Talk:Flag of Ceredigion

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Heraldry and vexillology

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Ceredigion/Cardiganshire

Seems there was a dispute over what to call this, AFAIAA, "county flags" in Wales follow the historic counties of Wales, which the county was called Cardiganshire not Ceredigion which is only used for the modern principal area since 1996. There is no county flag of Flintshire but Flintshire (historic). @Hogweard and Domersr:

Also the rest of this article references a "Cardiganshire" so it should be in the lead, not to confuse readers. Dank Jae 00:02, 29 February 2024 (UTC)[reply]

That would certainly be logical and consistent. The article was originally 'Flag of Cardiganshire', and were it to be enrolled on the UK Flags Register, it would (according to all I have seen) be note with that name. Hogweard (talk) 07:30, 29 February 2024 (UTC)[reply]

I am still in favour of retaining the use of 'Ceredigion' as the lead for this article. 'Cardiganshire' has not been a political entity since 1996 so I fail to see how this should take precedence over the name used for the county over the last thirty years. I believe that the article should make reference to the county being called 'Cardiganshire' pre-1996 and there should be a brief explanation as to why the name changed, however we would need to be careful to stay on topic and not deviate too much from this article. If it's consistency we are after, we should follow the lead from the page for Ceredigion which starts with "Ceredigion, historically Cardiganshire, is a county in the west of Wales."

I would be more swayed by the arguments to lead with 'Flag of Cardiganshire' had the flag been retired and replaced by a new flag upon the renaming of the county to Ceredigion in 1996, however no such event took place. Therefore I believe it's hard to argue that the flag is confined to being a historic flag solely representing a historic county when it still enjoys use throughout Ceredigion today.

Should the official name of the county revert to the anglicised 'Cardiganshire' then the name of the article ahould duely change. It is annoing that the Flag Institute have seemingly not weighed in on any form of recogniion for the flag which would provide use with more clarity regarding this article. Without their input however we cannot assume they would favour Cardiganshire over Ceredigion if the flag is still in use today and represents that polity. Domersr (talk) 09:20, 29 February 2024 (UTC)[reply]

The flags which have been registered for counties have been for traditional counties - hence Glamorgan, Caernarfonshire, Merionethshire etc. Cardiganshire is one such.

The name 'Ceredigion' was reinvented in 1974 for a local government district, so that it would have a language-neutral name, as was 'Dyfed'. The Local Government (Wales) Act 1994 used Cardiganshire / Sir Aber Teifi for the new 'principal area' covering the 20 year-old Ceredigion district, but the council (understandably) changed it to the district name.

The name 'Ceredigion' has only been used for a local administrative area (and a mediaeval principality). The county has only ever borne the name 'Cardiganshire'. Hogweard (talk) 09:45, 29 February 2024 (UTC)[reply]

While yes there is an argument of consistency, if sources associate the flag with Cardiganshire then surely that should be used, but understand not easy to do as it has no recognition. Ceredigion and Cardiganshire are in one article because they cover the same area, but these flags only technically represent the older counties. Ofc, I guess we have to wait if this flag ever gets recognition to then decide which name sources use more, but Cardiganshire should be in the lead at least. Dank Jae 12:42, 29 February 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Domersr originally created the article under Ceredigion, not Cardiganshire. Dank Jae 12:38, 29 February 2024 (UTC)[reply]

It will be interesting to see if they do finally get around to registering a county flag. I have not lived in the county for many years and I do not know how widespread it is, or whether there is an organisation that would adopt it. I would hope that they adopt it by the name of the county, not that of the local government area.

Anyway, the point of the thread was about putting 'Cardiganshire' in the opening paragraph. That has got to be a solid "yes". Hogweard (talk) 21:06, 5 March 2024 (UTC)[reply]