Talk:Hebrides/GA1

GA Review

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Reviewer: Mykleavens (talk) 13:28, 29 May 2011 (UTC)[reply]

I have not begun the review as yet other than an initial scan of the article, which looks promising. I will review in detail soon and post comments here. --Mykleavens (talk) 13:28, 29 May 2011 (UTC)[reply]

Points arising from initial read and copyedit

1. "In the past the Outer Hebrides were often referred to as the Long Isle" — should "Long Isle" be plural?

No - as is perhaps possible to make out from the map it does have the appearance of a single long thin island - especially from Skye.

2. Prehistory — citation for the year 6500BC? Note: I realise some citations cover more than one sentence or even a whole paragraph but if in doubt I will include a point in this list.

Edwards, Kevin J. and Whittington, Graeme "Vegetation Change" in Edwards & Ralston (2003) p. 70 at the end of the next sentence. They give a corrected and calibrated date of 7500 BC, hence my change in the text to "or earlier". I don't know enough about radiocarbon dating to make much sense of explaining the idea that 8500 BP is 7500 BC, hence this change.

3. Citation re Ketill Flatnose?

Hunter (2000) p. 78 at the end of the next sentence.

4. Norwegian control — "various islands petty kingdoms" needs to be revised for clarity: is it missing an apostrophe?

Fixed - now "various island petty kingdoms"

5. Scottish control — direct citations needed for quotation in this sentence: In 1598, King James VI authorised some "Gentleman Adventurers" from Fife to civilise the "most barbarous Isle of Lewis".

Done - sorry 'bout that.

6. Citation needed for "the colonists were driven out by local forces commanded by Murdoch and Neil MacLeod".

Rotary Club (1995) pp. 12-13 & Haswell-Smith (2004) p. 312 at the end of the next sentence.

7. Clarity needed re "The Seaforth's royalist inclinations". Is the Seaforth singular or plural? Misplaced apostrophe?

It could just about be either but the source refers to the "Seaforth family" and I have changed it.

8. Please provide specific links for both Jacobite risings in this phrase: "in the "15" and again in the 1745 rising".

Good to see the first has its own article at last. Done.

9. "The UK government's strategy". Not sure about the use of "UK" here and suggest "British government" would be more correct for that period. What do you think?

I don't know enough about British policy at the time to be sure - it was probably both but British covers both neatly and I have changed it to that.

10. Need a citation for "English-speaking landlords whose main concern was the revenues..."

I amended this slightly.

11. I have a general comment about syntax as I have made numerous copyedits whilst reading and these have often seemed to be around the use of commas and semi-colons. For example, an extensive list of clauses like "Roads and quays were built..." needs semi-colons. Please watch use of "and" after a comma.

Point taken. I don't think WP:MOS forbids Oxford commas, but there may well have been inconsistency. This is very much a "summary style" article and I think most of the sentences have been through reviews before. Your attention to detail is exemplary—I myself struggle to accommodate and indeed incorporate the varied permitted styles and views on the same.

12. Citation needed for "large scale emigration became endemic".

Added one ref.

13. Does the 1886 Crofters' Act citation cover the sentence about the "Battle of the Braes"?

It does indeed.

14. Modern economy. Need to clarify "throughout the late 19th and 20th centuries" which is ambiguous. Please provide a more specific period: e.g. "from the late 19th century to the middle of the 20th century".

Done

15. The word "nonetheless" is used twice in one small section. Please use an alternative. Same applies to overuse of "recent".

Done.

16. Re Mendelssohn, you should say he "composed" the overture rather than wrote it. Ditto re Bantock.

Done.

17. Citation(s) needed for association with islands of Ian Anderson & co.

Done.

18. Citations needed re Compton Mackenzie and George Orwell. Also re Enya's song.

Compton MacK was covered although Orwell isn't (anymore?). Added one and made other small changes. I don't think I was sure what to do with "Ebudae". I have the CD somewhere and it seemed somehow to reference itself - but I have of course added a citation now.

19. Language. Citation needed for arrival and use of Scottish Gaelic from Ireland.

Done. The idea has been critiqued by Ewan Campbell, but I believe this remains a minority view.

20. Language. Citation(s) needed for prevalence of Old Norse and the obliteration of earlier place names.

Woolf ref now repeated here.

21. Language. Citation needed re Sabhal Mòr Ostaig based on Skye and Islay.

Goodness - that's like asking for a citation that Doncaster is in Yorkshire. Having spent time in God's own county I forgive this lack of local knowledge on your part and have added a citation (in Gaelic).

22. Repeated links. Needs to be addressed throughout. I have noticed repeat links of, for example, Western Isles and Scotland.

Attempted fixes throughout.

23. Please clarify "under colonised".

Glitch fixed.

24. Etymology. Citation needed for Ptolemy.

Done - and now also amended to include Pliny.

25. Presumably the hedgehog cull brought forth increased usage of articulated lorries?

It can be hard to tell sometimes, but I think this is a lighthearted and rhetorical question. Let's put it this way - I don't have any firm evidence to hand one way or the other.

26. Benbecula image should be moved right as it has created imbalance and whitespace.

Moved.

27. The Caledonian MacBrayne image at the top has created a stack, given that the map is the primary image and should stay put, so please relocate the ship image.

Moved.

First pass completed - will return asap for the rest. Many thanks for this comprehensive review. Ben Mac Dui 20:18, 30 May 2011 (UTC)[reply]

Second pass completed an all points attempted. Ben Mac Dui 09:04, 31 May 2011 (UTC)[reply]

B-class evaluation

As a guide to the article's current state, ahead of a formal review against the GA criteria, it rates as follows against standard B-class criteria:

1. It is suitably referenced and all major points have appropriate inline citations.

2. It reasonably covers the topic and does not contain major omissions or inaccuracies.

3. It has a defined structure, including a lead section and one or more sections of content.

4. It is free from major grammatical errors.

5. It contains appropriate supporting materials, such as an infobox, images or diagrams.

6. It is fully and correctly categorised and carries all appropriate templates.

Numerous citations are still required and so I think the article should currently be rated C-class according to assessment criteria. I need to perform a detailed review to decide if the scope is adequate, though my first impression is that it is quite comprehensive. I need to think about categories and templates but, again, there is nothing obviously missing.

The lead and structure are certainly there but I must compare the lead with the text for GA purposes. Although there are no major problems with grammar and spelling, you need to ensure that a full copyedit is done before nomination to weed out the minor errors and ambiguities: my copyedit has been more extensive than I would have expected.

The images, especially the maps, are excellent and there are only a couple of positioning aspects to consider.

I'm placing the review on hold for the time being as there are a lot of points above but I'm confident that, once these are addressed, this article will eventually reach GA. I'll watch it and help where I can. --Mykleavens (talk) 16:00, 30 May 2011 (UTC)[reply]

Good article criteria

well-written:

(a) the prose is clear and concise –

(b) the spelling and grammar are correct –

(c) it complies with the manual of style guidelines for:

lead sections –
layout –
words to watch –
fiction –
list incorporation –

factually accurate and verifiable:

(a) it provides references to all sources of information in the section(s) dedicated to the attribution of these sources according to the guide to layout –

(b) it provides in-line citations from reliable sources for direct quotations, statistics, published opinion, contentious material relating to living persons and counter-intuitive or controversial statements that are challenged or likely to be challenged –

(c) it contains no original research –

(d) science-based articles should follow the scientific citation guidelines – not applicable

broad in its coverage:

(a) it addresses the main aspects of the topic –

(b) it stays focused on the topic without going into unnecessary detail –

(c) it uses a summary style –

neutral –

stable –

illustrated, if possible, by images:

(a) images are tagged with their copyright status and valid fair use rationales are provided for non-free content –

(b) images are relevant to the topic and have suitable captions –

Summary

Thank you for addressing the points I raised. You are right that one of them was a rhetorical question! I could see on first reading that this is not going to be merely a good article but potentially an excellent article that will one day be featured; and so I decided to mark it strictly especially re the citations as this will help it towards FA status. It is a very interesting piece. I've been to Skye so have had a good flavour of the place and you have put forward some fascinating information, especially around the turbulent history. Well done and good luck when you inevitably nominate it for a feature. --Mykleavens (talk) 14:56, 1 June 2011 (UTC)[reply]