Talk:German-speaking Europe

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Europe

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Germany

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d-a-ch.org down

d-a-ch.org is kind of down. Just some parking-service page there. No content. So just remove all the links to it? What about the citation from there? —Preceding unsigned comment added by 88.217.59.117 (talk) 13:59, 11 December 2008 (UTC)[reply]

Offcial status

What does "official status" mean ? Of the listed countries, German is only an official language in Belgium, Italy and Switzerland. In Denmark German in used a an official educational language. Germans are recognized as a minority in Romania, Poland and Hungary. I don't know of any official recognition by France. So the question is : shouldn't some countries be removed from the list ? Travelbird 10:58, 28 March 2007 (UTC)[reply]

I don't think German is an official language in Italy. It is co-official only on a regional basis. I think there's a distinction between the two. German is the official language of Liechtenstein, the major official language in Luxembourg, and is official on a regional basis only in Denmark and Russia. Bostoner (talk) 02:40, 31 August 2010 (UTC)[reply]

Map

The map refers to "German language skills of European Union citizens (plus Switzerland)" and Turkey is shaded in. Turkey isn't in the EU. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 194.46.187.242 (talk) 11:36, 14 June 2008 (UTC)[reply]

It is said in description that this map represent EU and (plus) Croatia, Bosnia and Herzegovina, Switzerland, Turkey and others. It does not declare that these countries are in EU. Also, article is about German Speaking Europe, not German speaking European Union. Neither Croatia, Bosnia and Herzegovina or Switzerland are in EU. --HernauMan (talk) 23:36, 24 May 2009 (UTC)[reply]

I suggest to include in the map more colours for different percentages, especially for the percentages 10-19 and compulsory for class 20-49%. The span is simply to wide to create a valid graphical insight in the matter. More shades - my suggestion.Hammer of Habsburg (talk) 23:28, 18 December 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Flanders

The Map should make a distinction between Flanders and Wallonia in Belgium. Probably, in Flanders the percentage of people who can speak in German is similar to the Netherlands, over 65% of the population. --79.146.210.235 (talk) 06:41, 24 July 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Language is extremely important building a community, and if the European Union never goes ahead of its present economic form, a "Little Europe" will have to go ahead building a Federation around the 16 German Länder, including also Austria, Luxemburg, Swtizerland, the Netherlands and Flanders: a total of 21 Länder and 120 million people. That Little European Union would be more cohesive and competitive, with an economy of over Euro 5 Trillion, surpassing Japan and approaching China. That could be a voice for the Euro and the E.U. in the rest of the World.--79.146.210.235 (talk) 06:41, 24 July 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Dubious

The article claims that "German is the third most taught foreign language worldwide, including the United States". I am prepared to believe that the ranking for foreign languages is es-fr-de in the US, but certainly not worldwide. Is this written from an anglo-centric view, making English a priori not a foreign language? I would have thought that globally the order is something like en-es-fr-de, perhaps with Chinese or something put in as well. Hans Adler 08:56, 13 December 2009 (UTC)[reply]

I think it refers to the ranking in terms of the number of second language learners worldwide: English » French » German —Preceding unsigned comment added by 120.89.56.200 (talk) 15:37, 1 July 2010 (UTC)[reply]

Namibia

In Namibia, German is one of the "national languages". Isn't that an official status? -- megA (talk) 09:50, 9 June 2011 (UTC)[reply]

Poland

is currently listed under both "Official status" and "without official status". AFAIK, it is a recognized minority language (official auxilliary language) in part of Poland, complying with EU regulations. -- megA (talk) 09:53, 9 June 2011 (UTC)[reply]

German is the only official language of Germany and of Austria

Danish, Frisian et cetera are regionally recognised languages. They are not official. I have corrected the article to reflect this. --Île flottante (talk) 21:17, 23 October 2011 (UTC)[reply]

This is tricky business. Germany and Austria do not have de jure official languages in the first place. Both use German almost universally, making it the de facto official language, but this is not required by their constitutions and laws, except implicitly by their being written in German. On the other hand, some minority languages benefit from certain legal privileges which make them regional official languages. See also official language and list of official languages by country. I don't think your edit was an improvement, over all. Hans Adler 22:06, 23 October 2011 (UTC)[reply]

I have to correct you on "not required by law": §23 of the Verwaltungsverfassungsgesetz (Administrative Procedures Law) explicitly states "Die Amtssprache ist Deutsch" (The official language is German). All documents must be presented in German or translated at the expense of the presenter. -- megA (talk) 09:58, 8 November 2011 (UTC)[reply]

Map

What is exactly the 'problem' with that map? That it reveals that some areas that today are part of Poland used to have German speaking majority back then? Right?--Miacek and his crime-fighting dog (woof!) 18:48, 18 February 2013 (UTC)[reply]

There is a discussion here [1]. There was also apparently a discussion on German wikipedia [2]. To quote Hans Adler (quoting that discussion) "the map is seriously problematic original research". The guy who made it was apparantly banned from German (and English too I think) wikipedia for pushing extremist POV (including "trivialization of Nazism"). There is/was also apparently a similar discussion on the Dutch Wikipedia.Volunteer Marek 19:38, 18 February 2013 (UTC)[reply]

So, no, not "right".Volunteer Marek 19:38, 18 February 2013 (UTC)[reply]

I will participate in the discussion. The map is widely used in e.g. Dutch Wikipedia. As for being banned in German wiki, I wouldn't pay any attention to it whatsoever, as I (although not banned) have ceased any coöperation with this project after having been called 'Nazi', 'brown troll' etc. numerous times in impunity by the activists here and the human rights activist Vera Lengsfeld has described the project as far-left [3]. True, RG was banned in EN-Wiki, too, which however does not mean all of his contributions were unacceptable.Miacek and his crime-fighting dog (woof!) 20:06, 18 February 2013 (UTC)[reply]

Well, then it should be removed from the Dutch Wikipedia. You don't fix one thing by breaking another. As to your opinions about German wikipedia being "far left" or unfairly banning extremist users for Nazism... they're just your opinions, and they don't particularly concern me here.Volunteer Marek 21:33, 18 February 2013 (UTC)[reply]

It was you who brought up German Wikipedia.Miacek and his crime-fighting dog (woof!) 11:07, 19 February 2013 (UTC)[reply]

Proficiency in Poland

Re: [4]. I'm sorry, but the fact that parts of Silesia, Pomerania and northeastern Poland were once part of Germany has *nothing* to do with the fact that Poles are pretty proficient in German. It's not like it's the same people living there, right? In fact a good chunk of the people living in these areas moved there from parts of Poland now part of Ukraine, Belarus and Lithuania. This claim is nonsensical and unsourced.

There are couple reasons for why Poles are pretty proficient in German. The main one is probably economic ties. Germany is Poland's biggest trading partner and it makes sense to know the language for business reason. The fact that Germany occupied Poland in WWII and the partitions, also has a lot to do with it - however you feel about your occupier, you often wind up picking up the language. Third, during the Communist era, learning the English language was deprecated by the authorities (that's what them evul kapitalist Amerikkkans spoke) and German was promoted in its place (there were those "good socialist Germans" over in East Germany) - of course in addition to Russian, which was mandatory. So a lot of people growing up during that period learned German in school the way that in other parts of the world people learned English. Take these three reasons, add a lot of path dependence and inertia and you've got a population which is pretty good at speaking German. It has nothing to do with post WWII border changes.Volunteer Marek 14:26, 26 February 2013 (UTC)[reply]

your own WP:OR/WP:SYNTH theory is also quite unsourced. Miacek and his crime-fighting dog (woof!) 14:54, 26 February 2013 (UTC)[reply]

Sure, but at least it's plausible. I'm fine with there being no explanation in there.Volunteer Marek 14:57, 26 February 2013 (UTC)[reply]

Merge with List of territorial entities where German is an official language

I have renamed, expanded and polished List of territorial entities where German is an official language, which now more closely resembles it similarly named counterparts for English, Spanish, French etc.. That article now encompasses virtually all information presented on "German-speaking Europe", is better structured AND most importantly is well-referenced (German-speaking Europe has almost NO source-references; the entire D-A-CH section is obsolete). I therefore propose to replace German-speaking Europe with a redirect to List of territorial entities where German is an official language. Without any justified objections, I plan to go ahead in a few days. --37ophiuchi (talk) 14:11, 30 June 2015 (UTC)[reply]

Sure, that's a good idea. Sourced content is always preferable to unsourced content. Peter238 (talk) 17:26, 2 July 2015 (UTC)[reply]

ok, but why into the "list" page? This was not a list article. The topic is highly complex, with centuries of controversial history, etc. Surely, the proper redirect target would be German_language#Geographic_distribution, or possibly Geographical distribution of German speakers, which, however, for some reason, does not address the history of Ostsiedlung, Ostflucht (Flight and expulsion of Germans (1944–50)), which would seem rather relevant to the topic as it roughly halved the territory in question. --dab (𒁳) 09:13, 5 September 2017 (UTC)[reply]