Talk:John Stanislaus Joyce

This article is within the scope of WikiProject Biography, a collaborative effort to create, develop and organize Wikipedia's articles about people. All interested editors are invited to join the project and contribute to the discussion. For instructions on how to use this banner, please refer to the documentation.BiographyWikipedia:WikiProject BiographyTemplate:WikiProject Biographybiography articles

Ireland Low‑importance

	Ireland portal This article is within the scope of WikiProject Ireland, a collaborative effort to improve the coverage of Ireland on Wikipedia. If you would like to participate, please visit the project page, where you can join the discussion and see a list of open tasks.IrelandWikipedia:WikiProject IrelandTemplate:WikiProject IrelandIreland articles
Low	This article has been rated as Low-importance on the project's importance scale.
	This article has been marked as needing an infobox.

Requested move

The following discussion is an archived discussion of a requested move. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made in a new section on the talk page. No further edits should be made to this section.

The result of the move request was: page moved. Wilbysuffolk Talk to me 18:06, 9 May 2012 (UTC)[reply]

John Joyce → John Joyce (Ireland)
John Joyce (disambiguation) → John Joyce

– Not the primary topic. In fact, I'm not even convinced that the person is even notable. I have suggested a disambiguator of 'Ireland', which is generally not appropriate, as disambiguation should be done for what a person was notable for. But after reading the article, I have no clue what I could choose as a dab. Schwede 66 01:33, 5 May 2012 (UTC)[reply]

Support. Agree that there's no clear indication that James Joyce's father is a primary topic. About the disambiguation, "Ireland" seems acceptable, but if someone can think of something more appropriate that would be fine. Jenks24 (talk) 09:11, 5 May 2012 (UTC)[reply]
- "John Stanislaus Joyce" does seem better than using "(Ireland)". Jenks24 (talk) 06:35, 6 May 2012 (UTC)[reply]
~~Oppose~~. This article should be AFDed for lack of notability rather than going through the trouble of moving it. INeverCry 09:23, 5 May 2012 (UTC)[reply]

Ok, I have prodded the article. Schwede 66 20:38, 5 May 2012 (UTC)[reply]
John Joyce is only known as the father of James Joyce, so he should be and is mentioned in the James Joyce article. Any inspirational influence that the father had on James Joyce's works can be mentioned in articles on those specific works. INeverCry 21:13, 5 May 2012 (UTC)[reply]

A move to John Stanislaus Joyce would be appropriate. And I strongly oppose deletion - John was an interesting man in his own right who has been considerably written about. Ellmann's biography of James deals with him in some detail. I also just today randomly came upon a biography of him - here - which I think clearly established notability. john k (talk) 21:44, 5 May 2012 (UTC)[reply]

Comment Well, if a couple of authors went to the trouble to write a biography of him, then that's a good indication of notability. I just wonder whether he was known by his full name. If he wasn't known by his middle name, then to use it for the mere purpose of disambiguation is not the proper way of doing it. My '(Ireland)' dab isn't that elegant either, but those who know more about him can possibly come up with something more appropriate. Schwede 66 09:21, 6 May 2012 (UTC)[reply]
- The biography calls him "John Stanislaus Joyce," so that seems like good evidence to base naming the article that. I recall Ellmann using his middle name a fair bit, as well. john k (talk) 01:05, 7 May 2012 (UTC)[reply]

Support move to John Stanislaus Joyce. INeverCry 23:06, 5 May 2012 (UTC)[reply]
Support move to John Stanislaus Joyce 4,690 GB hits, good enough In ictu oculi (talk) 22:00, 6 May 2012 (UTC)[reply]

Comment You will find that once the page gets moved, the number of hits will drop somewhat. Many of the hits will be from search engines, many will be from people wanting to find out about John Joyce (which is obviously not necessarily this person), and there are always some pages linked to the article that hasn't got a dab (with those links created by editors who don't check whether they are wikilinking to the right person). Schwede 66 03:28, 7 May 2012 (UTC)[reply]

The above discussion is preserved as an archive of a requested move. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made in a new section on this talk page. No further edits should be made to this section.