Talk:Islamic State – Sahel Province

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On 9 October 2024, it was proposed that this article be moved from Islamic State – Sahil Province to Islamic State – Sahel Province. The result of the discussion was moved.

Chapter ethnic base misses the more important class / caste conflict

The chapter "Settlement area and ethnic base" misses the class /caste conflict. It presents the conflict as a stuggle between different ethnic groups like the Fulani and the Idaksahak, as if these groups are socially unified behind this struggle. Both are fundamentally untrue. As explained in the Wiki-pages on the Fulani (chapter Slavery and caste system) and Idaksahak people: "Idaksahak share with Tuareg, a three part caste system of "free masters" (...) and the "captives/slaves"."

What I rememeber from working in six Sahelian countries: Most violent conflicts in the Sahel are between (ex) slaves or peasants, and those members of their (former) own ethnic upper class, who refuse to give up on slavery- or feudalism-like social relations. This explains much better the appeal that some violent jihadist movements (and previously the Saharawi-movement) have on the lower classes: They promise (and often practice) emancipation, and protection against abuse and extortion by their (former) owners. They are often simply more effectively in protecting emancipation (and much more violent) then government or donor supported projects and movements.

This is(or at least was) also partly true for Al Shabaab in Somalia (The Rahaweyn-batallion, often considered lower-caste), and it also explains the (stalled violence) dynamic in Darfur, where millions of farmers stay in the camps, because pastoralist groups only allow people back in the villages they captured under Bashir, if these farmers behave as serfs or slaves.

This chapter misses to explain this dynamic completely, only skidding the subject but suggesting the opposite in the last paragraph ("However, the EIGS would include members from the two communities...)"

Shall I try to contact an academic to improve this or suggest good publications?

Or should we attempt to write a new Wiki-lemma on stalled caste-emancipation struggles driving violence in the Sahel? And link the other relevant pages to that?

Pieter. Pieter Felix Smit (talk) 12:07, 11 January 2023 (UTC)[reply]

Requested move 18 September 2023

The following is a closed discussion of a requested move. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made in a new section on the talk page. Editors desiring to contest the closing decision should consider a move review after discussing it on the closer's talk page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.

The result of the move request was: moved. ErikHaugen (talk | contribs) 20:19, 26 September 2023 (UTC)[reply]

Islamic State in the Greater Sahara → Islamic State – Sahil Province – Several sources state that the Islamic State in the Greater Sahara renamed itself the Islamic State – Sahil/Sahel Province in March 2022 to distinguish itself from ISWAP. These include this ACLED summary^[1] from January 2023, which refers to the group as IS Sahel. This American Enterprise Institute article also mentions the name change, but still refers to the group as ISGS to distinguish it from the Islamic State - Sinai Province (ISSP). Moving this page from Islamic State in the Greater Sahara to Islamic State - Sahil Province (or Sahel) would fall under WP:COMMONNAME.

References

^ [1]

Jebiguess (talk) 18:57, 18 September 2023 (UTC) Jebiguess (talk) 18:57, 18 September 2023 (UTC)[reply]

I agree all other Wikipedia articles of ISIS branches use their "official name", why not this one?--Garmin21 (talk) 02:22, 19 September 2023 (UTC)[reply]

Support: per nom and WP:COMMONNAME .. FuzzyMagma (talk) 10:28, 21 September 2023 (UTC)[reply]

The discussion above is closed. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.

Requested move 9 October 2024

The following is a closed discussion of a requested move. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made in a new section on the talk page. Editors desiring to contest the closing decision should consider a move review after discussing it on the closer's talk page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.

The result of the move request was: moved. (closed by non-admin page mover) Cremastra — talk — c 22:28, 17 October 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Islamic State – Sahil Province → Islamic State – Sahel Province – “Sahil” is the Arabic transliteration for “Sahel”, which is in English. If we have to keep it as “Sahil” then by that logic we would have to move Islamic State – Khorasan Province to Islamic State – Khurasan Province. Anyways, my point is that I do not recall any sources using the term “Sahil Province” rather than “Sahel Province”; if there are any sources which show Sahil Province, then feel free to show them. TheLibyanGuy (talk) 21:01, 9 October 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Support per nom, RSs use Sahel

Kowal2701 (talk) 13:51, 10 October 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Support: As most of the media source refers it to as IS – Sahel Province, we should move the page.

Golem469 (talk) 13:52, 10 October 2024 (UTC)[reply]

The discussion above is closed. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.

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