Talk:Jomboy (sports media)

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On 28 March 2022, it was proposed that this article be moved to Jomboy. The result of the discussion was Town moved, but no consensus on the person.

Requested move 28 March 2022

The following is a closed discussion of a requested move. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made in a new section on the talk page. Editors desiring to contest the closing decision should consider a move review after discussing it on the closer's talk page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.

The result of the move request was: Town moved, but no consensus on the person. There are two major camps in this RM: the person being primary by usage, and the place being primary by long-term significance. This balances out into a WP:NOPRIMARY situation. (non-admin closure) — Ceso femmuin mbolgaig mbung, mellohi! (投稿) 18:00, 17 May 2022 (UTC)[reply]

Jomboy (sports media personality) → Jomboy
Jomboy → Jomboy, Uzbekistan

– Two and a half years after Jimmy "Jomboy" O'Brien became a well-known persona in sports media with his video on the Houston Astros sign stealing scandal, I think it's safe to say that he has become the primary topic for the word "Jomboy" in English, as borne out by Google and Google News searches. The city in Uzbekistan has a population of 11,000, and even the Uzbek Wikipedia only has a few paragraphs' worth of content on it. Only 82 people visited the city article in February, and of those 82 at least 36 clicked through to Jomboy O'Brien. You can see here the massive surge of views the city article got during the Astros scandal, and how it never died back down. There were only a few months prior to the Astros video that the city got more pageviews than it's gotten the past few months, and even then, Jomboy O'Brien was still a well-known baseball personality at that time. If you go back before June of 2018, the city consistently got 50-75 views per month, keeping in mind that at most 46 people visiting the article this past month were actually looking for it (probably considerably less considering some people just don't click navigation links).

If there isn't consensus for this, I would suggest still moving the city article and making Jomboy a DAB, and also perhaps giving O'Brien a more concise title... either Jomboy (entertainer) or Jimmy "Jomboy" O'Brien. -- Tamzin^{[cetacean needed]} (she/they) 13:53, 28 March 2022 (UTC) — Relisting. Steel1943 (talk) 21:26, 20 April 2022 (UTC)[reply]

I agree with your second paragraph. I think that, while Jomboy is prominent now, we are still talking about a city in Uzbekistan with tens of thousands of people. I think (sports media personality) is also a bit of a mouthful. We should drop media from the title, or go with your proposed. --Quiz shows 18:09, 28 March 2022 (UTC)[reply]
- I think Jomboy (sports media) would be more clear than sports personality. Mannysoloway (talk) 21:26, 28 March 2022 (UTC)[reply]
- It's not like it'd be the end of the world to go with the disambiguation proposal, but just to be clear, it's 11,000, not tens of thousands, and 11,000 isn't a lot. I grew up in a sleepy seaside town that only has three elementary schools, one middle school, and one high school, and it has 15,000 residents. Now, I'm an American, and different regions may have different standards of what counts as a "big city", but List of cities in Uzbekistan lists 18 with more than 100,000, so I don't get the impression this is big by Uzbek standards either. -- Tamzin^{[cetacean needed]} (she/they) 18:18, 29 March 2022 (UTC)[reply]
  - Not that it makes much of a difference, but the 11,000 figure is from 30 years ago; the most recent population figure in article is for 17,000. – Uanfala (talk) 23:09, 9 April 2022 (UTC)[reply]
  - Whoops, your right. I guess I miswrote, the figure you mentioned is what I meant. --Quiz shows 22:43, 20 April 2022 (UTC)[reply]
Support as proposed. The nom has made a great case that the city article is getting a significant chunk of readers who want the sports personality article. With 97 percent of pageviews, the personality article is WP:PRIMARYTOPIC by usage, and both articles have long-term significance. Making this move will help out our readers! Dohn joe (talk) 16:59, 29 March 2022 (UTC)[reply]
Strongly opposed - the educational value and significance of a longstanding city with over 10k residents (and the heart of a district with well over 100k) far, far, far surpasses a "well-known persona in sports media". I grant that pageviews strongly skew in one specific direction, but they also do for apple. I do agree that a shorter disambiguation parenthetical would be ideal. Elevating an American sports media personality over a city and region that most Americans have never heard of is peak WP:SYSTEMICBIAS. Red Slash 20:18, 30 March 2022 (UTC)[reply]
Actually, given that the district seems to have a greater claim to primary topic than the city, I would suggest and support a disambiguation page. Red Slash 20:18, 30 March 2022 (UTC)[reply]
Support as primary topic, based on the clear majority of page views and the debatable relative long-term significance. A population figure does not inherently imply long-term significance, and we can't simply presume that the place has "substantially greater enduring notability and educational value" based on the minimal evidence available. Adumbrativus (talk) 08:46, 6 April 2022 (UTC)[reply]
Support - seems obvious based on popularity alone. It's not like the current target is going to be changed to some weird redirect. Jauerback^dude?/_dude. 15:48, 6 April 2022 (UTC)[reply]
Support - maybe it's American bias, but especially since the addition to YES Network and the media coverage over Trevor Plouffe's World Series pick and other things recently, I think most people are coming here for the media company over the city. Valley2city^‽ 02:08, 7 April 2022 (UTC)[reply]
Disambiguate at base title. Sure, the youtuber is what most people are looking for these days, but article titles are meant to be stable over the long term and not change every couple of years because of the waxing and waning popularity of people in the public eye. Moving the town article and then creating a disambiguation page at Jomboy as suggested by Red Slash seems like a good compromise, especially given the existence of Jomboy District (which also happens to be the primary topic for "Jamboy" on uzwiki). This also means that Jomboy, Uzbekistan isn't precise enough, so we'd need to decide between Jomboy (city) and Jomboy (town). – Uanfala (talk) 23:09, 9 April 2022 (UTC)[reply]

It appears that many cities in Uzbekistan take precedence over their districts and are disambiguated with simply the name (like Jomboy is now) or with Uzbekistan appended (like Jomboy, Uzbekistan). That is, Jomboy, Uzbekistan is consistent with current practice. Dekimasuよ! 09:40, 17 May 2022 (UTC)[reply]

Disambiguate, yes the personality is primary by page views. But not by long-term significance. So for me, DAB should be at base name as per WP:PRIMARY.--Ortizesp (talk) 21:46, 20 April 2022 (UTC)[reply]
Support this alternative. None of those are well known to most people around the world. Iggy (Swan) (Contribs) 21:39, 21 April 2022 (UTC)[reply]
Support 2nd, neutral on 1st, suggest creating a DAB. The person gets way more views (5,019) than the place (169)[[1]] but the place probably has more long-term significance and PT swaps can cause problems. Crouch, Swale (talk) 11:01, 21 April 2022 (UTC)[reply]
Oppose According to the statistics, there's no primary topic, the city and district have a much longer term primary page, therefore the term should be disambiguated without a primary source. SportingFlyer T·C 21:21, 21 April 2022 (UTC)[reply]
Support The person is the clear primary topic here. ᴢxᴄᴠʙɴᴍ (ᴛ) 11:23, 23 April 2022 (UTC)[reply]
Support both as proposed—primary topic for the readership, and can be revisited again if things change. Dekimasuよ! 09:40, 17 May 2022 (UTC)[reply]

The discussion above is closed. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.

Moved to a shorter disambiguator

=/ Red Slash 23:35, 14 June 2022 (UTC)[reply]

Requested move 15 September 2022

The following is a closed discussion of a requested move. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made in a new section on the talk page. Editors desiring to contest the closing decision should consider a move review after discussing it on the closer's talk page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.

The result of the move request was: Not moved as proposed. Consensus is firmly against titling with "Jimmy O'Brien". There is debate between different various options, which would be better served by opening a new move request. (non-admin closure) Natg 19 (talk) 23:32, 29 September 2022 (UTC)[reply]

Jomboy (sports media) → Jimmy O'Brien (sports media) – It seems to me that, now that "Jomboy" has evolved from a single person into a full-fledged media company, it makes more sense to identify the man as Jimmy O'Brien rather than as Jomboy. Most reliable sources refer to him as Jimmy O'Brien, and only mention "Jomboy" as the name of his company. This was done in today's NY Times article about him (probably the most substantial reliable-source article about him), as well as in the New York Post, Forbes, and Deadline. An NJ.com article called him 'Jomboy' in the title, but consistently referred to him as O'Brien throughout the article.

O'Brien himself seems to be using a mix of his two names now. On Twitter he's Jomboy, but on Instagram he's Jimmy O'Brien. The Weekly Dumb is presented by Jimmy and Jake, but Talkin' Yanks is presented by Jomboy and Jake.

To use the article title criteria, I think both "Jomboy" and "Jimmy O'Brien" are recognizable names, but "Jimmy O'Brien" is more natural (it's odd to use "Jomboy" in a sentence in an encyclopedia; in fact, this article already refers to him "O'Brien" on most mentions) and more precise (it distinguishes him from his company).

There is the possibility that we could have a separate article about the company titled Jomboy Media, but I don't think it makes sense for O'Brien's article to be titled Jomboy. IagoQnsi (talk) 02:27, 15 September 2022 (UTC) — Relisting. GeoffreyT2000 (talk) 14:23, 22 September 2022 (UTC)[reply]

Note: I have started another discussion to move "Jimmy O'Brien" to "Jimmy O'Brien (hurler)"; see Talk:Jimmy O'Brien#Requested move 15 September 2022. –IagoQnsi (talk) 02:27, 15 September 2022 (UTC)[reply]

The previous move request appears to have ended with the single person remaining at Jomboy (sports media personality). Red Slash removed "personality" from the title without discussion in June, and that's what results in the current ambiguity between the person and the company. While Red Slash invited anyone to revert him if needed, that's not really how we go about moves when there are previous controversial requests, so the page should probably have been returned to the stable title as a starting point under WP:RMUM. I would oppose moving the page to any version of Jimmy O'Brien at this time, since that remains less recognizable. Dekimasuよ! 09:26, 15 September 2022 (UTC)[reply]
Oppose Jimmy O'Brien and support the current "(sports media)" disam. I don't think Jomboy/Jimmy O'Brien the person and Jomboy Media the company/YouTube channel are worth separating into two articles. Therefore, the simple "Jomboy (sports media)" is descriptive enough to cover the entirety of the topic, which is a person and his eponymous company. --Cerebral726 (talk) 13:07, 15 September 2022 (UTC)[reply]
Move to Jomboy (sportscaster). This is the usual disambiguation tag used for those involved in sports media. Agree with the above that he is not commonly known as "Jimmy O'Brien". 162 etc. (talk) 13:11, 15 September 2022 (UTC)[reply]
Oppose as per above; Jimmy O'Brien is not as recognizable, even on instagram his handle is still Jomboy. I'm not a huge fan of the sportscaster label 162 etc. proposed. That implies live commentary, when he's generally more notable for tweets and videos/podcasts. Nohomersryan (talk) 20:18, 16 September 2022 (UTC)[reply]
Sportscaster doesn't imply live commentary. Definitions at Cambridge, Collins, Britannica, etc. do not include any mention of the word "live". 162 etc. (talk) 21:53, 16 September 2022 (UTC)[reply]
I speak in Wiki sense. Our article kicks off with In sports broadcasting, a sports commentator (also known as sports announcer or sportscaster) provides a real-time commentary of a game or event, usually during a live broadcast, traditionally delivered in the historical present tense. I can see the argument of course but I prefer the current title which, in my estimation, more clearly implies that he's an online personality who makes Internet content and videos as opposed to a traditional pbp/color commentator. Nohomersryan (talk) 22:22, 16 September 2022 (UTC)[reply]
Move back to Jomboy (sports media personality). The entire problem exists because Red Slash cut a word from the title without consensus. O.N.R. ^(talk) 00:31, 23 September 2022 (UTC)[reply]
Move to Jomboy Media. The notable entity is the media company moreso than the person. White 720 (talk) 01:50, 24 September 2022 (UTC)[reply]

The discussion above is closed. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.

Total Views

The total views on Jomboy's account is now closer to 1.2 billion rather than 1.0 billion. Squarular (talk) 16:40, 15 April 2024 (UTC)[reply]