Talk:Kitaw Ejigu

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Delete again?

It's unclear if basic notability has been met, and the use of unreliable sources makes it appear this article is a memorial rather than an encyclopedia article. --Hipal (talk) 17:42, 26 March 2021 (UTC)[reply]

Let's get out all the unreliable sources

Ethiopian Review. Vol. 2, Nr. 1. (1992) p. 22
More info needed: This might be usable, depending on the specific article on page 22. Can someone please identify what it is, including the title, author. --Hipal (talk) 18:54, 26 March 2021 (UTC)[reply]
I tried to add all the essential info. - Yitbe ^A-21 06:51, 29 March 2021 (UTC)[reply]
"Kitaw Ejigu Biography, Life, Interesting Facts". Famous Birthdays By SunSigns.Org. 30 May 2018. Retrieved 26 March 2021.
Remove: This is clearly unreliable and should be removed. It's just a scraping website. --Hipal (talk) 18:56, 26 March 2021 (UTC)[reply]
I removed it. - Yitbe ^A-21 06:51, 29 March 2021 (UTC)[reply]
Abebe, Tesfaye (25 February 2016). "ስለ ዶክተር ኢንጂነር ቅጣው እጅጉ በጥቂቱ". ethiopiaanything.com. Retrieved 25 March 2021.
Remove: This is a blog, so should be removed. --Hipal (talk) 18:57, 26 March 2021 (UTC)[reply]
Removed. - Yitbe ^A-21 06:51, 29 March 2021 (UTC)[reply]
Tessema, Ayalisew. "Doctor Engineer Scientist Kitaw Ejigu Biography". Academia.
Remove: This is self-published, without even minimal attempts to look like reliable research. It should be removed. --Hipal (talk) 19:00, 26 March 2021 (UTC)[reply]
Disagree. It should not be removed. - Yitbe ^A-21 06:53, 29 March 2021 (UTC)[reply]
Europa Publications Staff (2007) The Europa World Year Book: 2007. Vol. 1. p. 1718
More info needed: I'm not sure what this is based on a quick look. What specifically is being cited? Is this a brief biographical/memorial entry, or is there larger context? --Hipal (talk) 19:22, 26 March 2021 (UTC)[reply]
It's about a biography and career. - Yitbe ^A-21 06:57, 29 March 2021 (UTC)[reply]
"Kitaw Ejigu Obituary (2006) - Los Angeles, CA - Los Angeles Times". www.legacy.com. 17 January 2006. Retrieved 25 March 2021.
Remove, more info needed for possible substitution: Legacy.com is not reliable.

If the LATimes information is correct, it most likely is a submitted obituary, and so not reliable. --Hipal (talk) 19:07, 26 March 2021 (UTC)[reply]
Disagree. It should stay, for it is a reliable source, Los Angeles Times. - Yitbe ^A-21 07:10, 29 March 2021 (UTC)[reply]
Letitia (2020). Famous People: Kitaw Ejigu Biography Kindle Edition. Amazon (published 27 March 2020). pp. 2–20. ASIN B086HDWGHB.
Remove: This appears self-published, so is not reliable and should be removed. --Hipal (talk) 19:08, 26 March 2021 (UTC)[reply]
Removed. - Yitbe ^A-21 07:11, 29 March 2021 (UTC)[reply]
"Kitaw Ejigu remembered | Ethiopian Review - Ethiopian News". Retrieved 26 March 2021.
More info needed: Why isn't there the same level of detail for this reference as for #1? Please provide publication date, author, volume, number, page. --Hipal (talk) 19:11, 26 March 2021 (UTC)[reply]
Removed, for it's Wikipedia:CIRCULAR. - Yitbe ^A-21 07:05, 29 March 2021 (UTC)[reply]
"Who was Kitaw Ejigu? Everything You Need to Know". www.thefamouspeople.com. Retrieved 25 March 2021.
Remove: This is not reliable and should be removed. --Hipal (talk) 19:11, 26 March 2021 (UTC)[reply]

Removed. - Yitbe ^A-21 06:59, 29 March 2021 (UTC)[reply]

Notes:

1 - See 8

2 - Common junk scraper; absolutely not a reliable source and should have been blacklisted long ago. Not a RS.

3 - Just looks like a blog; no metadata or editorial policy, just appears to be a news-skinned blog. Not a RS.

4 - Self-published material copied from the previously deleted Wikipedia article without proper license and attribution. This is a copyvio and should not be linked to in any way. The links in the slide show all point back to here. Not a RS.

5 - This seems to be RS, it's just a brief directory listing for "Ethiopian National United Front" which lists him as the "chair". No other information. The organization seems to be be long defunct, at least from the website given in that directory listing. It's not clear how it even supports the claim it is attached to.

6 - Submitted biography to LAtimes - they do not exert editorial control or fact check those. Not a RS.

7 - Self-published low quality pamphlet, obviously not RS.

8 - This is copied from the deleted Wikipedia article and credits it "(Source: Wikipedia)". This is potentially another direct copy. Reliability of publications could change over time, so it's possible that first ref is better back in 1992.

9 - Long term junk scraper. Not a RS.

At this point, the only ref that is RS is #5, but it only sources his affiliation with that political organization and nothing else. #1 might be, but would need more details. @Yitbe:, since you added this ref, I assume you have access to it. Can you provide more details on the 1992 ref? Are there other references you have? Kuru (talk) 01:10, 28 March 2021 (UTC)[reply]

I see no improvement in the newest version [1]: Selectively removing some unreliable sources while keeping others isn't a solution.

The edit-warring needs to stop. The general consensus on reliability of sources needs to be respected. --Hipal (talk) 15:36, 29 March 2021 (UTC)[reply]

@Yitbe: - this is a very disappointing revert; it appears to have become worse.

1. "The Europa World Year Book 2007". As previously mentioned, this looks like a reliable source. I can easily verify that it supports his position as chair of the ENUF. However, while you just changed it from supporting that claim, you now have it supporting five other claims. Can you please supply the page number for each one?

"Chief technical advisor and assistant manager for Ethiopian Automotive Services and Sales Company"

"he worked as a Chief technical advisor and assistant manager for Ethiopian Automotive Services and Sales Company"

"After completing his primary and secondary education in Bonga, Waka and Jimma, Kitaw attended his higher education at the Polytechnic College of Ethiopia, in Bahir Dar in the department of Mechanical engineering and in 1966 he graduated as the top scored student in his class"

"Kitaw received a scholarship to the United States, where he had received a Master of Arts in Business administration and Doctor of Philosophy in Aerospace engineering"

"Kitaw was also among a scientists who invented Flight Dynamic Simulator and Advanced Global Positioning Satellite System for Boeing. Later, Kitaw also worked as a scientist and engineer for Loral Corp and Rockwell International"

2. "LA Time Obituary". As noted, this does not appear to be an obituary by a LA Times writer and not fact checked (seems unlikely they would have misspelled Loral Corporation as "Lorrel"). This appears to just be a paid death notice. I generally would not object to what is essentially a self-published source for something like the date of death, but you have now expanded it to act as a source for.

"in 1973, Kitaw received a scholarship to the United States, where he had received a Master of Arts in Business administration and Doctor of Philosophy in Aerospace engineering" is not in the material anywhere.

3. "American People of Ethiopian Descent". Books LLC is a publisher solely of copied Wikipedia articles: see the publisher page here, which very clearly notes the entire thing is a scam. Please remove this source as soon as possible.

I found nothing with the link you provided. There is no solid evidence that assures this particular book, American People of Ethiopian Descent, is "copied [from] Wikipedia articles". - Yitbe ^A-21 07:17, 30 March 2021 (UTC)[reply]

4. "Ethiopian Review Magazine. 1992", likely a reliable source. Can you tell me which page the "Later, Kitaw also worked as a scientist and engineer for Loral Corp and Rockwell International" appears on?

You can check it through this link. It's on a page number 23. - Yitbe ^A-21 07:12, 30 March 2021 (UTC)[reply]

5. "Doctor Engineer Scientist Kitaw Ejigu Biography". Again, my notes and Hipal's above clear state why this is not an acceptable source. Your response of "Disagree. It should not be removed" is a little silly. Can you please state why you feel it is reliable and not just a copy of the previous page?

Really need a response. I'm afraid it's hard to imagine how some of these mistakes could have been made. Kuru (talk) 23:15, 29 March 2021 (UTC)[reply]

I'm presuming the non-response means you do not contest removing #1 and #2 from material that you did not supply pages for or did not clarify. I'll go ahead and remove those from the contested uses.

The publisher's link was broken on #3; here's the full source which is trivial to find: Booksllc "AMERICAN PEOPLE OF ETHIOPIAN DESCENT", you can see the same fraud warning at Amazon in case you don't trust the actual publisher. Since no competent person could be confused by this, I will go ahead and remove this "reference".

For #4, I'm still not seeing the Loral Corp there; since that's the sentence you're pointing at, and it does not include that material, I'll remove it for you.

You've added "Diaspora Pride - People, Places, and Things (V4)", which is a self-published vanity press (see the specific entry for Lulu at Wikipedia:Reliable sources/Perennial sources). This cannot be used as a source. Another is published by "bokutgivning.se" which also appears to be a self-publishing platform with no editorial control.

The last add look fine; one is the Ethiopian Press Digest, which copies material from various news source. It would be helpful to see the original cite for that, but I cannot access it.Kuru (talk) 12:17, 30 March 2021 (UTC)[reply]

I'm concerned that we are simply trading obviously unreliable sources for inaccessible unreliable sources. --Hipal (talk) 15:10, 31 March 2021 (UTC)[reply]

Current status of article

@Hipal: Since your discussion with @Ritchie333:, I am following you. To be honest, at the beginning you're correct. You had raised a question regarding the sources reliability. But now all such sources were removed from the article. But still you're raising same question. I doubt that you're on the right track. I do not know what's wrong with this article or you. Please describe rationally why you're reused such tags. I need response. - Yitbe ^A-21 20:07, 1 April 2021 (UTC)[reply]

Multiple concerns above remain unaddressed or ignored. Clearly unreliable sources are still being heavily used. Requests to provide more information about sources, even basic information, remain open.

It's still just an obituary, filled with unencyclopedic detail. As long as we're working with such poor sources, I don't see how we can fix that, other than WP:STUB the article.

The subject doesn't appear notable, as far as we've been able to determine from what sources have been offered. --Hipal (talk) 20:34, 1 April 2021 (UTC)[reply]

Never at NASA?

From an internal NASA document dated June 1980:^[1]

Jet Propulsion Laboratory

4800 Oak Grove Drive

Pasadena, CA 91103

Attn: Library, Mail Code 111-113

Edward Mettler, Mail Code T-1201

Kitaw Ejigu, Mail Code 158-244

–Skywatcher68 (talk) 04:10, 9 July 2023 (UTC)[reply]

References

^ "NASA Contractor Report 159307: Laboratory Evaluation of the Pointing Stability of the ASPS Vernier System" (PDF). NASA. NASA. June 1980. p. 67. Retrieved July 9, 2023.

== Ethiopia 197.156.86.182 (talk) 14:58, 5 May 2024 (UTC)[reply]

[1] "NASA Contractor Report 159307: Laboratory Evaluation of the Pointing Stability of the ASPS Vernier System" (PDF). NASA. NASA. June 1980. p. 67. Retrieved July 9, 2023.

[1]