Talk:Glee season 6

Unreliable sources for episode titles and plots

We go through this every season, so since the first unreliably sourced episode title has already been added, it makes sense to repost this information from the season 5 talk page. Most are without any sources at all, some with sources that are clearly not reliable, and some that may seem to be reliable but really aren't. Please remember that fan-based sources like wikias, tumblrs, and larger, fancier sites that look more professional but do not have the fact checking and editorial standards required of reliable sources should never be used. These problematic sources include:

• The various Glee wikias, tumblrs, and fan sites, including GleekOut Brasil and MJsbigblog
• IMDb, TV.com, SpoilerTV.com
• Hypable and similar "by fans for fans" sites
• Wetpaint
• BroadwayWorld.com (which has relied uncritically on the above for information, and not obtained independent confirmation)

Absent a reliable source, information on episode titles, writers, directors, production codes, short plot summaries, and so on should not be added to the article. Please remember, Wikipedia is an encyclopedia, not a newspaper or gossip magazine: information should wait to be added until it can be verified using reliable sources. Many thanks. BlueMoonset (talk) 15:18, 1 September 2014 (UTC)

Colour Scheme

An editor keeps reverting my change of the seasons colour scheme from an unofficial violet hue, to an ocean blue that is being used in the official poster for the last season on DirecTV. Please let's not cross 3RR. Let me hear where you're getting the official word for the violet. Other editors, please weigh in. Cheers, LLArrow (talk) 01:40, 10 January 2015 (UTC)

It was me who reverted your edits, which at the time, I didn't know that the violet color wasn't appart of the promotion for season 6. But I am wondering why you have chosen the ocean blue color for the page, since the promotional poster for the last season has a yellow title of "Glee" with a dark blue background, which you can see on Glee's official Twitter page. After all, the previous seasons' page color has been decided by the color of the title, not the background. Therefore, I don't think the color for season 6 should be he same color as the bckground. Twotimer17 (talk) 13:11, 10 January 2015 (UTC)

It should be left as is for now. When the DVD cover art becomes available, then we'll make the final transition. Cheers, LLArrow (talk) 00:09, 11 January 2015 (UTC)

Correct credit format

An editor continually reverts my correction of the credits for series co-creators Ryan Murphy, Brad Falchuk and Ian Brennan on the episodes they have all contributed to. The on-screen credit of the episodes is as follows, "Ryan Murphy & Brad Falchuk & Ian Brennan", using two ampersands instead of the more grammatically traditional style of a comma and an "and". This editor claims that the action is questionable against WP:MOS, which I don't subscribe to in the least. If the TV series feels that two ampersands are the appropriate way to credit these writers, this article should most definitely reflect that. Show me any other series that takes liberties with style of credit for writers. Any. There are none. Please weigh in on this issue. Thank you and cheers, LLArrow (talk) 04:24, 13 January 2015 (UTC)

To chime in, it's best it should follow to how the writers are officially credited. Ampersands aren't permitted for use in regular text, but they're perfectible acceptable in tables (which in this case, they're being used) per WP:AMP ("Ampersands may be used with consistency and discretion in places where space is extremely limited (i.e. tables and infoboxes))". It's no different than wanting to change "writer & writer" to "writer and writer", we use ampersands because that how's they're credited. Drovethrughosts (talk) 14:51, 13 January 2015 (UTC)

Let's name names: I'm one of two editors who have been reverting you, and I feel I have good reasons for doing so. If the table space were limited, then this WP:AMP exception might be valid, but the entry is going to take two lines anyway. In that case, the ampersands are not helpful. Furthermore, these entries have been like this for years, with the grammatical "and". It isn't as if this wasn't originally thought out by previous editors. Since Wikipedia typically goes by WP:BRD, I feel that to have reverted yet again before the discussion has taken place is inappropriate, and I will be returning the three articles to status quo ante after I post this. I ask that you respect this. I note that I am not the only person to have returned the articles to the status quo ante over the past days, and would appreciate it if the discussion could conclude with consensus before any further changes are made. Thank you. BlueMoonset (talk) 05:38, 14 January 2015 (UTC)

First off, if you haven't learned that Wikipedia isn't a place for bruised egos then you haven't been formally initiated. Secondly, it's incredibly uncivil and improper to call out any one editor concerning any grievances you might have with them on a Talk page.

This is a classic case of an editor being unhappy that a format they implemented is coming under question. As I have now stated three times, bring an example of any other series that takes liberties with the styling of the credits. There are absolutely none. Please do not take anything said/action by any editor, on Wikipedia, personally. This is strictly business. Cheers, LLArrow (talk) 07:18, 14 January 2015 (UTC)

Let's see: first you say I have a bruised ego. Then you imply I'm uninitiated as to how Wikipedia works. Next you seem to think I'm incivil and improper. Do you see how the subsequent statement that this is all strictly business might seem unsupported by your previous words? (Yes, it should be strictly business. I thought I had been explaining my position vis a vis yours with dispassionate facts.)

Articles take liberties with the strict formatting of credits all the time, in part because shows themselves have all sorts of formatting. In fact, the credit in question appear as follows on screen:

written by

ryan murphy

&

brad falchuk

&

ian brennan

So for Glee articles and tables, we've been capitalizing names, and when there are multiples in a credit, also turning them into a (horizontal) list using words rather than symbols. All kosher according to the Wikipedia Manual of Style, and a valid and perfectly reasonable way to proceed. We've been doing it for years that way, both in tables and in regular prose. Your statement that If the TV series feels that two ampersands are the appropriate way to credit these writers, this article should most definitely reflect that. is certainly untrue for prose, as MOS:AMP makes crystal clear. Wikipedia simply doesn't work that way.

This is not to say that the consensus for doing the tables a different way here might not develop. I've seen methods come and go, for Glee articles and others, and sometimes my view has held, and sometimes it hasn't. I imagine we all have Wikipedia policies that seem odd or even counterproductive, but we go along with them because we think Wikipedia is a good thing and want to help it prosper. I think I've done good work on Glee topics over the years, as well as elsewhere, and have a number of Good Articles on the show to my credit. I certainly don't own the articles. But neither do you.

Incidentally, when I said "name names", I was referring to naming myself: I was the editor you were talking about in your initial post. I'm also curious as to which part of my previous message you considered "incredibly uncivil and improper", as I certainly had no intent to do anything but explain the series of events that got us here, and the reasoning behind my actions. BlueMoonset (talk) 05:47, 15 January 2015 (UTC)

I never called you "incredibly uncivil and improper". I was stating that your suggestion of calling editors out on Talk pages is such. Which I made quite clear in my last post.

I grow weary of this inert debate. Please do not engage me again unless you have another series I have asked for, that takes liberties with the style of the credits. Cheers, LLArrow (talk) 07:41, 15 January 2015 (UTC)

Credits for film and television are not just randomly typed up by a computer guy, they are completely thought out and specifically written. Often you will see writers in films credited as X & X and X & X. This is not done because somebody couldn't be bothered writing out two of the 'and's, or because there wasn't enough space, this was done because od writer groupings and the such. This is the same as the order of the main cast - we might think somebody is more important than another and therefore should be higher up the list, or that perhaps alphabetical order is best, but the official list is in a specific order for a reason. If writers are credited with &s, then that is how they are credited, and we can't do anything about, no matter how much we don't like it. End of story. - adamstom97 (talk) 08:10, 15 January 2015 (UTC)

Adam hit the nail on the head. Ampersands indicate who worked together on a script and who contributed separately. For instance, in the case of an episode in which the first draft of the script was written by Murphy and Falchuck, and then Brennan came on to rewrite it, that would be credited as "Written by Ryan Murphy & Brad Falchuck and Jan Brennan", generally with a line break between "Falchuck" and "and". Seeing as ampersands are used all over the place, and are the official credits of the show, I'm failing to see why they shouldn't be changed. Sock (tock talk) 13:39, 15 January 2015 (UTC)

I concur with Adam and Sock. This isn't a style or grammatical issue, the ampersand is being used to denote the actual writing role. If you would like, you can read this page, it explains it fairly well.  BIGNOLE  (Contact me) 14:56, 15 January 2015 (UTC)

I also concur with Adam and Sock. Both brought up the point in was going to, and using Bignole's link also help. If ampersands are used in the episode, they should be used here. - Favre1fan93 (talk) 02:49, 16 January 2015 (UTC)

Are there variant versions of "A Wedding" with different directorial credits?

I watch Glee on Hulu, and in the version of "A Wedding" being offered there, the following credit is displayed on screen at approximately 10:05 into the episode:

directed by
Bradley Buecker
&
Ian Brennan

This credit occurs immediately after "written by ross maxwell" credit, and is the last one before the first commercial break. Given the reverts I've been getting here, I can only guess that the credit looks different elsewhere (crediting only Buecker rather than both Buecker and Brennan), which strikes me as quite strange. Can those people who have been reverting me when I add Ian Brennan, User:Artmanha and User:LLArrow, say which version, broadcast or online source, they're viewing for their information, and quote what it says? Also, if anyone else has seen the directorial credit in the episode, it would be nice to figure out how widespread the variants are. At some point, we'll have a physical DVD, which will presumably have the final, corrected version. BlueMoonset (talk) 01:42, 23 February 2015 (UTC)

This is very weird, by Fox's original broadcast, it credited only Bradley Buecker as director. I'll check the iTunes version to see which one is correct, but after six seasons there has been two, even three writers but only one director for each episode, that's why this is unlike. —- Artmanha (talk) 02:20, 23 February 2015 (UTC)

I know. I was very surprised to see two directors credited as well, since it hasn't happened before. Though after that zap2it article that gave Brennan's name as the director of the wedding scene, which I had read earlier that day, my surprise was to see Buecker's name there in addition to Brennan's, rather than the other way around. I made a screen capture of the Hulu credit, in case it's the one that was in error and disappears. BlueMoonset (talk) 03:02, 23 February 2015 (UTC)

An oddity indeed. I too viewed the broadcast version. I believe we should include both names until the season is available on DVD. Cheers, LLArrow (talk) 04:07, 23 February 2015 (UTC)

As of this moment, the version of "A Wedding" available at Fox.com A Wedding liststhe "directed by bradley buecker & ian brennan" noted above at 10:05 into the episode (during the Tina w/Puck, Blaine, and Artie scene). That strikes me as definitive. BlueMoonset (talk) 00:07, 13 March 2015 (UTC)

Now that the DVD is out, what's the directing credits? So we can put this to an end. - Artmanha (talk) 18:29, 19 May 2015 (UTC)

Guys?! - Artmanha (talk) 22:12, 6 June 2015 (UTC)

Sorry, Artmanha, haven't bought it yet. BlueMoonset (talk) 03:34, 7 June 2015 (UTC)

What do it have in the home release? No word yet? It was released a while ago... — Artmanha (talk) 17:20, 14 July 2015 (UTC)

@BlueMoonset: Do you have any confirmation regarding the matter? — Artmanha (talk) 15:58, 15 September 2015 (UTC)

Artmanha, I still haven't picked up the video, but expect to do so by the end of the month. Sorry I can't confirm as yet. BlueMoonset (talk) 19:06, 15 September 2015 (UTC)

@BlueMoonset: Sorry to be a bother, but do you have any confirmation as up these days? — Artmanha (talk) 00:26, 7 October 2015 (UTC)

Artmanha, I have not yet managed to purchase the video. When I do, I will post here. Until then, or until someone else stops by who has the video and can confirm the credit, I'm afraid you will have to wait, and we will not be able to finally settle this. I think you need to be patient and stop asking; eventually, this will be settled one way or the other. BlueMoonset (talk) 01:46, 7 October 2015 (UTC)

I just found a copy of the Season 6 DVD in a local library, took it out, and ran it. To my surprise, Buecker is the only director credited for this episode on the DVD. I'll change the article and season listings accordingly. BlueMoonset (talk) 22:10, 8 October 2015 (UTC)

Reception

The Reception section read "The season was received with positive reviews", even though some of the episodes haven't even been aired yet and the articles linked to talked only about the first two episodes. I changed the sentence accordingly. 62.78.230.2 (talk) 16:28, 8 March 2015 (UTC)

Policy discussion in progress

There is a policy discussion in progress at the Manual of Style which affects this page, suggesting that the capitalization of "like" in the episode titles here should be removed. Please participate on that page and not in this talk page section. Thank you. — LlywelynII 12:54, 12 February 2016 (UTC)