Talk:Dysprosody

Discussion 2009

In your section “Dysprosody in the Brain,” you end by saying that studies are ongoing. It might be useful therefore to have a section that talks about some of these studies in order to back that statement.

Your “History” section is very solid with lots of interesting information.

One recommendation I would make for your article on the whole is to read it over once out loud. Some sentences can be cumbersome and wordy and could be potentially more poignant.

With regards to your “Treatments” section, you should definitely reread for grammar and make sure to add a source to confirm that speech therapy is effective. In glancing at a few of the papers, it looks as if speech therapy treatments are also tied in with Parkinson’s Disease, so it may make more sense to tie those two sections of your paper together rather than having the “Treatments” section stand alone without any sources backing it.

Dysprosody following acquired neurogenic impairment. Brain Lang. 1993 Jul;45(1):46-60. This is a paper that talks about models for dysprosody and may be helpful if you decide to talk about models for research or possible paths that dysprosody research may take. Aaron.fishman (talk)

Regarding your suggestion about adding a section on future studies of dysprosody, we added a little bit about how they tend to study the disease, and though we would love to discuss it in depth, no adequate information could be found. Because the formation of dysprosody in the brain is still so vague to scientists, the best they can do at this point is to continue studying areas of brain damage in dysprosodic patients. Thanks for the suggestion on sentence structure and grammar. We attempted to make things easier to understand! We added in some sources to our treatments section, but since dysprosody is not associated with Parkinson's alone, we thought it was best to keep the treatments section apart from PD, so readers can know that treatment isn't limited to PD patients. Thanks for the article suggestion, we used it in our revisions!Brikathleen (talk)

An article titled "A Neurobehavioral Approach to Dysprosody" by John and Diana Sidtis, I believe, would be a great addition to this wiki page. It gives a complete analysis of the condition with an overview of neurobehavioral disorders associated with acquired adult dysprosody. This article can be used to elaborate on almost every section of the page. More specifically it can be used to link this rare condition with Huntington's disease, autism and Asperger's syndrome, dementia, schizophrenia, and depression. Perhaps it could be used to make an entire different topic within the wiki page, such as "associated neurobehavioral disorders". Hope this helps. Giantsjs2000 (talk) 01:56, 24 November 2009 (UTC)

Furthermore, it would be more "wiki-like" if you were to include the introduction directly under the heading of the page and before the contents table rather than as its own subsection after the contents table. Giantsjs2000 (talk) 02:38, 24 November 2009 (UTC)

We actually did use the article you suggested for our page, and we agree, it was a very useful source, but thanks for the suggestion anyway! We took your suggestion and moved the intro section directly under the heading, that was a good idea. Brikathleen (talk)

The article “Dysprosody following acquired neurogenic impairment” (found at the url: http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/8353729) discusses current treatment for dysprosody in light of a new emphasis on cognitive control processes. This is worth investigating to expand your “Treatments” section. Further, work on improving sentence structure and clarity. This is particularly necessary in the “Symptoms” section. For example, the sentence “Dysprosody is classified as a speech disorder, and there has been evidence of other effects affecting more than just the accent with which the person speaks” should be revised to something like “Dysprosody is classified as a speech disorder, and it has been discovered to affect factors beyond accent alone.” Bergaa7 (talk) 02:40, 24 November 2009 (UTC)

That was a great article you suggested, and a couple of other people suggested it as well. We used it in our revisions of our page. We ageed that some of the sentences were wordy, so we did our best to clarify them. In the symptoms section we completely rewrote that statement. Brikathleen (talk)

Great start to the article. A simple suggestion for improving the page would be to try to link it to more Wikipedia pages. There were terms in your article that I'm sure Wikipedia pages exist for, and by linking your page to other pages, you provide for a more thorough and informative discussion of the disorder. Additionally, though you cited the article "Dysprosody nonassociated with neurological diseases—a case report," I believe this information should also be included in the "Causes" section, which is currently relatively short and only examines the neurological aspects of the disorder. This case study documents a fairly recent case of dysprosody (2004) that occurred in a woman with bilateral III degree Reinke's edema and normal neurological examinations. Because your Wiki page only addresses cases that occurred up until 1978, and were associated with neurological disorders, I think that inclusion of this information would be beneficial in providing a look at other studied causes of dysprosody. Naweston (talk) 18:57, 29 November 2009 (UTC)

Thanks for the suggestion. Information from the article is being added to the causes section.Msprockel (talk) 13:06, 5 December 2009 (UTC)

It was a good idea to link our page to more Wikipedia pages, thanks! Brikathleen (talk)

Comment

Agreeing with the previous comments, I believe the treatment section is vague & there is a need for references. Although user: bergaa7 provides a source that discusses current treatment for dysprosody in light of a new emphasis on cognitive control processes, I believe there needs to be a clearer understanding of how speech therapy is constructed in a way that enables it to be a treatment method for dysprosody. The book Neurocognitive disorders in aging By Daniel Kempler, which can be viewed by google books, provides further insight into understanding prosodic defects. Chapter 6 (pg. 92), provides additional information pertaining to methods for diagnosing prosidic defects and presents specific treatment methods developed for emotional, linguistic, and pragmatic dysprosody.

The link to view this book is: http://books.google.com/books?id=tbwOlDoQQR4C&pg=PA92&lpg=PA92&dq=dysprosody+treatment&source=bl&ots=1cE39YukJT&sig=NUR4CuUTBGi--6Y8F7I4UxUaJzg&hl=en&ei=mIEQS_XHBNW9lAfZ3vSMBA&sa=X&oi=book_result&ct=result&resnum=4&ved=0CBMQ6AEwAw#v=onepage&q=dysprosody%20treatment&f=false

Patrick Raab 02:36, 28 November 2009 (UTC)

Thanks for the suggestion and the link. The information was very useful and will be added to the treatment section.Msprockel (talk) 13:25, 5 December 2009 (UTC)

In addition, we tried to incorporate more specific methods of treatment in that section. We actually ended up using that source for other sections in our article, thanks! Brikthleen (talk)

While much research has been geared towards dysprosody and Parkinson’s it might be worth noting or exploring other diseases where patients show evidence of dysprosody. Although the studies are very current, some research has shown a connection between epilepsy and dysprosody. This might be worthwhile mentioning as “current research” or “future directions.” One article is called, “Gelastic epilepsy and dysprosodia in a case of late-onset right frontal seizures” (EPILEPSY & BEHAVIOR 16 (2): 360-365 OCT 2009) by Cercy, SP and Kuluva, JE. This article also references, “Ictal dysprosody and the role of the non-dominant frontal operculum” in Epileptic Disord 7 (2005), pp. 193–197. (JLB1117 (talk) 06:50, 29 November 2009 (UTC))

Thank you for that source, we incorporated it into our section dysprosody in the brain. Looking into dysprosody in epilepsy and other diseases showed us that much of the current and future studies on dysprosody focus on its relationship to those other diseases because it's easier for scientists to understand prosodic organization in the brain when they know what areas are damaged (such as in epilepsy, huntington's and PD, etc.). I hope we made this clear in that section, thanks! Brikthleen (talk)

I think a few introductory sentences in the very beginning of your article (before the contents box) would be helpful for those who search for “dysprosody” in a search engine and want a quick explanation of it. Something along the lines of 3 or 4 sentences just to quickly explain it.

In your Dysprosody in the Brain, I like how you offer the different hypotheses of how this condition could come about. Do you have any papers of these studies that you could incorporate into this section? I think adding specific studies could strengthen this section. Also, you mention how “studies to identify prosodic organization in the brain continue.” Are there any current studies that are particularly interesting that you could include? To show where this research is headed for the future? I think that could be an interesting topic you could explore.

Just some small errors: Your second sentence in the “History” section does not make sense the way it is phrased. Maybe you meant to say “causing” instead of “causes”? Also the sentence “It was two years later that [she??] was admitted to the Neurological University Clinic in Olso, Norway and seen by Dr. Monrad-Krohn”. Your History section is very easy to understand (no run on sentences; instead, very concise) and thorough.

I am just wondering if you did use any references for the Treatments section since you did not cite any. You may want to put those in to reinforce your statements there.

This paper (http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC495794/?page=1) talks about a woman who presented dysprosody possibly caused by a hemorrhage in the territory of the left middle cerebral artery. Those working on her used operative treatment to get a precise localization of this lesion which is rare. I think you could use this paper to show some of the work that has been done to identify the regions of the brain that may cause this disease.

Also, this paper (http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/8353729) describes a study from 1993 with people with neurological impairment and current treatment for dysprosody is discussed. It could be an addition to your article as well.

Overall, I think you did a very good job writing in the “wiki-style” and it was easy to understand. Just some grammatical errors throughout, so look out for those when making your final revisions, but great job.

MichelleMaglio (talk) 19:36, 29 November 2009 (UTC)

Regarding your suggestion about including the specific studies behind the different theories of prosodic organization, while we think this is a good idea, unfortunately the source that provided these theories did not discuss the case studies in detail. However, we did try to incorporate information on future studies in dysprosody. We were unable to find any studies in particular, but we do know that scientists are beginning to direct studies toward patients with dysprosody as a result of other diseases like PD, Huntington's, epilepsy, etc. Thanks for the sentence structure comment, we fixed it! We also added to our treatments section and cited it properly, thank you!Brikthleen (talk)

We also moved our introduction section to the beginning, to make it more "wiki" like- so thanks for that suggestion. Grammatical errors have also been fixed.Tothje (talk) 22:43, 5 December 2009 (UTC)

We also added sources to the treatment section and made it more in depth.Msprockel (talk) 23:57, 5 December 2009 (UTC)

Your article is very well written and easy to read and follow, which is key. Many have commented on how your treatments section is probably your weakest and I would have to agree. I have attached an article that discusses two different forms of treatment specifically for Parkinsonian Dysprosody, which may be helpful for your treatments section since you focus on Parkinson’s disease specifically. It is titled “Effects of Pharmacological versus Electrophysiological Treatments on Parkinsonian Dysprosody”. Here is the link: http://www.isca-speech.org/archive/sp2002/sp02_679.pdf. (Widrickm (talk) 20:37, 29 November 2009 (UTC))

Thanks for the article suggestion! We added a few sentences about this into the Parkinson's section about how normal Parkinson's treatments do help to improve the dysprosody symptoms. This was a great resource you suggested.Tothje (talk) 17:53, 5 December 2009 (UTC)

I found your article very interesting. I had never heard of this condition before and I think you did a good job of explaining it to me. In the 'Symptoms' section, you state that grammar and emotional capacity are affected by dysprosody and you elucidate how grammar is affected. I would like to see you explain the effects that dysprosody has on emotional capacity as well. I also think it would be nice if you mentioned whether dysprosody ever recurs or if it is merely a temporary affliction. (Rickxicity (talk) 17:43, 29 November 2009 (UTC)

Thanks for the comment. I added some more information about emotional dysprosody in the symptoms sections.Msprockel (talk) 14:57, 5 December 2009 (UTC)

Also, we didn't find any evidence indicating that dysprosody has a remitting and relapsing nature. Most sources said that it can go away with treatment or on its own, or maybe never, but nothing that said it might come back after disappearing. Good thought, though.Brikthleen (talk)

Hey guys,

I think it's really interesting how speech therapy can help. Other comments indicated that you should expand upon this, and I found an article that might help you go into more detail in the effectiveness of speech therapy. It's called "The response of the apparent receptive speech disorder of Parkinson's disease to speech therapy" by SHEILA SCOTT and Fl CAIRD. Here is the link http://jnnp.bmj.com/content/47/3/302.full.pdf.

chengkd (talk) 9:28, 29 November 2009 (UTC)

We improved our treatments section to elaborate on speech therapy. We cited another article that was suggested though, because it was more thorough than the one you suggested. Thanks for the idea though!Tothje (talk) 23:11, 5 December 2009 (UTC)

I think you guys are off to an awesome start with your article. I really liked the history section and thought that you did a good job of describing the diesease as a whole, but i have to agree with the first comment that there are several sections throughout the article that are very wordy. For instance I realized that alot of the sentences have the same structure and that you use the word dysprosody itself in nearly every sentence which gets quite repetitive after a while and wordy. My main suggestion for how you can improve this article mirrors mainly what other have said in that you should try to expand the the treatment section and should try to add more clinical significances for dysprosody. On top of this you may also want to add a section on how patients with dysprosody are affected in everyday life and what techniques speech therapists use to improve the patients symptoms. I think your refence from Diana van Lancker (#6)does an exceptional job at describing some of these techniques and the approach that speech therapists take in aiding patients with dysprosody. I also found a link that may help to describe relation between seizures (epilepsy) and dysprosody as mentioned in the symtpoms section. This article describes a patient that had dyprosody following a seizurea nd provides some insight on the cause of the speech impediment due to the siezure as well as some ideas as to how scientists should start localizing the focal point responsible for the disorder:

http://www.john-libbey-eurotext.fr/en/revues/medecine/epd/e-docs/00/04/11/0B/article.phtml

Finally Im not sure if you are aware of it but your second link for "A Behavioral Approach to Dysprosody" does not direct you to an actual website or source.

Millerwy (talk) 03:35, 30 November 2009 (UTC)

We tried to reword some of our sentences to make them more clear and to vary sentence structure. We expanded on the treatments section of the article and tried to include more clinical significances of the disease, including specific treatment techniques. It was a good idea to talk about how people with dysprosody are affected in everyday life, so we added some info on that. And we fixed the link to our source. The source you recommended was very interesting, but I decided not to include the results in the dysprosody in the brain section because it was a paper written on just one case. It concluded that emotional prosody might be localized in the right, fronto-opercular and temporal cortices, but other sources based on multiple cases contradict this statement, so I thought it best not to make any assumptions based one just one study. Thanks for the comment!Brikthleen (talk)

We also fixed the site so it now haws a direct link. We also included more specific information about speech therapy techniques, but used another source because it gave more specific in depth information. Thanks for the thought!Msprockel (talk) 00:04, 6 December 2009 (UTC)

Good work with the article overall, but there are some technical comments that would work to enhance the appearance and flow of the article. I agree with previous comments that there are many words and topics that could be linked to other wiki pages in order to simplify the article for the readers. Also, with respect to the introduction, perhaps a few words on dysprosody before the links to the bottom of the page would provide some information before forcing a reader to choose where to go on the page. Grammatically, the introduction itself is very scattered, and some organization would provide a cohesive direction for the article overall, especially in the last 3 sentences. The treatment section of the paper also needs references, even if these references have been used earlier on the page.

The history section is organized, comprehensive, and very well written. Perhaps it would help to move that section further up on the page and thus provide context for the symptoms and causes section. A very useful article that directly mentions causes and potential treatments is Kathryn Hird, Kim Kirsner, "Disprosody Following Acquired Neurogenic Impairment." This paper could be used to enhance the treatment section in addition to providing exact case studies for the causes and symptoms section. This paper also has organized charts and tables which would definitely improve the appearance and flow of the page.

One last note, when referencing dysprosody in the brain, some visual aid would support the reader in understanding the material and at the same time add to the page aesthetically overall.

homsyn (talk) 11:45, 29 November 2009 (UTC)

Thanks for all the great suggestions. We moved our introduction to the beginning before the links, and re-wrote it for better clarity and fixed the grammatical mistakes. We also liked your idea of moving the history section to the beginning, and did this as well. References were added to the treatment section, and we also added information into this section. The article you suggested was a great one- several other people suggested it as well. Information from it was added to the symptoms section. Tothje (talk) 22:52, 5 December 2009 (UTC)

Pontential Revisions

I have few suggestions for ways to improve this page. I just thought that some of the topics could be more detailed in terms of research. I like the layout of the page and I just thought that maybe the history section should be the first section. That way it gives the reader background information before they learn about the disorder. I found this really interesting article which discussed the a neurobehavioral Approach to Dysprosody. I though this would really help the article out in terms of describing more information (http://www.lacheret.com/Xinha/UPLOAD/2003_Sidtit.pdf) I thought this would be helpful because the article even states that it is focusing more on the both “from the perspectives of neuropathogenesis and neurobehavioral phenomenology, and it is based on a limited view of prosody.” I felt that in your wikipedia page maybe you did not a chance to really describe all neuropathologic effects of the disorder and that maybe this article could help. This article also talks about other neurobiological disorders which dysprody also affects and I noticed that you guys mentioned Parkinson disease and I think that article has a few more which you can mention. One thing I notice that this wikipedia page did not mention was a support group or maybe some of the social implications which affect people dealing with disorder.I found an article which briefly mentions some of the social impacts: http://www.patient.co.uk/doctor/Dysarthria-and-Dysphasia.htm, http://informahealthcare.com/doi/abs/10.1080/026990598122458,. There is also an article which talks about how depression can ensue due this disorder which may be another related disorder to this disease: http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC2526379/.

jesspf (talk) 11:45, 29 November 2009 (UTC)

After going over our article, we agreed that the history section should be first, so we changed that. We actally had already used the Neurobehavioral approach to dysprosody article you suggested, but thanks anway. We also included other diseases that are associated with dysprosody other than PD in our revisions. We took your suggestion and added in some social implications of the disease in our treatments section, but we decided not to include a support group link because we were suspicious of the credibility of the website you gave us, and we couldn't find the full article in the other link you gave us. When we tried to research it more in depth, we couldn't find much information on it since it is such a rare disease.Brikthleen (talk) —Preceding undated comment added 22:54, 5 December 2009 (UTC).

Your last link provided an article about a study which worked to see if it was depression that was affecting prosody in PD patients. I read through the article, and their study found that there was not any correlation between depression and dysprosody, and thus their results were inconclusive. Since they did not provide any new information that was not covered, we decided not to incorporate it into our article.Tothje (talk) 23:03, 5 December 2009 (UTC)

I first noticed that there is no picture or a "classification and external resources" box. That usually makes the page a lot more visually aesthetic. There is one sentence that starts "in a study done.." that I think would sound better if it began "one study..." The topic is really interesting but the article doesn't go into too much detail about causes. Even if there is no definite cause that researchers know of, it would be helpful to include at least some theories on what is going on. Where do these patients pick up the new accents-- TV, radio? Are there any patients who have come up with accents that they have never even heard before? The article also says that the specific location of injury is unknown except for at the hemisphere-level. Yet there is definitely more specific information on brain regions available. If possible, it would be helpful to be more specific on what particular brain region could be involved. Again, what theories do researchers have? Finally, there is one sentence with bad grammar that makes the sentence difficult to understand. The sentence is: "It has been found that there are specific areas of prosody in which PD patients have more difficulty with." This topic seems like it was really difficult to get information on because it is so weird and uncommon and because it is not very dangerous. So for the topic, I think you guys did a good job. But a little more specificity would be useful. alexbodo (talk) 8:57, 30 November 2009 (UTC)

Unfortunately you are right and this is a very rare disease so there is not that much known about it. We have now added more sources and information to be more specific throughout the entire article. There is not much information about the regions of the brain, because different cases show different parts affected, so they can't pinpoint it exactly. Also, cases are so rare so its hard to study this. We fixed the grammatical mistakes and took out that sentence you referenced directly. I hope the revisions make this topic more clear and gives more specific information.Tothje (talk) 22:46, 5 December 2009 (UTC)

Autism and dysprosody

This section is sourced with a source that is in turkish(?). This section claims that dysprosody is "one of the prime factors for the difficulty for people with autism to integrate socially, emotionally, vocationally, and with the rest of the world." Now, I don't deny that dysprosody is common amongst people with autism, however, to state that prosody is the prime factor for the mentioned difficulties is a very "strong" statement. I cannot check if the source really says this, but I doubt it. Anybody who reads turkish and has access to the source, and who can check that it is really correct? Lova Falk talk 09:16, 26 April 2013 (UTC)

Nobody answered, so I removed this section and replaced it with another one. With sources in English! Lova Falk talk 09:25, 24 June 2013 (UTC)

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