Talk:Khosrovidukht

Khosrovidukht has been listed as one of the Music good articles under the good article criteria. If you can improve it further, please do so. If it no longer meets these criteria, you can reassess it.
Review: December 22, 2021. (Reviewed version).

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Can't be right

This article can't be right; at least, the dictionary it's based on must have a gravely incorrect entry on this person. Two respected journals place Xosroviduxt in the 4th century, as the sister of Tiridates III of Armenia, who converted the country to Christianity:

Agathangelos and the 'Eusebius of Rome' Version
Agathangelos' History of the Armenians is our earliest surviving narrative of how King Trdat (Tiridates) of Armenia converted to Christianity. Although the text of the original Armenian version of Agathangelos that we now read is certainly, like all such epics, the product of an evolutionary process, it seems to have reached more or less its present shape c. 460, at much the same time as the Actus Silvestri. Agathangelos 'from the great city of Rome, trained in the art of the ancients, proficient in Latin and Greek and not unskilled in literary composition' (12), tells how 'in those times the ruler of the Greeks was engaged in persecuting the Church of God. And when Trdat discovered that Gregory [the future Bishop Gregory the Illuminator] was a member of the Christian cult, ... he tormented him, that he might abandon the worship of Christ' (38). But Gregory remained steadfast, so Trdat had him cast into a deep pit and left him there for thirteen years, with only snakes for company. Following the example set by 'the kings of the Greeks' (129), Trdat mounted a general persecution of Armenian Christians, and especially of the aristocratic Roman nuns Gaiane and the beautiful Rhipsime — whom he tried unsuccessfully to rape — and their companions, fugitives from Diocletian. After relating their martyrdom, Agathangelos says of Trdat: 'He should have been ashamed, he who was so renowned for bravery in battle . . . He who was such a powerful soldier and strong of body, by the will of God was defeated by a single girl' (202). For his sins, Trdat was turned into a wild boar, and 'all the populace in the city went mad through similar demon-possession' (213).
Then there appeared a vision from God to the king's sister, whose name was Khosrovidukht. So she came to speak with the people and related the vision, saying: 'A vision appeared to me this night. A man in the likeness of light came and told me: "There is no other cure for these torments that have come upon you, unless you send to the city of Artashat and bring thence the prisoner Gregory. When he comes he will teach you the remedy for your ills'". (214)
— Fowden, Garth. The Journal of Roman Studies, Vol. 84. (1994), pp. 146-170.

In his third year Trdat was crowned and came to Armenia, where he found that prince Awta had kept the royal treasure and his sister Xosroviduxt in the castle of Ani. All of the Armenian princes came out to meet him. In the fifteenth year of Trdat Saint Gregory sat on the throne of Saint Thaddaeus the apostle, having been consecrated by the patriarch Leontius in Caesarea.
— Thomson, Robert W. Dumbarton Oaks Papers, Vol. 43. (1989), pp. 125-226.

The books listed on Google Books agree; specifically, the numerous references in Agathangelos' History of the Armenians, and the references in The Armenian People from Ancient to Modern Times. Of course, her brother couldn't have been abducted by Muslim Arabs, as Islam didn't exist for another few centuries. — BRIAN0918 • 2006-06-20 11:47

Interesting - thanks for digging that up.

Thing is, when I did an online search for information I got the feeling that there may have been two or three princesses with this name, especially as I've encountered it on one or two lists of Armenian surnames. Is there any indication that this Xosroviduxt wrote a hymn?

Also, the article in New Grove lists fivebibliographic sources, none of which I have any access to at the moment, unfortunately; three of them relate either to poetry or to hymns, which suggests that if there is confusion, it's been going on for a good while. --AlbertHerring 17:07, 20 June 2006 (UTC)[reply]

It's highly unlikely that there is more than one Armenian princess by that name, whose brother converted to Christianity, and who was held in a fortress named "Ani". I would trust a couple peer-reviewed journal articles over a general dictionary anyday. If you want the sources for the journal articles, I can list those too. — BRIAN0918 • 2006-06-20 17:09

Point - I'll go ahead and edit the article, and I'll try and keep some material from both ends in, to indicate the controversy exists.

Thanks for finding this stuff - I'm severely limited in my online resources at the moment, unfortunately. --AlbertHerring 17:12, 20 June 2006 (UTC)[reply]

That's the best way to do it; just list the "confusion among authors". — BRIAN0918 • 2006-06-20 17:14

Okay, done - this should work. --AlbertHerring 17:22, 20 June 2006 (UTC)[reply]

GA Review

This review is transcluded from Talk:Khosrovidukht/GA1. The edit link for this section can be used to add comments to the review.

Reviewer: Wretchskull (talk · contribs) 13:22, 21 December 2021 (UTC)[reply]

Interesting article on an early woman composer. I've done some minor c/e prior to the review.

Lede

"The authenticity of the piece" --> "Its authenticity" because the preceding sentence is about the piece.
- Indeed! Fixed – Aza24 (talk) 21:50, 22 December 2021 (UTC)[reply]

Life

"Extremely little is known Khosrovidukht" I assume you mean "Extremely little is known about Khosrovidukht"
- Changed Aza24 (talk) 21:50, 22 December 2021 (UTC)[reply]

Works

I understand that writing down the whole English translation of the piece is really pushing it in terms of plagiarism and copyvio. I feel that the note about the translation shouldn't be in prose but rather a note, perhaps in the same location as the Armenian WikiSource reference below the text. It's up to you though.
- At one point I did include it—though I'm not sure if I ever published the edit—as I do remember typing it up. My issues with it were indeed the copyvio, but also that I noticed that for some reason there was slight differences in the original Armenian and the English translation, that is, one had a few lines that the other was missing. Open to including it, but I thought I'd share that. Aza24 (talk) 22:00, 22 December 2021 (UTC)[reply]

General

There are no ongoing edit-wars, discussions or major content changes. The article summarizes everything known about the person succinctly and is neutral.
The lede image is free, and the YouTube external audio may be fine. YouTube videos are generally unreliable, especially if it is by an anonymous/unverified account. This channel seems to be exclusively about Armenian music and may be reliable, and hopefully this isn't an account that copies music from Armenian shows, recordings and radio, as that would be copyvio; many of the videos appear old, which makes me a little concerned. This video in particular, however, does state the performers in the description. I'll give it a pass.
- Thanks for your lenience, my thoughts on the matter essentially align with yours Aza24 (talk) 22:00, 22 December 2021 (UTC)[reply]

References

No copyvio found.
Spotchecks:

Arzruni ref supports all cited text. However it doesn't state that she remained there in isolation for "at least twenty years" (my italics). Is there a ref it collides with that causes this?

Good catch. I'm not sure why I wrote that, but I suspect it was some unintentional editorializing, removed the "at least". Aza24 (talk) 22:00, 22 December 2021 (UTC)[reply]

Hacikyan ref supports the note.
Hovanessian & Margossian ref supports all cited text.
Rowe ref spells the name differently than this article. Here it is "Koghtnatsi", in the book, it is "Koghnatsi".

Adjusted

Armenian WikiSource copypaste has no issues.

@Aza24: Ping me when you're done. Wretchskull (talk) 13:22, 21 December 2021 (UTC)[reply]

@Wretchskull: all addressed, and I left a comment on the English translation matter. Aza24 (talk) 22:00, 22 December 2021 (UTC)[reply]

@Aza24: I've acknowledged your comment about the English translation. All I will say is that it is up to you to decide if it should be there or not. The article has been promoted to GA status, good job! Wretchskull (talk) 22:16, 22 December 2021 (UTC)[reply]