Talk:Iranians in Japan

Viewpoints

The article seems a bit biased. Too much weight placed on illegal immigration, practically no info about legal immigrants and residents, including those who are not in low income. Article should include more viewpoints and diversify opinion on the issues. Laval (talk) 20:33, 28 February 2012 (UTC)

Defective reference

Hi, please fix this and restore it to the migration history section: <ref>Sarah M. Nelson, (1993, pp. 243–258) </ref> Informata ob Iniquitatum (talk) 06:06, 7 October 2017 (UTC)

Undue weight: Persian influence on Ancient Japan

This article is about Iranians in Japan. It is therefore reasonable to include accounts of Persians in ancient Japan.
However, the first section of this article gives off the impression that Persian influence in Japanese culture is very significant. It is titled "Migration history".
While it is extremely likely that Persians found their way to Japan, it is not clear how much of a cultural influence this had on Japan.
To explain my doubts about the significance of Persian influence, there is not a single mention of Persia in the Wikipedia article about the Culture of Japan.
It is also very unspecific and the references (which I have access to) are a mess.

• What and how much is "noteworthy Iranian influence"? I unfortunately do not have access to the given sources.
• Who is this "number of historians"? How noteworthy and accepted is this suggestion that a number of Japanese clans (which?) are of Persian origin? I am especially critical here because there are other claims about origins of Japanese clans which are widely accepted as fringe theories. (See Wikipedia article on Japanese-Jewish common ancestry theory)
• Is this "suggestion" of Scythian influence on Japanese culture and its aristocratic system noteworthy? Is this view generally accepted, what do other authors say? Where is the reference?
• What does the Kingdom of Silla have to do with Japan in this context?
• There is also no source given for the claim that "Scythian and especially Persian art had an impact on Japan during the Kofun period." And how big was that alleged impact?
  

I have also found multiple problems with what is stated in this articles and the references.

• Reference 7. and 10. likely contain the same content (reference 7 is an expired Japan Times article). Reference 10 "Research uncovers evidence that ancient Japan was 'more cosmopolitan' than previously thought" merely states that there is account of a single Persian official who was in its capital at that time and "may" have tought mathematics (and that Roman coins were found in Okinawa). Reference 7 does not support any claims in the first paragraph, it only supports the second paragraph of this article section.
• Reference 8. and 11. are the same: The Japan Times article "Paji"; Persian influence in ancient Japan?; CM of the week: Nissin Foods | The Japan Times" is an overview of TV shows and commercials in that week. It contains nothing other relevant than a short description of a TV show in which a "legend" about Persian influence on a Japanese prince is examined at several shrines. ("the Legend has it he [a Japanese prince] was influenced by Persian culture"). These is absolutely nothing in that reference that supports anything written in the first or second paragraph. It is a poor quality source.
• Reference 9. and 12. are the same: This article basically contains the same information as reference 7. and 10: Infrared imagining of a wooden plate reveals that a single Persian official lived in Japan's capital and is thought to have taught mathematics. Apart from that, it merely states that Japan was heavily influenced by Tang culture, that it had trade relations along the Silk Road, including Persia, also mentions the Roman coins in Okinawa, and that a statue of a buddhist deity "is thought to have its origins in part from a similar" Persian one and and other musings of Japanese bloggers. Again, the only thing that is supported by this reference is the second paragraph.
  

The first two paragraphs of this article give of the impression that someone tried to overstate the influence of the Silk Road and legitimize the claim of very significant Persian influence on ancient Japan with a number reference marks which are duplicates and more often than not do not even support these claims. I suggest the following:

• Delete unsupported sentences "A number of historians also suggest that some Japanese clans are originally of Persian origin and were granted the title of local feudal lords. Scythian and especially Persian art had an impact on Japan during the Kofun period. Persian influence is also noted in the Kingdom of Silla."
• Remove references 7., 8., 9. (duplicates/expired) and 11. (not a good reference).
• Change sentence "A 7th-century wooden writing tablet (called a Mokkan), found in Nara in the 1960s, and recently deciphered, mentioned a local resident who came from the Persian empire." to something like "A 7th-century wooden writing tablet (called a Mokkan), found in Nara in the 1960s, and recently deciphered, mentioned a Persian official who is thought to have taught mathematics."
  

Any other suggestions? --2003:F6:2717:2500:1CF:D54C:242B:6C0D (talk) 18:11, 3 January 2020 (UTC)