Talk:Heaven's Gate (religious group)/Archive 3

Archive 1

Archive 2

Archive 3

Either transhumanism or posthumanism

From this article:

• "'graduation' from the Human Evolutionary Level"
• "Do and Ti's doctrine of helping members of the crew achieve a 'higher evolutionary level' above human"
• "'Only a select few members of humanity will be chosen to advance to this transhuman state'"
• "the 'graduating soul' leaves the human container for a perfected next-level body"

From the header of Category:Transhumanism: "The most common transhumanist thesis is that human beings may eventually be able to transform themselves into different beings with abilities so greatly expanded from the natural condition as to merit the label of posthuman beings."

I had been thinking of the category transhumanism for this article, but after reading that explanation, I thought posthumanism made a better fit. Right? Johanna-Hypatia (talk) 03:35, 7 February 2018 (UTC)

I believe that posthuman and transhumanism imply technological means, whereas Heaven's Gate was anticipating a religious transformation. Editor2020 (talk) 04:57, 7 February 2018 (UTC)

Well, OK, the reason they are two different categories is that transhumanism specifically involves technological means, while the definition of posthumanism expands to areas like philosophical concepts. Also, for that matter, HG certainly was involved with technological considerations, both in the spaceships they anticipated and in their heavily computerized work. That's why I think either category would fit, while posthumanism is probably the better fit. Anyone else? Johanna-Hypatia (talk) 19:41, 8 February 2018 (UTC)

Pop culture

This section needs trimmed, per the tag already present there. Thoughts? Beeblebrox (talk) 09:40, 24 May 2018 (UTC)

We could probably rewrite this in prose format instead of listing a bunch of trivial mentions. NinjaRobotPirate (talk) 00:44, 25 May 2018 (UTC)

Agree, this section is getting cluttered. Hemiauchenia (talk) 20:47, 2 May 2021 (UTC)

I took a crack at rewriting the TV and Film section in prose. I cut a ton of details, but I think there's probably still extraneous detail and the section reads weirdly. Feel free to take a crack at revision. Only the Music section is really egregious, still. Suriname0 (talk) 03:17, 3 May 2021 (UTC)

the website still exists

http://www.heavensgate.com/

this website still exists, please put it back on the page — Preceding unsigned comment added by 2A00:23C1:BF01:5201:BD9A:D366:7072:7A45 (talk) 12:24, 16 July 2018 (UTC)

It's weird that someone went out of their way to say "now-nonexistent website", when it's kind of famous for still being around. I corrected the intro and added the website to the external links - in all its 1990s glory! KaturianKaturian 17:06, 31 July 2018 (UTC)

Delete category posthumanism

As far as I can tell these were delusional people who killed themselves. From the article Posthumanism the first line reads: Posthumanism or post-humanism (meaning "after humanism" or "beyond humanism") is a term with at least seven definitions according to philosopher Francesca Ferrando:[1] None of these definitions include delusion UFO suicide cults. Arren7 (talk) 23:56, 30 April 2019 (UTC)

Today I will Be Bold and delete the category posthumanism, if anyone wants to talk about it I'll keep a watch on this page, since it’s been like a week I figured it's OK for me to do this. Peace. Arren7 (talk) 11:52, 6 May 2019 (UTC)

As discussed above, the group's own stated principles align with posthumanism concepts. Johanna-Hypatia (talk) 07:36, 8 May 2019 (UTC)

"Mysterious Two" listed at Redirects for discussion

An editor has asked for a discussion to address the redirect Mysterious Two. Please participate in the redirect discussion if you wish to do so. PamD 12:50, 24 February 2020 (UTC)

Emails

They are still answering emails, I have been asking questions trying to understand and get their perspectives, if you want to have this article correct, email them. I have no exact way of proving it because just a screen shot of an e-mail isn't sufficient I suggest we fix it up by asking them directly. Dirish47 (talk) 21:16, 3 April 2020 (UTC)

Connection to Mark Twain

I removed a line suggesting that the $5.75 in the pockets of Heaven's Gate members was a reference to Captain Stormfield's Visit to Heaven. It appears that this is not true; it was a rumor at the time, perhaps started on an online Twain forum. See this JSTOR source: Could perhaps be worked into a new section in the article if desired, but there seems to be no real connection. Suriname0 (talk) 16:47, 11 April 2021 (UTC)

References

Website still functioning

Their website is still up and running. I emailed them like a year ago and they responded to my email.CycoMa (talk) 16:58, 22 August 2021 (UTC)

Listcruft

I think that the pop culture section needs a massive rework. The suicides were a well-publicised event and of course as such they have been referenced on numerous occasions in various media. I think having a section describing the broader cultural impact is preferable to the current "In popular culture" list format, which is a magnet for drive by edits which add random references made to Heaven's Gate that don't have any secondary significance. @Beeblebrox: who has previously expressed concern about this. Hemiauchenia (talk) 05:02, 13 September 2021 (UTC)

Music references

Please help me understand why references to music in Popular Culture are deleted. Thanks. 2604:3D08:1777:BE0:E560:4BAD:BD9E:7D08 (talk) 15:28, 16 February 2022 (UTC)

"Heaven's Gate (religious group" listed at Redirects for discussion

An editor has identified a potential problem with the redirect Heaven's Gate (religious group and has thus listed it for discussion. This discussion will occur at Wikipedia:Redirects for discussion/Log/2022 October 27#Heaven's Gate (religious group until a consensus is reached, and readers of this page are welcome to contribute to the discussion. Steel1943 (talk) 19:46, 27 October 2022 (UTC)