Talk:Karabakh Khanate/GA1

GA Review

The following discussion is closed. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.

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Reviewer: Amitchell125 (talk · contribs) 12:48, 19 August 2023 (UTC)

Happy to review this article. AM

Review comments

Lead section / infobox

• The lead section should be reduced in size. See MOS:LEADLENGTH - with just less than 34,000 characters, the article is recommended to have a length of no more than four paragraphs.

It hurts to remove info, but I've trimmed it down a bit. It is four paragraphs now. Thoughts? --HistoryofIran (talk) 00:10, 27 August 2023 (UTC)

It's an improvement, thank you! AM

• Unlink Iranian; Russian (MOS:OL) and these countries never existed then).

I've changed the Iran link to History of Iran and kept the Russian Empire, as the Karabakh khanate was controlled by three kingdoms of Iran and the Russian Empire, thoughts? --HistoryofIran (talk) 00:10, 27 August 2023 (UTC)

Not a problem now. AM

• (Not GA) The useful map in the infobox does lack a scale, and the colours of the neighbouring countries would imo be better having their own colours. I would perhaps add an inset map to indicate the position of the khanate in relation to modern national boundaries. Need any assistance? Amitchell125 (talk) 08:41, 23 August 2023 (UTC)

Hi Amitchell125. Thanks for yet another review, I highly appreciate it. When making the map, I did initially give the neighbouring countries their own color, but I thought it made the map look a bit convoluted and made the Karabakh Khanate domain look less noticeable. A inset map sounds good though, and I'll gladly accept assistance for that, as I dunno how to make one. --HistoryofIran (talk) 12:18, 23 August 2023 (UTC)

Fell free to use this version of the map, based on your excellent work. Amitchell125 (talk) 11:40, 27 August 2023 (UTC)

1 Background

• Iranian Armenia or Eastern Armenia – if there are two versions of the name, why are there two separate articles? Ditto Ottoman Armenia or Western Armenia.

Iranian Armenia and Ottoman Armenia "only" covers the early modern period when they were ruled by Iran and the Ottoman Empire, whilst the Eastern Armenia and Western Armenia cover a larger period. --HistoryofIran (talk) 14:07, 23 August 2023 (UTC)

Understood. AM

• 11th-century – has no hyphens. Ditto other examples elsewhere.
• the Turko-Persian name Karabakh – I would put Karabakh in italics here, as it is an introduced term.
• of area - ‘of the area’.
• the Ottoman Empire (c. 1299–1922) and Safavid Iran (1501–1736) – the dates are imo unneeded.

Respectfully I find these to nice to have, so that the reader can get an idea when these kingdoms were around, à la when we add the regnal period for rulers. --HistoryofIran (talk) 23:06, 26 August 2023 (UTC)

Understood. AM

• Might a map of the South Causacus be useful here (e.g. this?

I added this instead [1]. I do have a much more detailed map in the works, which I plan to have as the image instead. Thoughts? --HistoryofIran (talk) 00:13, 27 August 2023 (UTC)

Good for now. AM

• there is no contemporary portrait of Panah Ali Khan, but perhaps this image could be incorporated into the section.

I'm personally not a fan of that image, too fictional for my taste, and I think the current image of the Shusha fortress is more relevant/better here. --HistoryofIran (talk) 13:36, 25 August 2023 (UTC)

I quite understand. AM

2.1 Panah Ali Khan

• ally – ‘form an alliance’ sounds better imo.
• by five - ‘by the five’.
• in most of Iran – ‘across most of Iran’.

2.2 Ibrahim Khalil Khan

• Introduce Grigory Potemkin.
• in various places is redundant imo.

• Link cavalry.
• he made an attempt – who is being referred to here?
• through boats - ‘by using boats’ sounds better.
• restored ‘rebuilt’.
• subsequently is redundant imo.

• Link Persian; Armenian.
• Introduce Pavel Tsitsianov.
• (Not GA) thirty - ‘30’? (for the sake of consistency)
• "betrayal," - misplaced comma.

2.3 Mehdi Qoli Khan

• Russian emperor – ‘tsar’.

Like this? [2] --HistoryofIran (talk) 00:15, 27 August 2023 (UTC)

Amended it myself to save time, please revert if you don't like it. Amitchell125 (talk) 11:29, 27 August 2023 (UTC)

• a major letdown – sounds too informal/idiomatic, I would amend the start of this sentence to something like ‘The Iranians were disillusioned by the treaty’.
• to abolish the khanates – consider amending to something like ‘to eradicate the khanates’, to avoid repeating abolish.

Changed it to "In 1822, Mehdi Qoli Khan fled to Iran as a result of the attempts by the Russian general Aleksey Petrovich Yermolov to abolish the khanates, which occurred afterwards". Thoughts? --HistoryofIran (talk) 13:25, 25 August 2023 (UTC)

Looks OK. AM

• lived for the rest of his days collecting a state pension – ‘retired’.

3 Building activity

• states – ‘stated’, as the writer is no longer alive.
• in large fortress-towns – ‘in a large fortress-town’.

4 Coinage

• Link minted (Mint (facility)); numismatists; obverse (Obverse and reverse); toponym (Toponymy).
• shahi – should be in italics and placed inside Template:lang. Ditto rupia.
• The words in italics need to be placed inside Template:lang as well.
• According to the numismatists Alexander Akopyan and Pavel Petrov - are these individuals notable enough to be mentioned here? (If yes, link numismatists.)
• I would add a comma after toponym.
• under the name of Fath-Ali Shah – could be simplified to ‘under Fath-Ali Shah’.

Changed it to "in the name of Fath-Ali Shah", as his name was inscribed there, and it was not just under his rule. --HistoryofIran (talk) 13:34, 25 August 2023 (UTC)

5 Demographics

• are either – ‘were either’,

7 Administration

• Link rolls (Scroll).

Removed "rolls". --HistoryofIran (talk) 22:57, 26 August 2023 (UTC)

• use the example – ‘uses the example’.

8 Historiography

• Link chronicles; Soviet historiography Historiography in the Soviet Union); feudal (Feudalism).
• 20th-century – has no hyphen.

9 Notes

• the siege of their capital, Isfahan – consider moving the first link so that it covers all this text.

11 Sources

• Bournoutian, George (1980); Bournoutian, George (1999); Matthee, Rudi (2011); Reid, James J. (1978) are not used as sources in the article. These sources need to be deleted or perhaps moved to a Further reading section.

Spot checks looked fine.

On hold

I'm putting the article on hold for a week until 2 September to allow time for the issues raised to be addressed. Regards, Amitchell125 (talk) 16:18, 25 August 2023 (UTC)

@Amitchell125: I've tried to address everything. Thoughts? --HistoryofIran (talk) 00:15, 27 August 2023 (UTC)

Passing

Passing the article now, an interesting, if quite tricky (for me) read. Please feel free to replace your map with my version. Regards, Amitchell125 (talk) 11:41, 27 August 2023 (UTC)

The discussion above is closed. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.