Talk:European industrial metal

This page should not exist

Maybe this page would work better if it were merged with the industrial metal article. This does not make sense. This genre of music does not exist. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 24.25.219.101 (talk) 01:51, 8 May 2009 (UTC)

This page covers a regional scene rather than a genre of music. It is kept separate from the industrial metal article for a number of reasons. One of these is that many of the European groups, with the exception of Rammstein, are nowhere near as famous or commercially successful as American groups (NIN, Manson, Rob Zombie). Discussion of industrial black metal groups on the industrial metal page would appear to be undue. For another reason, industrial metal is a "good article," which means standards for sources are quite high. Many of the sources cited here might not pass WP:RELIABLE at that level of stringency. Aryder779 (talk) 18:24, 9 June 2009 (UTC)

Absurd. a) There is no regional scene (an interconnected series of bands constitutes a scene, a few bands that vaguely play similar styles across the same continent does not), I challenge anyone to provde a reference within the print media to the contrary, bar NDH which is debatably even metal at all. b) Mention of Industrial Black would be no more or less undue that mention of Industrial Thrash or Death, both of which are mentioned on the Industrial Metal page. c) Fame and commercial success are no criteria for inclusion within a genre; Aborym, The Axis of Perdition, Red Harvest etc have made just as valid an artistic contribution to the genre as Godflesh, Pitch Shifter, Ministry etc and deserve equal mention. d)If poor referencing is an issue then it's up to contributors to find better ones, but frankly finding refernces for the worth of Aborym etc. is hardly difficult given their widespread critical acclaim and obvious impact on the currently expanding scenes within France and Germany.

Hecate

Are you serious? Hecate IS entirely in the breakcore scene. Her rendition tends to incorporate black metal, not the other way around. She is NOT industrial black metal, but a blackened, for lack of better words, form of breakcore. Jotsko (talk) 04:12, 13 January 2009 (UTC)

Please read this interview: Roel F., Interview with Treachery, Lords of Metal issue 87, December 2008. [1]:

"In 2006 I released my last solo LP, Brew Hideous, which twisted breakcore, Industrial and Black Metal into a frightening mix ..."

Her Treachery project is even closer to metal and further from breakcore: "The musical direction was not so clear cut at the beginning - we only knew we wanted to draw together the elements of Ritual Ambient, Doom Metal, and Black Metal. I am sure we formed our own synthesis of these elements which sound nothing like anyone else." Aryder779 (talk) 22:58, 20 February 2009 (UTC)

Irrelevant. What an artist claims to play is no indication of what they actually play from an objective view. Incorporating Black Metal elements does not make you an Industrial Black Metal band, just as incorporating industrial elements does not make a band a Black Industrial band. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 82.15.246.199 (talk) 13:47, 16 January 2010 (UTC)

Cyber metal?

Do we actually have a source for Deathstars et al. being cyber metal? I remember the term being used (briefly) to descrive Fear Factory, but I'm not convinced it actually exists as a genre. Blackmetalbaz (talk) 18:22, 18 February 2009 (UTC)

As I recall, the Terrorizer sample CD for this month includes a Deathstars track and describes them as cyber metal in the liner notes, but I seem to have misplaced my copy so I can't quote directly. Aryder779 (talk) 22:58, 20 February 2009 (UTC)

This is a slightly tricky point, but how many references would we atually need to establish this as a subgenre notable enough to mention? I'm guessing there's nowhere near enough out there to justify a subsection here, but perfectly willing to be proved wrong. Blackmetalbaz (talk) 14:13, 21 February 2009 (UTC)

Having done further research, you appear correct that "cyber metal" is not used consistently to refer to the Scandinavian groups exclusively. I've altered the article accordingly. Aryder779 (talk) 16:39, 21 February 2009 (UTC)

Origin of the term

I was wondering where the term "European industrial metal" is from and if there are sources. In Europe, and especially in the German speaking part, I haven't heard/read this term before. It's Industrial metal or "Neue deutsche Härte" Saemikneu (talk) 01:04, 13 December 2009 (UTC)

It's a neologism, created by some Metal purists. The article should be deleted. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 94.134.18.202 (talk) 13:34, 11 February 2010 (UTC)

NDH

Neue Deutsche Härte ("new German hardness", German pronunciation: [nɔʏ̯ə dɔʏ̯tʃə hɛrtə]) is a term invented by the German music press after the release of the debut album Herzeleid (1995) by Rammstein. It describes a musical style that is influenced by metal and hardcore, combining it with element from techno and related electronic music forms.

Ahaaaaaaaa, very interesting. But where the hell are the Industrial influences? NDH is a kind of German Rock/Hard and Heavy Rock music ("Deutschrock") with keyboards, nothing more. It's more related to Synthrock than Industrial Metal. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 94.134.18.202 (talk) 12:43, 11 February 2010 (UTC)

I agree, because industrial metal includes more of noise and avant-garde elements while NDH is just the fusions of German rock, groove metal and electronic dance music. I also object Rammstein to be labeled as industrial metal. Myxomatosis75 (talk) 18:06, 26 April 2012 (UTC)