Talk:Kayqubad II

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Name

The laqab, or honorific, Alâeddin or 'Alā al-Din, "Excellence of Religion," is helpful to know, but not strictly important for identifying this ruler. Such laqabs are used throughout the period and the title 'Alā al-Din is assigned to several notable figures in the Seljuq line and other contemporaries outside the dynasty.

The spelling "Kayqubad" is prominent in the numismatic literature and is a more transparent transliteration of the Arabic and Persian. Aramgar 00:01, 27 July 2007 (UTC)[reply]

Page moved?

This page was recently renamed "Alaeddin Keykubad II." The related talk page and history were not moved with with the name change. The article should be called "Kayqubad II" per Wikipedia naming conventions (see WP:UE). I am having trouble moving it. Please help. Aramgar 21:47, 10 August 2007 (UTC)[reply]

This article has been renamed from Alaeddin Keykubad II to Kayqubad II as the result of a move request. --Stemonitis 15:19, 20 August 2007 (UTC)[reply]

Move request

The following discussion is an archived discussion of the proposal. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made in a new section on the talk page. No further edits should be made to this section.

The result of the proposal was no consensus to move the page from Kayqubad II to Alaeddin Keykubad II, per the discussion below. Dekimasu よ! 13:14, 20 September 2007 (UTC)[reply]

Please see the disambiguation page Alaeddin Keykubad for the three homonymous Seljuk Sultan of Rûm of the 13th century. Explained in detail in the body of that page the various forms of the name used in different sources with direct links in the footnotes. There has been some discussion over this (see talk page) but it remains that Alaeddin Keykubad II is the correct form. There are further explanations along with the table comprising the names of all sultans. I would like to see that this is uncontested and then I will make move requests for other sultans as well, also providing indication of the use in sources.— Cretanforever 11:50, 15 September 2007 (UTC)[reply]

[Copied from Talk:Kayqubad III] I don't agree. Cahen's The Formation of Turkey uses "Kay Qubādh [numeral], [epithet]" in the index. The Cambridge History of Iran seems to use Kai-Qubād. The Origins of the Ottoman Empire indexes him as 'Alā' al-Dīn Kai-Qubād and generally as [epithet] [name]. If you wanted short, unambiguous, and no diacritics, Kayqubad would be a reasonable choice. So, no, I'm not in favour of moving to the names proposed, and if they were to be moved to long names I'd want different ones. Angus McLellan (Talk) 19:49, 15 September 2007 (UTC)[reply]

In addition to the sources mentioned by Angusmclellan, I would add that the numismatic literature identifies him as either “Kayqubad” or “Kayqubadh.” Kayqubad’s laqab is already present in the Persian/Arabic transcription ('Alā al-Dīn Kayqubād) and the Turkish language version (Turkish: II. Alâeddin Keykubad). This name, as well as those of the other sultans, should be left as is. Aramgar 18:06, 17 September 2007 (UTC)[reply]

The above discussion is preserved as an archive of the proposal. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made in a new section on this talk page. No further edits should be made to this section.

Move request 2

We don't need to have the same move discussion on three different pages. Usually this type of discussion is centralized as a multimove. Anyway, please continue disucssion at Talk:Kayqubad I. Dekimasu よ! 02:48, 28 September 2007 (UTC)[reply]

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Three Sultans at the same time.

@IAmAtHome: if you check Kilij Arslan IV's article too, it says that he was sultan as well. Islam Ansiklopedisi separately mentions all three of them as a Sultan. It is kinda anachronistic, but it is also weird that these three ruled at the same time. Also check this making mention about joint reign as well. This too Coins in the names of all three together were issued for the duration of the joint reign (647–55/1249–57). Beshogur (talk) 14:11, 5 February 2021 (UTC)[reply]

@Beshogur: Sorry for that mistake. I looked into source (no.18;Farīd, Muḥammad (2006). Tārīkh al-Dawlah al-ʻAlīyah al-ʻUthmānīyah [History of the Exalted Ottoman State] (in Arabic) (10th ed.). Beirut: Dar al-Nafa'is. pp. 115–116.) and just edited by mentioning in summary about Kayqubad II that he was not Seljuk Sultan. IAmAtHome (talk) 12:50, 8 February 2021 (UTC)[reply]

@IAmAtHome: Weird. A lot of sources, including Turkish mentions about a joint rule for a period of 2 decades. Can you give me the quote. Also TDV IA mentions that a khutba was read for the 3 brothers.[1] It is also possible that they both were kind of "lesser sultan" (kind of Yabgu). Beshogur (talk) 12:55, 8 February 2021 (UTC)[reply]