Talk:Keith Bostic (American football)/GA1
GA Review
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Heh. Forgot to start the review page. Here's the review...
- It is reasonably well written.
- a (prose):
b (MoS):
- short choppy prose and some MOS glitches with the lead
- a (prose):
- It is factually accurate and verifiable.
- a (references): b (citations to reliable sources): c (OR):
- a (references):
- It is broad in its coverage.
- a (major aspects): b (focused):
- a (major aspects):
- It follows the neutral point of view policy.
- Fair representation without bias:
- although getting rid of the informatino on the nephew would be a good thing
- Fair representation without bias:
- It is stable.
- No edit wars etc.:
- No edit wars etc.:
- It is illustrated by images, where possible and appropriate.
- a (images are tagged and non-free images have fair use rationales): b (appropriate use with suitable captions):
- a (images are tagged and non-free images have fair use rationales):
- Overall:
- Pass/Fail:
- Pass/Fail:
Specific concerns
- Lead - the first sentence of the second paragraph is clunky. Suggest rewording.
- Lead - Second paragraph, second sentence Try removing "once" from "... and Bostic was once named first team All-Big Ten." which should improve the flow.
- College - first three sentences all start with "he". Suggest rewording at least one, better to do two. Also, lots more of the rest of the sentences start "he
- You have his birth date and place info in the lead but not in the body of the article. Everything in the lead should be in the body of the article.
- Need to explain what USFL is, and give the full name before using the abbreviation.
- Need to explain Wild Card game.
- Is the link sufficient.--TonyTheTiger (t/c/bio/WP:CHICAGO/WP:LOTM) 01:37, 23 February 2009 (UTC)
- Please put in "work=Houston Chronicle" for all those Houston Chronicle sources? I don't care as much who the publisher is, but the name of the newspaper that published the information is important.
- For the other references, if it's a published newspaper, etc. use the work field in {{cite news}} to get the title of the paper/journal italicised.
- A LOT of short choppy sentences, that might be combined with neighbors to help the prose feel less choppy. While you don't want all long convoluted sentences, you don't want all short ones either. The second paragraph of Glanville era is really bad for this.
- Personal section, can you combine the first and second paragraphs to help the prose flow?
- Is he married? Whta'd he do after football? I don't think the information on his nephew is really needed in THIS article, suggest losing it.
- I could not find anything else about his family other than his son and nephew. Since when this failed before I did not have any family info, I thought adding these two things might bring it up to GA. I kind of think if his nephew did something notable, it should be mentioned. It helps fill in the family info a bit.--TonyTheTiger (t/c/bio/WP:CHICAGO/WP:LOTM) 01:09, 23 February 2009 (UTC)
- the problem is by basically only mentioning his conviction, you're making it kinda WP:COATRACKish. Mention the nephew played sports, which gives some connection with the uncle, but the conviction doesn't have any real connection to his uncle unless his uncle was in the car too. Ealdgyth - Talk 01:24, 23 February 2009 (UTC)
- I have expanded it to give proper weight to athletics.--TonyTheTiger (t/c/bio/WP:CHICAGO/WP:LOTM) 01:44, 23 February 2009 (UTC)
- I'm still not happy. I realise you think we need personal life information, but a nephew is a bit of a stretch. Since there is so little available on his immediate family, you're trying to reach to fulfill some imagined need for ANYTHING to fill the space. However, if the information isn't available, it's not available, and it won't hurt GA if you can't include what just isn't there. Another concern is that the personal information isn't in the lead, and then a big concern is the BLP issues for the nephew. I'd rather you just cut any mention of the nephew. Unless there is some reason to suppose Keith raised the boy, there isn't really any good connection to Keith. Leave the mention of the son in, but include it in the lead ... something like "His son played college football also." would be enough. Cut the nephew entirely, lack of personal information won't keep the article from GA. Ealdgyth - Talk 21:20, 23 February 2009 (UTC)
- Isn't this a double standard of sorts. We always mention nephews when they are relevant. Take Bob Chappuis and Rick Volk or Barry Bonds and Rosie Bonds to name the first two that pop into my head. Also, I think the Alou brothers, the Stasnys, etc use such relationships. This is stuff that is commonly used to fill out the family section.--TonyTheTiger (t/c/bio/WP:CHICAGO/WP:LOTM) 22:05, 23 February 2009 (UTC)
- I don't know, I didn't review those articles. If you would like to take it up on the GAN talk page, that's fine. I did consult Malleus and Geometry Guy before reaching a decision, too. Ealdgyth - Talk 22:09, 23 February 2009 (UTC)
- I'm still not happy. I realise you think we need personal life information, but a nephew is a bit of a stretch. Since there is so little available on his immediate family, you're trying to reach to fulfill some imagined need for ANYTHING to fill the space. However, if the information isn't available, it's not available, and it won't hurt GA if you can't include what just isn't there. Another concern is that the personal information isn't in the lead, and then a big concern is the BLP issues for the nephew. I'd rather you just cut any mention of the nephew. Unless there is some reason to suppose Keith raised the boy, there isn't really any good connection to Keith. Leave the mention of the son in, but include it in the lead ... something like "His son played college football also." would be enough. Cut the nephew entirely, lack of personal information won't keep the article from GA. Ealdgyth - Talk 21:20, 23 February 2009 (UTC)
- I have expanded it to give proper weight to athletics.--TonyTheTiger (t/c/bio/WP:CHICAGO/WP:LOTM) 01:44, 23 February 2009 (UTC)
- the problem is by basically only mentioning his conviction, you're making it kinda WP:COATRACKish. Mention the nephew played sports, which gives some connection with the uncle, but the conviction doesn't have any real connection to his uncle unless his uncle was in the car too. Ealdgyth - Talk 01:24, 23 February 2009 (UTC)
- I could not find anything else about his family other than his son and nephew. Since when this failed before I did not have any family info, I thought adding these two things might bring it up to GA. I kind of think if his nephew did something notable, it should be mentioned. It helps fill in the family info a bit.--TonyTheTiger (t/c/bio/WP:CHICAGO/WP:LOTM) 01:09, 23 February 2009 (UTC)
- What makes http://web.archive.org/web/20070516153117/http://www.thisistheusfl.com/1983usflterritorialassignments.htm a reliable source?
- Ref swapped.--TonyTheTiger (t/c/bio/WP:CHICAGO/WP:LOTM) 01:17, 23 February 2009 (UTC)
- It's a bit jargon heavy. A bit more explanations wouldn't hurt the feel of the prose.
- What language is unusually jargony (for a football article).--TonyTheTiger (t/c/bio/WP:CHICAGO/WP:LOTM) 01:47, 23 February 2009 (UTC)
- That was more meant to help towards an FAC if you were planning on that. Ealdgyth - Talk 21:20, 23 February 2009 (UTC)
- I'll go there right now.--TonyTheTiger (t/c/bio/WP:CHICAGO/WP:LOTM) 19:27, 24 February 2009 (UTC)
- I have changed the article per this feedback.--TonyTheTiger (t/c/bio/WP:CHICAGO/WP:LOTM) 08:43, 25 February 2009 (UTC)
- I'll go there right now.--TonyTheTiger (t/c/bio/WP:CHICAGO/WP:LOTM) 19:27, 24 February 2009 (UTC)
- That was more meant to help towards an FAC if you were planning on that. Ealdgyth - Talk 21:20, 23 February 2009 (UTC)
- What language is unusually jargony (for a football article).--TonyTheTiger (t/c/bio/WP:CHICAGO/WP:LOTM) 01:47, 23 February 2009 (UTC)
- I've put the article on hold for seven days to allow folks to address the issues I've brought up. Feel free to contact me on my talk page, or here with any concerns, and let me know one of those places when the issues have been addressed. If I may suggest that you strike out, check mark, or otherwise mark the items I've detailed, that will make it possible for me to see what's been addressed, and you can keep track of what's been done and what still needs to be worked on. Ealdgyth - Talk 00:21, 23 February 2009 (UTC)