Talk:Jodie Turner-Smith

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I certainly feel this actress has reached a point in her career where she deserves a Wikipedia entry. There are numerous web sites that have started building 'profiles' for her, based on the very visible roles in TV series she has played and her upcoming starring movie roles. She is the only starring actor on both Nightflyers and Jett that doesn't have a Wikipedia entry yet, although her profile as an up and coming actress certainly warrants it. Her part in Queen & Slim is a starring role opposite Academy Award nominated actor Daniel Kaluuya. Tomdejong14 (talk) 00:07, 4 August 2019 (UTC)

Possibly, but we need multiple published, independent sources to show that she is notable. I'm afraid that IMDB is not reliable, nor is a fandom Wikia. So there is only one reliable source right now. More are needed to avoid this article being deleted. Good luck, Railfan23 (talk) 00:12, 4 August 2019 (UTC)

Oops, I just changed all the references to IMDb, since I inferred from an earlier comment that it was reliable (I would assume it is, since it's heavily moderated). But there are plenty of other sources, so I'll update. Tomdejong14 (talk) 01:25, 4 August 2019 (UTC)

I'm afraid IMDB isn't: see the table at Wikipedia:Reliable sources/Perennial sources. It would be great if you could add some proper reliable sources. Thanks, Railfan23 (talk) 01:29, 4 August 2019 (UTC)

Date and location of birth

Annie.svu has pointed out that in a 2012 interview with Paper magazine, Jodie's year of birth is listed as 1986 (instead of 1988, as it's usually listed in more recent articles). I would guess the original source is more likely to be correct. This article also mentions her to be UK-born, instead of Jamaican-born. Her roots are probably Jamaican, but I would guess it makes more sense for her to have been born in the UK. Tomdejong14 (talk) 10:41, 16 August 2019 (UTC)

References

Nationality

@Trillfendi: "This goofy theory that doing American movies makes someone American when she already said she isn’t yet is nonsensical." That isn't what was said at all; you know from my edit summaries that I was citing MOS:CONTEXTBIO, which supported her being referred to as American as she immigrated to the United States during childhood and began her career in American projects. The Guardian source says both "British" and "British-born" and then says she moved to the U.S. as a child and began her career there. Maybe WP:VNT supports calling her British/British-born then, however it's an essay, not a policy or guideline like MOS:CONTEXTBIO. See MOS:OPENPARABIO: "The first sentence should usually state: [...] Context (location, nationality, etc.) for the activities that made the person notable." I am changing it to British-American. Abbyjjjj96 (talk) 15:22, 3 June 2021 (UTC)

I have seen this on another person. There is nothing to indicate that she holds United States nationality. Even if she has lived in Los Angles since 2009 there is no source at the moment saying she is a national of that country. This is a BLP and needs sources. Protected while you discuss. CambridgeBayWeather, Uqaqtuq (talk), Huliva 18:46, 3 June 2021 (UTC)

@CambridgeBayWeather: She does not need to be a citizen. Per MOS:CONTEXTBIO:

The opening paragraph should usually provide context for the activities that made the person notable. In most modern-day cases, this will be the country, region, or territory, where the person is a citizen, national, or permanent resident; or, if the person is notable mainly for past events, where the person was a citizen, national, or permanent resident when the person became notable.

Abbyjjjj96 (talk) 19:04, 3 June 2021 (UTC)

That changes nothing. Saying she is British-American gives the impression that she either is a US national or holds citizenship in that country. Saying she i British born and resident in the US is OK. CambridgeBayWeather, Uqaqtuq (talk), Huliva 19:24, 3 June 2021 (UTC)

I was under the impression you weren't supposed to use "X-born" though? I can see how British-American suggests dual citizenship. But per mos:contextbio, she is American. I would suggest "British-born American" but I'm not certain that X-born isn't a rule violation. An alternative suggestion is "American actress and model" and then in the next sentence say she was born in the UK and immigrated to the US as a child (e.g. Mila Kunis, Nina Dobrev, although they are citizens). Abbyjjjj96 (talk) 20:07, 3 June 2021 (UTC)

Okay, I actually looked at the html at Kunis and Dobrev's pages and the notes explicitly say not to mention the birth country:

Please do not add SOVIET, JEWISH, RUSSIAN, or UKRAINIAN here. Her ethnicity/country of birth is covered in the article and does not belong in the opening sentence as per WP:OPENPARA

Do not put "Bulgarian-Canadian" or "Bulgarian-born Canadian" as Canada is where Dobrev first gained notability. MOS:ETHNICITY states that places of birth are to not be mentioned in lead if it's not where they first gained notability.

Abbyjjjj96 (talk) 20:11, 3 June 2021 (UTC)

Kunis and Dobrev might fall under MOS:CONTEXTBIO's previous nationalities or the place of birth should not be mentioned in the lead unless relevant to the subject's notability However, there is no evidence that Turner-Smith is a former Brit (or is a dual citizen).—Bagumba (talk) 08:24, 11 June 2021 (UTC)

Abbyjjjj96, Turner-Smith is British. That's based on the sources and her own words. MOS:CONTEXTBIO does not change that; it merely says that in certain cases wheere person is notably connected with another location, then that may be relevant to include as well. – wallyfromdilbert (talk) 16:42, 11 June 2021 (UTC)

Perhaps everybody gaining further clarity on the Manual of Style talk page and using Turner-Smith as an example should be done before revisiting this. Trillfendi (talk) 23:25, 10 June 2021 (UTC)

I think something simpler than the current sentence would be helpful, such as "is a British actress who lives in the United States" or mentioning she has lived in the United States in the lead paragraph but not the lead sentence. As I also mentioned on the MOS talk page, most sources appear to refer to her as British, and she states she is "not American" in an interview cited in the article [1]. The current "British-born" seems to imply she is no longer British, and is odd when the cited article calls her simply "a British actor" in its actual body copy. – wallyfromdilbert (talk) 04:01, 11 June 2021 (UTC)