Talk:Immovable Ladder

Israel Low‑importance

This article is within the scope of WikiProject Israel, a collaborative effort to improve the coverage of Israel on Wikipedia. If you would like to participate, please visit the project page, where you can join the discussion and see a list of open tasks.IsraelWikipedia:WikiProject IsraelTemplate:WikiProject IsraelIsrael-related articles

Low

This article has been rated as Low-importance on the project's importance scale.

Project Israel To Do:

Here are some tasks awaiting attention:

Assess : Rate the Unassessed Israel-related articles and Unknown-importance Israel-related articles.
Cleanup : Cleanup listing for this project is available. See also the list by category and the tool's wiki page.
Collaborate : Participate in WikiProject Israel Palestine Collaboration.
Copyedit : Timeline of the Israeli–Palestinian conflict in 2005
Deletion sorting : Participate in discussions at WikiProject Deletion sorting/Israel.
Expand : Ayala Procaccia, Diamond industry in Israel, Edna Arbel, Levin Kipnis, Rami Kleinstein, Sephardic Haredim, Zman Tel Aviv, Nachum Heiman, Public Defence (Israel), Prisoner of Zion, Trial of Benjamin Netanyahu, Day to Mark the Departure and Expulsion of Jews from the Arab Countries and Iran, Pre-Modern Aliyah
See also Articles needing translation from Hebrew Wikipedia.
Geographical coordinates : Add geographic coordinates to Israel articles missing geocoordinate data.
Infobox : Add infoboxes to Israel articles needing infoboxes.
Maintain : See Israel articles needing attention.
Map : See discussion at Module:Location map/data/Israel. Add maps to articles in Wikipedia requested maps in Israel.
NPOV : Jewish exodus from Arab and Muslim countries
Photo : Add pictures to articles in Wikipedia requested photographs in Israel.
Stubs : See Israel stubs.
Update : Basic Law proposal: Israel as the Nation-State of the Jewish People
Other :
- Translate to Hebrew : David Bar-Hayim, Guy Bavli, and Guy Oseary.

Christianity: Jesus / Catholicism / Eastern O. / Oriental O. Low‑importance

	Christianity portal This article is within the scope of WikiProject Christianity, a collaborative effort to improve the coverage of Christianity on Wikipedia. If you would like to participate, please visit the project page, where you can join the discussion and see a list of open tasks.ChristianityWikipedia:WikiProject ChristianityTemplate:WikiProject ChristianityChristianity articles
Low	This article has been rated as Low-importance on the project's importance scale.
	This article is within the scope of the Jesus work group, a task force which is currently considered to be inactive.
	Catholic Church portal This article is supported by WikiProject Catholicism.
	This article is supported by WikiProject Eastern Orthodoxy.
	This article is supported by WikiProject Oriental Orthodoxy.

Palestine Low‑importance

	Palestine portal This article is within the scope of WikiProject Palestine, a team effort dedicated to building and maintaining comprehensive, informative and balanced articles related to the geographic Palestine region, the Palestinian people and the State of Palestine on Wikipedia. Join us by visiting the project page, where you can add your name to the list of members where you can contribute to the discussions.PalestineWikipedia:WikiProject PalestineTemplate:WikiProject PalestinePalestine-related articles
Low	This article has been rated as Low-importance on the project's importance scale.

Religion Low‑importance

	Religion portal This article is within the scope of WikiProject Religion, a project to improve Wikipedia's articles on Religion-related subjects. Please participate by editing the article, and help us assess and improve articles to good and 1.0 standards, or visit the wikiproject page for more details.ReligionWikipedia:WikiProject ReligionTemplate:WikiProject ReligionReligion articles
Low	This article has been rated as Low-importance on the project's importance scale.

Myths regarding the ladder

The book Jerusalem: The Biography by Simon Sebag Montefiore briefly mentions some myths regarding this ladder. I'm planning to add this info later, but should I forget, someone else could look it up. Gabbe (talk) 10:46, 30 October 2012 (UTC)[reply]

Done. Gabbe (talk) 15:43, 30 October 2012 (UTC)[reply]

So when was it put there?

> The first account by mention of the ladder was related to a Firman or edict dated in 1757 [...] the first ladder appeared in the early 1840s.

So which is it??

Agreed. I really hate this crap. When folks put a claim, they should bother to actually read the article in order reconcile their new with any existing & competing claims, and the article should reflect this reconciliation. If folks can't be bothered to make their additions to an article non-contradictory, they might as well leave the article alone. There is absolutely no excuse for leaving an article in this state, and whoever is responsible for this should be ashamed of their laziness.72.29.61.245 (talk) 15:29, 14 April 2014 (UTC)[reply]

The article has been edited to clarify the dates. Without researching the original text, it would appear the earlier date was for textual documentation in which the ladder "appeared," the latter date with images in which the ladder appeared.

I suggest this issue resolved & can be removed from the talk page. 77th Trombone (talk) 19:18, 2 March 2019 (UTC)[reply]

Where are the sources?

Where are the sources for this page?

The ladder was mentioned in 1757?
The ladder has never moved, then later in the article it has?
It's made of cedar?
Pope Paul VI gave orders for no one to move the ladder?
A mason first placed the ladder where it stands today?

There is also a factual inaccuracy. Pope Paul VI may have participated in some kind of ceremony with the keys, but the keys to the church have been in the hands of two Muslim families since around 638 AD, when Caliph Umar I captured Jerusalem from the Byzantines. There may have been a brief, but temporary, interruption of this after the Crusaders recaptured the city in 1099. Hansgruber209 (talk) 03:11, 15 March 2013 (UTC)[reply]

And I wonder why Pope Paul VI is mentioned at all, since it is a matter, according to the article, of Greeks and Armenians. Richardson mcphillips (talk) 03:27, 30 April 2015 (UTC)[reply]

Sorry, I see the confusion. The article mentions 6 Churches having jurisdiction over the church, and having to agree. So the real problem is where the article says "Various key differences in rituals, liturgy, dogma and theology divide the two churches, rather than the dispute over ownership and use of the Church of the Holy Sepulchre": this should probably be changed to "Various key differences in rituals, liturgy, dogma and theology divide the churches, rather than the dispute over ownership and use of the Church of the Holy Sepulchre". Richardson mcphillips (talk) 16:55, 14 March 2016 (UTC)[reply]

"pontifical orders"

Could we have a reference for the "pontifical orders of Pope Paul VI in 1964"?--Richardson mcphillips (talk) 03:35, 30 April 2015 (UTC)[reply]