jesus Wants Me for a Sunbeam", but was re-released with a new name by The Vaselines in 1992 as "Jesus Doesn't Want Me for a Sunbeam", which was two mere years before Nirvana's own version on the live acoustic album MTV Unplugged in New York. Most likely he played The Vaseline's cover after it was originally released, but if we're talking about how interesting it is that Cobain quickly mastered the guitar, it's not impressive to hear about how he began to learn the guitar by playing a simple cover six years after he received a guitar. It's even less impressive to hear about how Cobain mastered the guitar by working on a simple cover after Nirvana had released their first album Nevermind (11 years after he received a guitar). If we want to show Cobain's dedication and passion for the guitar and music, then this cover should not be used as the dates incorrectly betray a limited ability or even an habitual aversion to learning the guitar.

If this is not acceptable, at the very least, please, change the name of the cover to the proper name of "Jesus Doesn't Want Me For A Sunbeam". It's currently Jesus Don't Want Me For A Sunbeam (without quotes).

Peace, Love, Pope

66.112.104.98 (talk) 17:08, 7 September 2012 (UTC)

Partly done: I made the minor formatting fix per the "if this is not acceptable" portion of your request. The way the rationale for your request is worded makes it sound like this is entirely your personal opinion and/or original research. I should also note that I added the {{failed verification}} tag at the end of the sentence in question, because as far as I could tell there is no mention of any of those songs in the citation given. —KuyaBriBri^Talk 20:09, 7 September 2012 (UTC)

Article image

The image has a watermark on it for a tumblr page. Here is a HQ version of the same photo, sans watermark. http://www.nirvanaone.ru/photos/hq/hq-live/hq-live-1993/hq-live-93-01-16_01.jpg 49.176.98.214 (talk) 13:23, 22 November 2012 (UTC) dongs

• Could someone please upload an image? Cobain is rather notable and I find it weird how someone as famous as him does not have a main image on his article. I would upload the image the previous poster gave, but I have never done it before. I tried to, but I am having difficulty.Arilicious (talk) 21:40, 5 January 2013 (UTC)
  • I've added the only image of him available in the Commons. Shawn in Montreal (talk) 02:11, 6 January 2013 (UTC)

Suicide note

Wikipedia's Non-free content criteria require minimal usage and require contextual significance, including the statement "and its omission would be detrimental to that understanding". There is no doubt that Death of Kurt Cobain, which directly references and analyzes the note, would be negatively affected by the omission of the note. That said, the omission of the note in this case, would in no way negatively affect the readers' understanding of Kurt Cobain. It is still available in the article on his death for those desiring to learn more on the topic. This article briefly mentions the suicide note, but doesn't analyze it like the article on his death. All of this said, the image of the suicide note should be removed from this article. Ryan Vesey 21:53, 21 January 2013 (UTC)

Not convincing. If "There is no doubt that Death of Kurt Cobain, which directly references and analyzes the note, would be negatively affected by the omission of the note.", then there is little doubt that Kurt Cobain#Death, which also directly references and analyzes the note, would be negatively affected too. It's also the main artefact related to Cobain's death, and as such the best possible illustration for the paragraph. Also, "minimal usage", in WP:NFCC means that "Multiple items of non-free content are not used if one item can convey equivalent significant information." - and here we're not talking of multiple items, only of the same item used in two strictly related articles. --Cyclopia^talk 09:33, 23 January 2013 (UTC)

Edit request on 14 March 2013

Love read portions of Cobain's alleged suicide note to the crowd, crying and chastising Cobain. 94.255.168.36 (talk) 18:43, 14 March 2013 (UTC)

Not done: please provide reliable sources that support the change you want to be made. —KuyaBriBri^Talk 19:45, 14 March 2013 (UTC)

Edit request on 26 March 2013

The article states that Cobains ashes were spread in two different places, first "his daughter Frances Bean scattered his ashes into McLane Creek in Olympia", second "Because Cobain was cremated and his remains scattered into the Wishkah River in Washington". 209.206.167.50 (talk) 19:58, 26 March 2013 (UTC)

The citation for the second specifically states that his ashes where scattered in several places. -Nathan Johnson (talk) 20:04, 29 March 2013 (UTC)

Kurt Cobain was also punk rock, STOP REMOVING IT

Seriously, what is up? Stop removing the punk rock tag from his genre section. He considered himself as punk rock too, even. --User:Marnches 19. November, 2010. —Preceding undated comment added 11:15, 19 November 2010 (UTC).

who cares what he considered himself as? His music was not even close to punk rock. Period. -{{User-multi

His music was pretty much hardcore/punk rock in Bleach while not as evident in Nevermind, id also argue that In Utero was a Noise Rock/Punk record. Grunge in general is a mix of all of these things, also the Incesticide album is another great example of a heavy punk album with heavy riffing and hard vocals. They were a hardcore punk oriented band in everything but nevermind.

|User=Dexter_prog
|1=t
|2=c
|3=ct
|sup=
|doc=yes

}} @ 20:37, 31 March 2013 (UTC)

grammatical error

"Since their debut, Nirvana, with Cobain as a songwriter, has sold over 25 million albums in the U.S., and over 50 million worldwide." should be "Since their debut, Nirvana, with Cobain as a songwriter, have sold over 25 million albums in the U.S., and over 50 million worldwide." 83.100.233.169 (talk) 00:12, 2 April 2013 (UTC)

Nirvana is a singular entity, and as such I believe "has" is the correct choice. Doniago (talk) 16:30, 2 April 2013 (UTC)

Feminist?

Any sources on him being a feminist? Derpian (talk) 08:16, 16 October 2012 (UTC)

http://www.youtube.com/watch?&v=xWO4JnP2T40 49.176.98.214 (talk) 13:23, 22 November 2012 (UTC) dongs

During this time, a third wave of feminism was just starting. This wave included different groups of activists, but one of the most important was the Riot Grrrl movement. Riot Grrls formed in the punk music scene during the 1990s, when the gender balance of musicians started to shift with the increase of all girl bands.

Kurt became directly involved in this movement when he dated a member of Bikini Kill, which was one of the bands associated with and leading this movement. Although that relationship ended, he continued to identify with the movement and fight for the rights of women through his music and words. (Charles Cross Heavier Than Heaven)

He also took the time to write in one of his journals, which he almost always kept to record lyrics, poems, drawings, and personal thoughts, what he referred to as a step number one for boys. Perhaps from his own personal childhood experiences and/or because of the Riot Grrrl influence, the rule was stated as follows: “Remember that your older brothers, cousins, uncles and your fathers are not your role models. This means you do not do what they do, you do not do what they say. They come from a time when their role models told their sons to be mean to girls, to think of yourself as better and stronger and smarter than them. They also taught things like: You will grow up strong if you act tough and fight the boys who are known as nerds or geeks.” (Kurt Cobain Journals) Unknowntome (talk) 17:02, 13 April 2013 (UTC)

Grammatical Error

He challenged Nirvana's audience with its final studio album In Utero (1993).

I can't help but wonder that if the sentence would make more sense if the pronoun "its" was "their" since its referring to Nirvana's audience and they are a group of people not an object. Unknowntome (talk) 17:18, 13 April 2013 (UTC)

Nirvana challenged their audience with their final studio album...(possibly its instead of their...I'm a little unclear on whether singular or plural is appropriate here)

He challenged Nirvana's audience with his final album...

In any event, the sentence as presented is awful. Either it's his album or it's Nirvana's. Doniago (talk) 13:28, 15 April 2013 (UTC)