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The matter of Dr. James R. Russell's article

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I wrote Professor/Dr. James R. Russell's article as he is indeed a world known scholar in his field and very notable. I checked that his colleague, Dr. Wheeler Thackston had an article, which he has since 2004. They are both in the same department at Harvard, and on comparable par. Dr. Russell's opus "Zoroastrianism in Armenia" is a major work published by Harvard University amongst other works of his. The article is not a vanity article and Dr. Russell who occupies the Mashtots Chair in Armenian Studies, at Harvard University, which is a very prestigious chair, is more than noteworthy. As much as Dr. Wheeler Thackston is. Dr. Russell's article is James R. Russell. The warning should be removed. Thanks. --- (Bob) Wikiklrsc 20:27, 27 February 2006 (UTC)[reply]

looking at the points made in the edit summary, and the points here, removing it seems fair enough. If there are any issues, I suggest discussing them here -- sannse (talk) 21:04, 27 February 2006 (UTC)[reply]

Thanks, Sannse, for removing the warning flag. Besides everything else, Dr. Russell did his Ph.D. early on at The University of London SOAS, under one of the most important scholars of our time in Zoroastrianism, Dr. Mary Boyce. Also, the person flagging this article, originally, should have looked at one of the links I put on to Dr. Michael Stone's review of one of Dr. Russell's books (a compilation of a selected 91 of Dr. Russell's published scholarly papers and articles).

Dr. Stone makes it clear that Dr. Russell is a major figure in the field, as is Dr. Stone. To wit, quoting from Dr. Stone's review, "James Russell is Mashtots Professor of Armenian Studies at Harvard University and, so, holds one of the most prestigious Armenian chairs in North America" ... and "James Russell is a learned and productive scholar and has cast light on numerous aspects of Armenian religious and cultural life ..."

To add to it all, the chair Dr. Russell holds at Harvard is a very internationally sought after chair, and no one gets that kind of university chair unless they are consummate scholars, world-respected in their field, and extremely important. The chair is a lifetime chair. All else failing to the original objector, just the fact that Harvard University gave the Mashtots chair to him should end any debate. And that his colleague, Dr. Wheeler Thackston on a comparable par, and content of Wikipedia article, has had his article here in Wikipedia since August 2004, unflagged. Thanks for bringing some reality to this discussion, and removing the spurious warning flag. --- Bob Wikiklrsc 21:42, 27 February 2006 (UTC)[reply]

Do not remove the warning! Dsc 21:33, 27 February 2006 (UTC)[reply]

Your reasons for the warning are invalid. See the discussion ---(Bob) Wikiklrsc 21:42, 27 February 2006 (UTC)[reply]

Hi Sannse and others. The article regarding James R. Russell is, I think, a vanity article, and Russell is not of sufficient notability to be incorporated into Wikipedia. Russell is a Harvard Mashtots Professor of Armenian Studies, so what? Will you accept any (assistant/associate or endowed chair) professor of any university or should he/she be the first under equals, which is shown by prestigious memberships of academies and so on? I also like to refer to the web site article [1], which shows that Russell’s notability and academic integrity is debated by more than one person. Therefore I will flag this article and warn the readers Dsc 13:29, 28 February 2006 (UTC)[reply]

The problem is that you are going about this the wrong way. If you believe an article is not notable enough for inclusion then you need to list it for deletion. No amount of attention is going to change whether he is notable or not. And it is never appropriate to use "attention" without explaining fully on the talk page, because the template references the talk page. I would suggest that, if you are convinced that this article is not notable, then you list it for deletion. I'm rather sure that it will survive, but it's up to you whether you try. I am going to remove the banner one more time. If you replace it, then I will call in another admin to give their opinion on protecting the page. -- sannse (talk) 21:32, 28 February 2006 (UTC)[reply]
It appears that this problem may be a peripheral side effect of the battles over Armenian Genocide. While there are one or two parts of the article which could use attention, the notability of Russell is not, as Sannse correctly says, a matter for the {{attention}} tag. Furthermore web sites that claim he is non-notable, in response to a letter published in the NY Book Review, seem to make him more notable rather than less. Please do not replace the {{attention}} tag. Rich Farmbrough 22:21 28 February 2006 (UTC).

Dear all, including User:Dsc, no one could discredit Dr. Russell's erudition and scholarly work in his field, on any rational basis. And they haven't.

The website quoted by User:Dsc is a political website, with a non-NPOV, and the person on the website, un-named, is entitled to his opinion on the heated Turkish/Armenian question. The relevant comments on the site are un-signed, and the website's domain check shows no person's name behind it. Whoever it is, the person is entitled to his opinion, too, but hardly something to countermand and nullify Dr. Russell's erudition or hundreds of scholarly articles and books in his subject of expertise and others.

The website that User:Dsc quotes is a politically non-npov to say the very least. It is something way above my head as a scholar --- the Turkish/Armenian genocide debate.

But that is not the essence of the work of Dr. Russell. That was an article Dr. Russell wrote and was published by a highly reputable review --- The New York Review of Books.

His erudite work on Zoroastrianism is enough to make him worthy of an article, as his renowned Ph.D. advisor Dr. Mary Boyce has her article, and so does his colleague Dr. Wheeler Thackston.

Political arguments about the Armenian genocide or alleged Armenian Genocide, are not germain to Dr. Russell's article.

And I am not versed in that political debate.

I am versed in Dr. Russell's scholarly work which Dr. Michael Stone, a very strong scholar in Dr. Russell's field, [2] ... says, in reviewing Dr. Russell's 2004 book Armenian and Iranian Studies by James R. Russell, (Harvard Armenian Texts and Studies, 9), a compilation of some ninety one of Dr. Russell's published scholarly articles, Dr. Stone says "James Russell is Mashtots Professor of Armenian Studies at Harvard University and, so, holds one of the most prestigious Armenian chairs in North America. In this very thick book he has gathered and reprinted his scholarly articles of the past two decades, including some which are still in print, as well as a couple of unpublished pieces. They are 91 in number. It is a great service to have gathered them all in one place, because they are scattered in very numerous journals, and I cannot imagine that anyone has actually seen all of them before. It is a service also because as diverse as are the journals, so widespread and extensive are Russell's interests. ..."

And continuing the review by Dr. Michael Stone, also quoting, "James Russell is a learned and productive scholar and has cast light on numerous aspects of Armenian religious and cultural life ...".

And finally, Dr. Michael Stone closes his review, quoting Dr. Stone, "Harvard Armenian Series and NAASR [are] to be congratulated for sponsoring the work of this very fecund and insightful scholar."

So Dr. Russell is not a run-of-the-mill scholar, and deserves his article. And no one will rationally dispute his chair at Harvard, the Mashtots Chair, as being one of the most academically prestigious chairs in the world in Dr. Russell's field.

I cannot get involved in international historical politics of a heated kind, as with the Armenian Genocide debate. That is off the thrust of Dr. Russell's Wikipedia article. Dr. Russell is a very significant scholar and professor in his field and a field of interest to Wikipedia. Confer Zoroastrianism, Dr. Mary Boyce and similar subjects. --- (Bob) Wikiklrsc 22:53, 28 February 2006 (UTC)[reply]

Attention

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Is indeed required to get the references for the articles up to scratch. Books should have ISBN if possible. This is not enough to require an {{attention}} tag, IMHO. Rich Farmbrough 22:21 28 February 2006 (UTC).

This sounds like something Bob can rectify (once he has his regular connection back). I think any more suggestions like this one would be useful -- sannse (talk) 20:37, 1 March 2006 (UTC)[reply]

Hi Sannse and Rich. Yes, good points, of course. When I get back to a reasonable connection schedule, I'll do my best. Anyone else can help, too. Thanks ever. --- (Bob) Wikiklrsc 21:00, 1 March 2006 (UTC)[reply]

I just finished doing it now. --- (Bob) Wikiklrsc 02:36, 2 March 2006 (UTC)[reply]
Looks good to me. Rich Farmbrough 10:43 2 March 2006 (UTC).
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