Talk:Karakorum

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Unverified information

This article is heavily Roylee-affected and needs to be cleaned up to conform to WP:NOR, WP:CS, and WP:RS policies. See Wikipedia:Requests for comment/Roylee and User:Mark Dingemanse/Roylee. Yes, I have seen that many statements are referenced somehow. Unfortunately, there is no reason to trust Roylee's edits and his use of sources. — mark ✎ 19:26, 7 December 2005 (UTC)[reply]

The following discussion is an archived debate of the proposal. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made in a new section on the talk page. No further edits should be made to this section.

The result of the debate was Move. —Wknight94 (talk) 14:05, 2 September 2006 (UTC)[reply]

Requested move

Karakorum (Mongolia) → Karakorum – Current page is due to a content fork that has now been eliminated. See Talk:Karakorum. Blisco 17:42, 23 August 2006 (UTC)[reply]

Survey

Add "* Support" or "* Oppose" followed by an optional one-sentence explanation, then sign your opinion with ~~~~

Support. - AjaxSmack 23:02, 24 August 2006 (UTC)[reply]

The above discussion is preserved as an archive of the debate. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made in a new section on this talk page. No further edits should be made to this section.

missing Stalin Era

The article does not mention the impact of Stalin's personality cult. Had the mentioned "expedition" of 1933-34 not pleaded for preservation of the palace, Karakorum would have suffered complete destruction like what happened to the majority of the Mongolian monasteries. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 77.173.226.152 (talk) 13:37, 4 February 2021 (UTC)[reply]

Critique

The article doesn't do any justice to the important role Karakorum played in Silk Road. It desperately needs improvements and expansion. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 59.66.241.70 (talk) 12:37, 21 April 2009 (UTC)[reply]

HI. If you think the article needs to be expanded, just expand it. But don't just copy and paste material from other people's pages. This is called plagiarism and constitutes a copyright violation.

Regarding specifically Karakorum's role in the trade networks between Europe and China that are nowadays called "Silk Road", I really would like to see a better source than just one sentence in one website. Yaan (talk) 13:18, 21 April 2009 (UTC)[reply]

P.S. Don't let this keep you from editing on Wikipedia. There is a lot of things that can (or need to) be done. Just keep in mind that copy and paste might pose a legal problem for this page, that it is always better to have a good source for things you write into articles, and that things you don't like might still be relevant for a certain topic.

Best Regards, Yaan (talk) 18:29, 21 April 2009 (UTC)[reply]

1388

The reference for the destruction of Karakorum in 1388 is given at the end of the paragraph, and is, I think, roughly on par with the Cambridge history of China reliably-wise when it comes to the history of Karakorum. And please note that the fact that something is not mentioned in a work about China does not mean it did not happen. More references for 1388 can be easily found with the help of google books and the like. I will check again if the one used for the article does mention Xu Da or not.

That said, there seem to be also sources that say the city was destroyed in 1380 already. My guess is this means that historians simply are not very sure when exactly it happened. Yaan (talk) 16:06, 18 May 2010 (UTC)[reply]

also Karakurum

Böri (talk) 08:08, 14 March 2012 (UTC)[reply]

Classic Mongolian

The classic monglian makes the intro a real eyesore.67.190.86.13 (talk) 03:40, 18 March 2013 (UTC)[reply]

Spelling?

The spelling of the name is completely different than how it is actually pronounced in Mongolian. A better transliteration would be "Kharakhorim" or "Harahorim". The X in Mongolian Cyrillic makes a 'kh' sound like in the Scottish 'loch'. The city shouldn't follow the same spelling of the Karakorum Highway in Pakistan, which is pronounced very differently. Altaihunters (talk) 07:00, 10 December 2013 (UTC)[reply]

Iron wheel naves?

That redirects to Naves as in naves of churches, not to wheel hubs. I don't know enough how to change that to redirect to wheel hubs. Could someone please fix that? Thanks, J.Appelzaad@gmail.com 20:39 UTC ninth of May 2014 — Preceding unsigned comment added by 87.211.115.30 (talk) 22:39, 9 May 2014 (UTC)[reply]

Done Thank you for the observation! --Iryna Harpy (talk) 02:02, 10 May 2014 (UTC)[reply]

Real Karakorum site

Placeing Tartary ancient capitol of Karakorum (Caracoran) near today's town of Kharkhorin in Mongolia stays in contradiction with XV and XVI century maps available in abundance. These maps placed Karakorum (named Caracoran on most maps) in north-east Asia, north to Great Wall of China and also Lake Baikal. Online view of 1633 Gerhard Mercator map.

City of Caracoran was built near first capitol of Grand Tartaria named Tartar on the river Tartar, present day Kolyma river. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 86.84.237.20 (talk • contribs)

Do you have a WP:RS for the assertion? The map you linked to places "Caracoran" north of the Arctic circle...and well north of a place with depictions of what appear to be dragons and demons and some inscription about "amazing illusions" and "diabolical creatures". And while it is locates Caracoran near Tartarie, it also has "MONGVL" in large font directly across the river from Caracoran, with Tartar further east. It appears that even in 1633 there was confusion in the geography of east Asia. Please discuss further. Mojoworker (talk) 21:26, 31 May 2016 (UTC)[reply]

Oryginal editor of topic.

Map is correct and there is many more (I found more then 200 of them from 1450-1800). Moghul or Mongul is not the same as today Mongolia. Tartarie was Empire that include many different nations and "countries" or tribes. Also location of Caracorum on maps is correct and author G. Mercator was famous cartographer who publish "first" Altas of the World with accurate details of different parts of the world.

I put oryginal information and source. Please put this description in Karakorum site because this topic is not a discussion, it is simply facts. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 86.84.237.20 (talk) 15:52, 1 June 2016 (UTC)[reply]

IP 86.84.237.20, your contributions only demonstrate that there are an abundance of maps, not that scholarly opinion supports your belief that you know where the original site was. You are interpreting WP:PRIMARY source maps you've found and interpreting them yourself (which is known as WP:OR: original research). What you are being asked for are WP:SECONDARY reliable sources where mainstream academics/experts (and not one or two who are considered WP:FRINGE) have put forth an argument for the location of Karakorum being where you are asserting the 'real' Karakorum was to be found. Do you have any reliable sources arguing that there is a serious case to consider that there is an alternative location? --Iryna Harpy (talk) 01:42, 2 June 2016 (UTC)[reply]

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Complete ludicrosy

There is a section in this article that claims "A large tree sculpted of silver and other precious metals rose up from the middle of the courtyard and loomed over the palace, with the branches of the tree extending into the building. Silver fruit hung from the limbs and it had four golden serpents braided around the trunk, while within the top of the tree was placed a trumpet angel, all as automata performing for the emperor's pleasure. When the khan wanted to summon the drinks for his guests, the mechanical angel raised the trumpet to his lips and sounded the horn, whereupon the mouths of the serpents began to gush out a fountain of alcoholic beverages into the large silver basin arranged at the base of the tree." I have never even used the talk section of wikipedia, but this is ridiculous. its only source is an obscure and controversial book "Genghis Khan and the Making of the Modern World" I'm not even sure that this book contains this information. Dougdapug (talk) 15:41, 7 July 2022 (UTC)[reply]