Talk:Gordon (surname)

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Jewish origin of Gordon - contested

[added December 23, 2007]

I searched google for 'gordon jewish surname', and came up with a New York Times article from August 29, 1905 entitled 'The Jewish Name "Gordon."'

In in an 'expert', Mr. Gordon the 'Jewish Kipling' states that would warn a genealogist "against the common error, which by the philological process of metastasis, derives the name from the Russian town of Grodno, the derivative of which is not Gordon, but Grodner, or Gradner, a name borne by numerous Jewish families"

Another corespondant, Salmon Gordon tells a story in the article of a Scottish Gordon marrying a jew and eloping to Poland.

Regardless, the connection to Grodno should be eliminated, or marked contested.

Link: abstract

or

direct link to article

what does everyone else think?

→I think the Grodno/Gordon connection is spurious. I added some of what I believe is the true origin of the Jewish Gordon surname, but it needs work. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 24.154.104.65 (talk) 23:01, 27 April 2018 (UTC)[reply]

Some other information on Gordons

Actually, Gordon originated in the 4th century AD in the Rhine valley as a branch of the Guenzberg family. A portion moved to Scotland during the Norman conquest and a portion went to Russia (following Patrick Gordon, who became a Russian General), to form the backbone of the Czarist armies. They intermarried Jews, which is where a large portion of the Russian Jewish Gordons came from. Jews also had settled in the Rhine Valley, where they also intermarried with Gordons that hadn't gone to Scotland.

The DNA haplotypes are, confusing, since Gordon are a very migrating family. You can read more about them at http://ggordon528.tripod.com/ged/gordon2.html

One branch of the Gordons moved to Palestine in the 1850's, where Aharon David Gordon invented the Kibbutz, founded the Israeli military and Labor party, and, started the ecology-anarchist movement. 71.239.175.188 03:59, 4 June 2007 (UTC)[reply]

I don't know where you got all that from, but it's almost certainly false. Hereditary surnames simply didn't exist in the 4th century, so that bit about the Guenzberg origins is a dead duck I'm afraid. The first true family name in Europe probably originated in 9th century Ireland[1], with England and Scotland adopting the practise in around the 11th century. German surnames didn't arise until much later, beginning during the Late Middle Ages (c. 1300–1500).

The origin of the Scottish name Gordon is locational, derived from the town of Gordon in Berwickshire, so called from the Olde Gaelic "gor", meaning large or spacious, plus "dun", a fort[2]. The surname was first recorded in the mid 12th Century, and is wholly distinct from the other variants. Conversely, the English Gordon is Anglo-French in origin. Also a locational name, it is derived from Gourdon in the departement of Saone-et-Loire in France.[3]

Finally, I must take issue with your theory regarding the origins of the Jewish variant. Jewish and Gentile intermarriage was not particularly commonplace anywhere until the 20th century, what with Jews being largely segregated and ostracised from the general population in virtually every European country right up until the end of the 19th century[4][5]. European Jews generally didn't adopt hereditary last names until the late 18th century, after the Austro-Hungarian Empire, which controlled a substantial part of Europe at the time, became the first country in Europe to require Jews to register a permanent family surname[6]. To wit, the origin of the Gordon name amongst Jews was almost certainly post 18th century, the most widely accepted theory being that it is habitational, after the city of Grodno in Belarus. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 82.46.0.13 (talk) 20:33, 5 November 2012 (UTC)[reply]

Completely agree that the OP's theory holds no water, although I believe the Gordon/Grodno connection is spurious as well. I added a bit about the origin of the Jewish Gordon surnames. It's based on scattered sources I don't have at hand, but I'm 99% sure it's the right account in rough outline. I'll look to improve the section. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 24.154.104.65 (talk) 23:15, 27 April 2018 (UTC)[reply]

Gordon and Gordian

Is Gordon related to the Roman name "Gordian"? —Preceding unsigned comment added by 75.105.128.58 (talk) 18:05, 20 June 2009 (UTC)[reply]