Talk:Feral child/Archive 1

Archive 1

Russian news article

regarding mosnews.com:newsru.com -- yeah, I know I linked to a russian article; you can find any number of english articles by googling for "andrei raised by dog" vel. sim. My point was to link to the original article the others are derived from (apart from local newspapers), which it so happens is in russian ;) Dbachmann 15:13, 10 Aug 2004 (UTC)

That's all fine, but it is an english article on english wikipedia. :-) - Omegatron 16:49, Aug 10, 2004 (UTC)

fair enough. in case anybody wants the newsru article, it's here: http://newsru.com/russia/03aug2004/dog_mother.html— Preceding unsigned comment added by Dbachmann (talk • contribs) 07:59, 11 August 2004 (UTC)

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Is it best for this article's title to stay in the plural? --Ryguasu — Preceding undated comment added 02:35, 5 February 2003 (UTC)

good point.— Preceding unsigned comment added by Dbachmann (talk • contribs) 07:59, 11 August 2004 (UTC)

Genie - Changes

I've imported the short case-study 'Genie@ from the page of that name, allowing that page to take the text from Jinni. Not only was it intuitively appropriate, but some 30 internal links to Genie virtually all refer to genies, not Feral children. Heenan73 17:40, 20 Jul 2004 (UTC)

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According to AS Psychology textbooks, Genie in fact went to several foster homes including one in which she was abused again. Should this be added to the page? --User:DJCF— Preceding undated comment added 20:06, 21 November 2004 (UTC)

Classification

After reading a few articles about Genie using the links provided here and at her own article, I am not too sure on something. Is the government keeping her in that home for the mentally retarted without outside human contact, or is her mother still alive and doing that? If her mom is still alive, where can I contact her? If it is the government that is doing this, how can I ask them if I can get her to live in a apartment and have a teaching staff give her time and love, with her getting contact with the outside world? I myslef would like to meet her. --Admiral Roo 19:52, August 2, 2005 (UTC)

Appropriateness of the case study

I noticed that the case of Genie was briefly referenced in the article "language acquisition", and was thinking maybe it would be more appropriate there, or perhaps elsewhere, as Genie was not in fact raised by animals at all. So it would seem to NOT in fact be a case study for feral children.— Preceding unsigned comment added by 24.222.225.224 (talk • contribs) 03:19, 28 December 2004 (UTC)

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Genie still has her own entry at Genie (feral child). That page seems inferior to this one. Ought it to be deleted, or reset to forward here? --User:Ilyusha— Preceding undated comment added 19:59, 5 February 2005 (UTC)

I think the Genie section should be removed from this article. The article is about feral childs in general, but Genie takes almost half of the article, even when it has its own article. Maybe the latter should be improved --as you say it is inferior-- before the section being removed. rbonvall July 7, 2005 22:36 (UTC)

Examples

"A feral child is an extremely rare phenomenon, and there are only just over a hundred known cases [1], of which - apart from cases of confined children - all but three are disputed." What are the three cases? - Matthew238 08:27, 26 December 2005 (UTC)

Critical Distinction

I think there needs to be a distinction made between those children who have been confined or abandonned (like Genie and Kaspar Hauser) and those children who have been fostered and raised in the wild by animals. The former show inability to fit into human (or any) society. The latter, whilst they can not fit into human society, function perfectly well in the society of their adoptive animal foster parents. Whilst they may have behaviours in common, to confuse the two is a mark of anthropocentric thinking.

John D. Croft 13:02, 26 July 2006 (UTC)

Opening paragraph

I don't particularly agree with the opening paragraph. It seems to imply that feral children have no contact with other humans and are phisically isolated. This is not always the case. Edik of Ukraine and Oxana Malaya are both considered to be feral children although neither of them was physically confined or isolated and both of them had some contact with other people. Is there a way that we could clarify the opening? Suggestions anyone? Mrplastic 07:45, 10 June 2006 (UTC)

Oxana Malaya and Edik were physically in contact with humans but they weren't technically human, since they couldn't communicate by language of any kind. — Preceding unsigned comment added by Shimmera (talk • contribs) 02:08, 28 August 2006 (UTC)

External link request

I would like to suggest this page as an external link:

http://www.forteantimes.com/features/articles/232/wild_things_feral_children.html

I am the editor of the site, so I am suggesting the link rather than adding it in myself — Preceding unsigned comment added by Troffler (talk • contribs) 11:48, 18 June 2007 (UTC)

Critical determinism effect

The most impressive feature of feral children is their non-human behaviour (walking on all fours, eating raw meat, not speaking) and this is found in a number of cases of children found deprived of human contact. The article gives us the impression that that are very few "real cases" known to science, but this is not true. The article´s list of real cases is extremely poor, and most of them are from the seventeenth century, ignoring the much more documented cases of the last two centuries. The only doubt is about wheter the children were raised by animals, but that stands also for Genie (and Kaspar Hauser) and this is not crucial to the definition of feral children, as emphasized by the very article. The most impressive case - and one that we are sure animals are involved - the indian wolf girls, is missing from the article, as well as many other Indian, European and African reports.

I honestly believe that feral children reports are embarassing to nowadays mainstream scientists (linguists and psychologists included) for they challenge a dogmatic trust in biological determinism, and that would explain the mythical character of feral children reports. When the cases are serioully discussed at all, non-human behaviour of those children (mostly their poor linguistic performance) is generally atributed to the "critical period effect", dismissing, again, the complex interactions that human beings and any other organisms must experience to be what they´re supposed to be.

Beto Vianna

Besides that, the list of cases does not mentions which animals where those that raised the people mentioned.— Preceding unsigned comment added by 200.150.33.153 (talk • contribs) 17:59, 10 February 2005 (UTC)

No humans were ever raised by animals! The "non-human" behaviour is caused by congenital defects. Except a very few cases of isolation (like Genie) the "feral children" are a mixture of myth, misunderstanding, primitive ancient attempts at explanation and OUTRIGHT LIES, as in the case of Amala and Kamala Kraxler 19:35, 8 November 2007 (UTC)

The Forbidden Experiment

Should there be a section dedicated to "The Forbidden Experiment"? I'm surprised there isn't even a Wikipedia article for The Forbidden Experiment. Ospinad (talk) 15:15, 14 December 2007 (UTC)

Amala & Kamala confused?

"Amala, who was eight years old when found, died a year later, and Kamala, who was one and a half, survived until 1929"

This page states that Kamala died of typhoid fever; the Amala & Kamala page states that she died of kidney failure. Sharlynn loraine (talk) 17:09, 13 December 2007 (UTC)

Given that the cases of Amala and Kamala seem to have been part of the same hoax (as described, albeit poorly, on that page), shouldn't some other example be linked in the first paragraph in this article? Tuanomsoc (talk) 02:36, 28 April 2008 (UTC)

Previous discussions without headers

THE WILD GIRL OF SONGY (known also as THE WILD GIRL OF CHAMPAGNE) Why CambridgeBayWeather almost vandelized, on 2 sites, the datas concerning the only true case of a feral child, qualifying them of "stuff dumped" ? The prestigious University of Notre-Dame (Indiana) published several articles concerning this case. He should rather have create a new article, as I did, on the link Wild Girl of Songy. —Preceding unsigned comment added by Chicagouniversity (talk • contribs) 16:41, 8 June 2008 (UTC)

Wolves hoax

Regarding the 2008 disclosure that the bestselling French book and movie Survivre avec les loups (Survival with Wolves) was a media hoax: This unsourced statement concerns Survivre avec les loups, based on Misha: A Mémoire of the Holocaust Years (to which the first link redirects). The story turned out to be fabricated. 85.216.70.250 (talk) 02:50, 28 August 2008 (UTC)

Feral Child reports, Language Acquisition, & the Critical Period

Data from feral child reports has been used before as an argument in favor of the Critical Period Hypothesis (the hypothesis that humans can acquire language well in the early years of life, and that if they don't acquire any language before the 'Critical Period' they will never have full command of a language). This is mentioned prominently in the article I just linked to above, and also in Critical Period, but this article on feral children doesn't mention anything about their contribution to this discussion. Is there any section in this article under which that information would fit, or should I start a new section (which would also have a See also link to the articles mentioned above)? --Politizer (talk) 19:36, 31 August 2008 (UTC)

Songi?

Why does 'Songi' ("The girl of Songi in Champagne") link right back to this page? What does the word Songi mean? — Preceding unsigned comment added by 69.95.232.128 (talk • contribs) 16:20, 25 October 2006 (UTC)

Not sure why "Songi" links here. And I'm not sure what "Songi" means. But the girl was found in Songy, which is a place in the Champagne region of France. Roaming27 04:05, 5 December 2006 (UTC)

I've now changed "Songi" to "Songy", which is the correct spelling. Roaming27 04:18, 5 December 2006 (UTC)

"Songy" is an anachronism in this context. You won't find this feral child by searching for the "wild girl of Songy". I've restored the original spelling and linked it to Songy. Yappy2bhere (talk) 06:37, 22 December 2009 (UTC)

James Goodfellow

Absolut fake information. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 201.36.213.46 (talk) 01:31, 27 December 2007 (UTC)

Then improve it. -Jéské ^{(Blah v^_^v)} 09:16, 27 December 2007 (UTC)

Since when have there been wolves in Brazil?! Harjasusi (talk) 04:11, 23 April 2009 (UTC)

Since there have been beaches in Rio. I'll bet the Girl from Ipanema fought off a few! Yappy2bhere (talk) 07:51, 22 December 2009 (UTC)

Fact vs folklore

The Lobo Wolf Girl of Devil's River seems more fiction than fact. Life (magazine) included it with "Yarns and Whoppers and Practical Jokes" in its 1960 article Ballads and Tales of the Frontier. A 1937 version of the story, retold in Classic American Ghost Stories differs from the account in Tales with a Texas Twist, but both are clearly presented as tall tales. This article seems the right place for both the fact and the folklore of feral children, but obviously factual accounts must be distinguished from folklore. How should this be accomplished in the article?

FeralChildren.com, the source cited for many of the examples in this article, appears to uncritically include all stories of feral children without attempting to establish whether the account is factual or not. Examples of feral children citing FeralChildren.com as their source should also cite other, reliable, sources to be considered factual accounts.

Unrelated, but perhaps useful, is a compilation of lists of "wild children" in Benzaquén's Encounters with wild children Yappy2bhere (talk) 03:33, 22 December 2009 (UTC)

I removed the "Mowgli syndrome" paragraph from the lead. There is no evidence that this was ever a professional or technical term describing human psychological or physiological pathology. The paragraph seems to have herbalist Casey Adams' book as its source.[1] Adams cites no research or other authority to support his statement, and isn't himself qualified in either psychology or medicine.[2] Please see Talk:Mowgli Syndrome for more details. Yappy2bhere (talk) 08:40, 29 December 2009 (UTC)

Questions about references

Serge Aroles' biography Marie-Angélique

(was "The truth about Marie Angelique")

I referenced Aroles' biography of Marie Angelique as much as I dared without reading it, leaving an awkward "According to..." in place until someone can sort out Aroles' claims from the claims of the unspecified North American authors who were "almost all... wrong". I'm unhappy to leave it like this, but it's a start. Yappy2bhere (talk) 08:02, 22 December 2009 (UTC)

Rauber's Homo sapiens ferus

I added several references to Chambers' The Child and Childhood in Folk-Thought, but these are really references to A. Rauber's list of feral children in his Homo sapiens ferus. As such, all the Chambers references (including the original reference) are tertiary sources and should be replaced with the secondary source as soon as someone finds a copy of Homo sapiens ferus. Yappy2bhere (talk) 08:11, 22 December 2009 (UTC)

The cases of feral children described in Homo sapiens ferus have been referenced, as appropriate. Is Chambers still useful as a reference? Yappy2bhere (talk) 00:38, 26 December 2009 (UTC)

Fun(ny) facts

I'd like to find sources for the dates given in the article, and eliminate any unsourced anomalous dates.

Hessian wolf children (1304, 1341 and 1344). Rauber cites reports in 1341 and 1344, and Chambers cites Rauber. Fantini though gives a date of 1349 for the Hessian wolf boy, and there is no source for the 1304 date. Does anyone know a source for these two dates?

Bamberg boy (late 1500s). Rauber (p.18) places him at the end of the 16th century, citing Camerarius' Horae Subcisivae, and Chambers cites Rauber. Singh, Zingg, and Feuerbach (Wolf-children and feral man; cited by Fantini) appear to dispute that this is a feral child [3], but all I have is this snippet. Has anyone read the source?

three Lithuanian bear-boys (1657, 1669, 1694). Rauber relates encounters in 1657 and 1663 (p.21), citing Rzaczynski (Historia Naturalis curiosa) [4], in 1661 (p.24), citing Louis Moreri's Le Grand Dictionaire Historique (Ursin, p.1225) [5], in 1669 (reported by Y. B. van den Kleverskerk) and in 1694 (reported by Bernard Connor) (p.26), citing Connor's 1698 History of Poland [6]. Chambers, citing Rauber, reports these as 1657, 1669, and 1694. Fantini reports only the 1661 encounter, perhaps after Rauber though I don't know for sure.

Peter the Wild Boy of Hamelin (1724). Rauber (p.32) reports 1724, citing the Breslauer Sammlung (1729), and Chambers cites Rauber. Rauber though calls him "Wild Peter of Hamelin," not "Peter the Wild Boy". Where did the name "Peter the Wild Boy" come from?

Tertiary sources

There are several tertiary sources, in English, which appear to simply extract dates from Rauber and translate his names from the German. Should one be kept, or all of them, or none of them? If not all, then which should remain?

Fantini, Language acquisition of a bilingual child.[7] Is there any reason besides the anomalous 1349 date for the Hessian wolf boy to keep Fantini as a source? Yappy2bhere (talk) 11:09, 26 December 2009 (UTC)

Deal, The Origin and Performance History of Carl Maria von Weber's Das Waldmädchen [8], currently a reference for the case of the Kronstadt boy (1781), relates the story without citing a source, so it really isn't useful as a source for this case. It does though include a useful bibliography of works describing feral children. It would better serve as a reference for Weber's ballet, which should be included along with other similar works in this article. Yappy2bhere (talk) 09:13, 29 December 2009 (UTC)

How relevant is that?

Paragraph 1: "Just over one hundred incidents have been reported in English.[2]" —Preceding unsigned comment added by 188.222.29.183 (talk) 06:10, 6 March 2010 (UTC)

yes, what does it matter what language was used to report the thing? who wrote this? —Preceding unsigned comment added by 190.55.231.120 (talk) 02:35, 16 July 2010 (UTC)

...and what exactly is it supposed to mean? Looking at the source they've got, which is http://www.feralchildren.com/en/children.php , it seems they're just going by the number of feral children listed on that one webpage, which is completely meaningless. For all we know from the information given, there could be books in english that document thousands of known cases. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 99.254.65.130 (talk) 18:20, 28 July 2010 (UTC)

No, it doesn't matter what language was used, nor was the language of the original report always English. I've changed the lead accordingly. If you know of books that document thousands of cases, please cite them. As it stands, there are a hundred or so reported cases, a dozen plausible cases, but not one case of an indisputably feral child. Yappy2bhere (talk) 22:07, 29 August 2010 (UTC)

I found an online Russian newspaper article about a feral girl

I'm sorry if this case is already mentioned in the article. I looked at the "Documented/alleged cases" section and didn't find it.

http://www.en.rian.ru/russia/20090702/155414863.html

Another child raised by dogs discovered in Russia's Far East

^{Another child raised by dogs discovered in Russia's Far East}

17:22 02/07/2009

" MOSCOW, July 2 (RIA Novosti) - Police in Russia's Far East said that they have found another child that has been raised by dogs, Ren TV reported on Thursday.

The police found six-year-old Veronika Tishchenko in a house along with three adults in the town of Vyazemsky, Khabarovsk Territory, several days ago.

Earlier in June, police in Chita, East Siberia, brought charges against the parents of another dog girl, five-year-old Natasha. The girl, dubbed Mowgli by the press, is currently being treated in a social-rehabilitation centre ."

"Related News

• Doctors say Siberian 'wild child' could soon adapt to normal life (supposed to have 2 photos)
• Parents of Siberian 'dog child' to face criminal charges
• Siberian girl 'acts like dog' after being locked up since infancy

Multimedia

• The father of a Mowgli girl shows in what conditions his daughter lived (video) "

Gatorgirl7563 (talk) 18:14, 19 November 2010 (UTC)

Isn't Genie's case more important than Amala and Kamala's?

The former was much more recent. She was subjected to a plethora of modern psychological and physical tests including brain scans. I wrote a paper on this subject for college and honestly I never even heard of Amala and Kamala. The most important cases that came up were Genie_(feral_child) and Victor_of_Aveyron. My point is the article is a bit skewed because it mentions Amala and Kamala's case over and over in the first few sections as if it's the most important case.

P.S A related phenomenon is sometimes found in severely neglected children in orphanages.

P.P.S. Also see Helen Keller, a woman born death and blind. --PeteXor 05:57, 28 September 2007 (UTC)

Helen Keller was not born deaf and blind; she lost her sight and hearing at the age of about 16 months from a high fever that damaged her brain. As I understand it, she was able to communicate somewhat with her family (before learning from Annie Sullivan) by using a rudimentary sign language. Dinazina (talk) 17:27, 25 January 2011 (UTC)

Marina Chapman

I'm not sure how reliable this is or whether it meets the list criteria but:[9]

Marina has come a long way from the remote jungles of Colombia where she lived with a troop of capuchin monkeys for five years.

Bovlb (talk) 20:49, 24 October 2012 (UTC)

Well, her literary agent certainly has no reason to lie about it. The trouble is, there's no corroboration of any of her life story before she entered service as a maid. Believe it if you like, but there's no WP:RS that suggests she ever was a feral child. (And in north Africa at least an able-bodied slave is worth much, much more than one parrot.) Yappy2bhere (talk) 02:40, 25 October 2012 (UTC)

nailtrim

In the Text Documented/alleged cases -> 2000s -> Lyokha appears the word "nailtrim". I'm German so I tried to find a translation - failed.

If its a spelling mistake for a word I am not familiar with, please correct it.

Syntaxxerrorr (talk) 21:49, 2 April 2011 (UTC)

I changed it to "nail trim" as it probably shouldn't be contracted to a single word in English. If that doesn't clarify it enough, it means he had his nails trimmed (or cut or clipped.) Siawase (talk) 10:55, 3 April 2011 (UTC)

You want "manicure". (It's the same in German, isn't it?) Yappy2bhere (talk) 03:24, 25 October 2012 (UTC)

Article's Top/Primary Source - feralchildren.com - is gone

feralchildren.com, which is the article's most used source seems to be down (permanently). If new sources/cites for the information from feralchildren.com can't be found, the article is probably going to need to be gutted and rewritten as a substantial portion of the content is unreferenced . --Nogburt (talk) 07:39, 4 May 2012 (UTC)

Don't panic; the site is archived, and accounts for only 14 of 49 citations. Even so, it's not a reliable source, and so this might be a good time to cull the apocryphal examples that are "supported" with a reference to the site. Yappy2bhere (talk) 03:07, 25 October 2012 (UTC)

You'll find this helpful. Yappy2bhere (talk) 08:11, 2 November 2012 (UTC)

perhaps a section about feral children in fiction should be added

just an idea but, it would make the article bigger. star trek deep space nine and final fantasy 6 is examples of fiction where such things are. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 2A02:FE0:C100:1:1531:B302:E6D7:BB73 (talk) 18:57, 30 July 2014 (UTC)

Serge Aroles

Who is this person and, if he is/was such an authority (as evidenced by his name being mentioned more than a handful of times in the same section--"Documented cases"--why are none of his findings sourced in the feral children related articles? Not just this one but some of the individual "cases". Please source. Otherwise this seems like a case of Original Research and reliance on a single source. - Ageekgal (talk) 13:21, 7 August 2008 (UTC)

Serge Aroles is a Belgian surgeon who wrote two well-researched books on feral children, and was instrumental in exposing "Misha: A Memoire of the Holocaust Years" as a fabrication. Both of his books are now properly referenced in the article. Yappy2bhere (talk) 08:47, 22 December 2009 (UTC)

His book, however, is self-published and not peer-reviewed (as are many of the works of research into cases of feral children (Douglas Candland's, Feral Children and Clever Animals, for example. I agree that the prevalence of references to Aroles' work is suspicious and looks like original research. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 2601:282:100:4740:FCA6:EE62:8C17:2E09 (talk) 14:22, 18 June 2015 (UTC)

kidrex

kidrex — Preceding unsigned comment added by 2601:246:4901:AB80:F5D6:A3EE:CC3B:9475 (talk) 20:41, 16 September 2016 (UTC)

Split documented/alleged

Please separate out the hoaxes from the documented cases into a separate list. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 71.167.65.35 (talk) 00:45, 10 January 2017 (UTC)

I started doing this, but some of the ones questioned have to be examined further. (For example, if it was shown there was one bear-child instead of three in later histories, that's not really a "hoax" per se). I also sorted out the children by species/circumstance rather than by century, which seemed like just a placeholder. Wnt (talk) 01:30, 7 April 2017 (UTC)

Invalid entry

I took out "* Robinson Crusoes of Warsaw and wolf children, abandoned or escaped children in northeastern Europe during and after World War II" because it doesn't seem really relevant. Children who are socialized well enough to hide from the Nazis aren't really *feral*, I don't think. Wnt (talk) 01:30, 7 April 2017 (UTC)

I noticed the article did not have a history section, so I wanted to add this to the article.

Around the 20th century, psychologists were attempting to differentiate between behavior and biological culture. Feral children-children who are in isolation and those who live with animals gave clues to solve the problem.

Prior to the 1600’s, not many feral and wild children stories appeared in the European history, besides the myths and legends.

The description of feral children in the early years were: hunting for food, running on all fours, and not knowing language. Philosophers were amazed with such children that were rescued and brought back to society, as their behavior corresponded with animals and their inability to learn language. Philosophers began to question if these children were part of a different species from the human family.

The question was taken seriously as science tried to name and categorize the development of humans, and the understanding of the natural world in the 18th and 19th century. Anemone 20 (talk) 03:12, 26 June 2018 (UTC)

References https://www.britannica.com/topic/feral-children

I have added and fixed the following information with citations

Marina Chapman – She lived with weeper capuchin monkeys in the Colombian jungle from the age of four to about nine, following a botched kidnapping in about 1954.[6] Unusual for feral children, she went on to marry, have children and live a largely normal life with no persisting problems.

Robert a three-year-old boy lost his parents in the Ugandan Civil War. His village was raided. Robert survived in the wild with vervet monkeys for three years. He was then discovered by soldiers.[7]

Baby Hospital was a seven-year-old girl found in Sierra Leone. Supposedly she was raised by apes and monkeys. She crawled instead of walking, and ate food without using her hands. She imitated noises that apes and monkeys make. Her leg muscles were said to have not developed properly. Unusual for a feral child she cried most of the time.[7]

Saturday Mthiyane a five-year-old boy was discovered after living with monkeys for a year. He was found on a Saturday and that's how he got his first name. Mthiyane is his last name, named after the headmistress of the school he was taken into. In 2005 he was still not able to talk, moved like a money, and did not like cooked food. [7]

John Ssebunya was a Uganda toddler boy when his mother died. Instead of going to a care facility the boy went to live with vervet monkey. For two years he learned how to find food and travel. The monkeys protected him in the wild. When he was around seven years old he was bought back to civilization. The only communication he could do was cry, and always wanted food. People called him as being wild and scary. [8]

Bello, the Nigerian Chimp boy was found in 1996 after living with chimps for a year. He was supposedly neglected by his parents since he had some disabilities. He was seen imitating chimps and apes characteristics. [9]

Ehsaas, a Mowgli girl found in India in 2017. When she was discovered it was estimated that she was in the age range of 8 to 12 years old. When she was found she was naked, and playing with monkeys in a Wildlife Sanctuary. When the police was called upon, they captured her even though she tried to resist. She was taken to a hospital. She could not talk, eat, or walk like humans. In 2017, it has been said that she learned to walk, eat like a humans, and started to understand speech. [7] Anemone 20 (talk) 09:40, 2 July 2018 (UTC)

This is the information I want to add in the raised by dogs section in the article.

Oxana Malaya, was an eight-year-old girl who lived with dogs for six years. She was found in a kennel with dogs in 1991. She was neglected by her parents who were alcoholics. The three-year-old looking for comfort crawled into the farm and snuggled in with the dogs. Her behavior imitated dogs more than humans. She walked on all fours, bared her teeth, and barked. As she lacked human contact she did not know any words besides “yes” and “no”. [20]Upon adulthood, Oxana has been taught to subdue her dog-like behavior. She learned to speak fluently and intelligently[21] and works at the farm milking cows,[22][21] but remains somewhat intellectually impaired.[23]

Ivan Mishukov a six-year-old boy was rescued by the police in 1998 from wild dogs, who he lived with for two years. He ran from his mother and her abusive alcoholic boyfriend at the age of four. He earned the dogs' trust him by giving them food and in return the dogs' protected him. He became the packs leader. When the police found him, they set a trap for him and the dogs' by leaving food in a restaurant kitchen. [24]

A 10-year-old Chilean boy (Dog Boy) was abandoned by his parents, lived with street dogs who hunted for food with him, and may have nursed him. At the age of five, the boy was abandoned by his parents and escaped a child care facility with 15 street dogs. The boy lived in a cave with the stray dogs and searched for food with them. He would search garbage cans to find leftover food to eat. He was raised by dogs since he was little. In 2001 he was found by the police, and he tried to escape by going into the water. However, he was caught and hospitalized. [25]

Traian Caldarar (found in 2002) also known as “the Romanian Dog Boy” or “Mowgli”. Since the age of four he had lived without his family for 3 years. The boy was found at the age of seven and was described as a 3-year-old due to not having the right amount of nutrition. His mother suffered domestic violence as a result, she left her husband. Traian also ran form home sometime after his mother left. He lived in the wild and took shelter in a cardboard box. He suffered from infected wounds, having poor circulation, and a children’s disease caused by vitamin D deficiency. Traian was found by Manolescu Ioan who’s car broke down and while walking around he saw the boy. In the surrounding area a dog that had been eaten was also found. Many assume that the boy was eating the dog to stay alive. When traian was being cared for, he would usually sleep under the bed and wanted to eat all the time. In 2007, Traian was being taken care of by his grandfather and was doing good in 3rd grade at school. [26]

Andrei Tolstyk (2004) was bought up by dogs from the age of three months and was found living by a remote part of Serbia seven years after he was neglected by his parents. As he had speaking and hearing problem from birth. Social workers who found the boy were curious about why the boy was not admitted to his local school. This boy was not able to talk as he lacked human interaction and had many dog-like characteristics including walking on all fours, biting people, and sniffing his food before eating. [24]

Madina a three year old girl lived with dogs from birth till she was three years old. She slept with them in the cold, ate food with them, and played with them. Her father left her after she was born, and her mother became an alcoholic. She never looked after Madina since she was always too drunk and Madina would chew on bones from the floor with the dogs. When social workers found Madina in 2013, she acted like dogs and was not wearing any clothes. Madina was being taken care of and the doctors said that she was mentally and physically healthy even though after what she had gone through. [20] Anemone 20 (talk) 09:46, 2 July 2018 (UTC)

The list of cases

Could someone who knows the subject either separate the proved from the uncertain from from the known to be fraudulent, or give them some "start rating" or something, please. Impossible to know which are 'quality' reports. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 217.136.55.99 (talk) 16:17, 25 June 2008 (UTC)

New Case for Addition?

Danielle Lierow Photo/Audio story: http://www.tampabay.com/specials/2008/reports/danielle/ Text Article: http://www.tampabay.com/features/humaninterest/article750838.ece —Preceding unsigned comment added by 67.9.146.243 (talk) 08:37, 4 August 2008 (UTC)

Apologies if this is the wrong place to edit- this is my 1st foray into wiki-dom. A new case was reported on 2/25/09: http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/worldnews/article-1155351/Girl-3-raised-dogs-home-alcoholic-mother-neglected-her.html?ITO=1490

Also, I didn't see any mention of a case reported in spring 2008: http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/worldnews/1580159/Russian-%27bird-boy%27-discovered-in-aviary.html —Preceding unsigned comment added by 132.239.182.139 (talk) 20:16, 26 February 2009 (UTC)

I just deleted any mention of "Erin", supposedly found in 1986 in East Texas, having been raised by coyotes. The photo was already flagged for removal, on suspicion of it not being the poster's "own work", and the information has no listed source. I have searched the web and archives of Texas newspapers from the period, and considering the media fervor surrounding the discovery of any feral child, find it extremely unlikely that there could possibly be no mention of Erin anywhere else. It was a striking image, though. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 97.123.218.141 (talk) 07:07, 15 August 2009 (UTC)

I just saw some links to an article about a boy found at the age of four having been raised by a dog. His name was reported to be "Horst-Werner" on News of the Weird as of 10/23/2014: http://www.weirduniverse.net/blog/comments/tarzan_of_the_canines/. However, I have been unable to find any further information about him other than an html version of the same news story here: http://www.dusseldorf.com.au/dusseldorf-news/1988/3/20/neglected-boy-4-reared-by-dog/. While the lack of other sources makes me doubt the veracity of the story, I figured I'd put a mention of it here in case someone wishes to further research it. 207.250.144.45 (talk) 16:27, 23 October 2014 (UTC)Kyle Morgan

Hans of Liege

Listed by Rauber (according to Chamber), so now he's listed in the article. Yappy2bhere (talk) 08:59, 22 December 2009 (UTC)

Double entry

I removed the sentence "* An Amerindian from Wisconsin (then a French colony), she was brought to France by a lady living in Canada and then escaped into the woods of Provence in 1721.", which was a reference to Marie-Angélique Memmie Le Blanc, who had already been listed. 85.227.167.17 (talk) 09:36, 28 July 2010 (UTC)

"Shuckskinder" removed

I removed the "Shuckskinder" as spurious. There is no trace of either "[p]hysiologist Rebecca Gowing" or "mountaineer Jamie Gates" nor the conjuntion of "shuckskinder" and "Shucksmith" in Google Books or Google Scholar. The spelling of "shuckskinder" would be wrong in Austria were it not derived from the family name "Shucksmith" as alleged, but this family name itself is an oddity among the Schmidts and Schmitts of Austro-Hungary. A wiki-hoax, methinks, with "shucks" owing more to American slang than genealogy. Yappy2bhere (talk) 23:10, 29 August 2010 (UTC)

raised by vs raised with

Why are all cases except sheep and cattle "raised by" but sheep and cattle are "raised with"? N.B. Goats are raised by so this isn't consistent with farm animals or herds. Is there any meaningful difference here or should all subheadings be "raised by"? --Cravatitude (talk) 07:34, 29 May 2019 (UTC)

Vandalism

New sections keep being added/modified about cases of feral children being raised by the French/Danish... I think it's a meme or something. Would it be possible to protect the article? Cnsd922 (talk) 02:14, 14 March 2021 (UTC)

Seconded Antiaverage (talk) — Preceding undated comment added 02:16, 14 March 2021 (UTC)

Redundancy between sections

There is a section titled "alleged cases of feral children" and a subsection called "other alleged cases" under "documented cases". Both are alleged but one is under "documented" section. Makes no sense. 174.93.159.227 (talk) 23:54, 1 April 2021 (UTC)

Vandalism; reverted. Thanks. Yappy2bhere (talk) 05:28, 2 April 2021 (UTC)

Fact or fiction

I have a background in psychology, but no particular knowledge of the topic of this article, which would be developmental psychology. My understanding of the topic is that "feral child" is mainly a term that refers to myths, hoaxes, and misdiagnoses of child development problems such as autism. The majority of entries on this list are not "documented", but news reports or stories by individuals without scientific support.--WriterArtistDC (talk) 14:07, 4 June 2022 (UTC)

I believe the term applies to both fiction and non-fiction accounts of child neglect. One of the most notable accounts of unfortunate non-fiction being Genie, another being Dani of Plant City, Florida. I agree with the Tampa Bay Times description of how a feral child is defined. Some supplemental starting material may be found on Genie's Wikipedia entry. Adog (Talk・Cont) 16:56, 4 June 2022 (UTC)

Both Dani and Genie are not feral, but extreme examples of abused and neglected children. Feral children are lost or abandoned children who appear to have been sustained by living with animals for a period of time. Certainly such children would have been brought to professionals, and the case written up in a scientific journal. Instead, this article cites newspapers which give no details or analysis. As I am saying, someone with expertise is needed to sort though these examples and decide which deserve to be called "documented cases" and which are fictions.--WriterArtistDC (talk) 19:30, 4 June 2022 (UTC)

Today I have found and cited a chapter from an academic book which clearly states that there are no credible cases of children raised by animals. This was my own opinion that led to my tagging the article, but I am not a subject-matter expert, so cannot be certain about the scientific consensus on the topic. However, I feel confident in rewording the article to remove some of the more obvious problems. This would likely mean changing all "documented cases" to "cases in popular culture".--WriterArtistDC (talk) 18:03, 9 June 2022 (UTC)

I have moved the Raised by ostriches story to alleged, based upon the book author's statements in the cited sources as translated from Swedish to English by Google. I reiterate that all the stories about a young child living for years with only wild animals would prove to be either hoaxes or unsupported/alleged if examined by an expert.--WriterArtistDC (talk) 23:51, 1 July 2022 (UTC)

Wolf

I am a feral child but nobody knows yet what should I do 2601:153:900:DF40:BDA8:98CF:34DC:DDEC (talk) 00:35, 11 October 2022 (UTC)

Raised in confinement

This section doesn't really belong, nor does being raised in confinement make them "feral". Furthermore, there are hundreds and hundreds of cases of this, I don't think an arbitrary list of them is useful. Prinsgezinde (talk) 21:33, 19 July 2023 (UTC)