Jump to content

Talk:Dwight York/Archive 1

Page contents not supported in other languages.
From Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
Archive 1

Incredible Biases

This article is terribly infected with biases of source material, especially Phillips, but to call the movement "pseudo-Islamic" in the text is particularly egregrious. He did not found "several Black Muslim groups" or "numerous religious movements." He founded only one, which used several different names during different periods of its development, but only ever one movement was "founded." Then there is the question of the title of the article and his proper name. I am of the opinion that the title should be his name Imam Isa al-Haadi al-Mahdi and not Dwight York, as this seems to be the best practice to refer to people not by their birth name, but the name which they used most prominently in public life. Thanks for your attention.

Untitled

Here is the text that had been in the article Malachi York. some of mya be worth merging into this article. -Willmcw 21:28, Mar 28, 2005 (UTC)

Doctor Malachi Z. York (b. 1945) is the founder and leader of the United Nuwaubian Nation of Moors.

He was born on June 26, 1945 in Omdurman, Sudan to Mary C. York (1924-still living)and Al Haadi Abdur Rahman Al Mahdi (1922-1970). York is the great grandson of Al Mahdi of the Sudan (1845-1885).

Dr. Malachi York is the author of over 500 books dealing with subjects such as the origin of languages, religion, spirituality, ufology, new world order, freemasonry, black history, science, health, and the mind among many things.

Dr. York founded the Ansaaru Allah Community, also called the Nubian Islamic Hebrews in Brooklyn, New York in 1967. This group was an Islamic Sect. Around 1992 or 1993 he changed the name of the organization to the United Nuwaubian Nation of Moors and moved the headquarters to Eatonton, Georgia where an Egyptian village called Tama-Re: Egypt of the West was built. The doctrine also evolved to include Ufology, Sumerianism, Egyptology, Freemasonry, Christianity, Moorish Science, and Native American history.

In April of 2004, Dr. York was sentenced to 135 years in federal prison for molesting 14 boys and girls who were children of his followers.

Notes for the "etymology" section:

moved to Talk:Nuwaubianism

Amateur psychological diagnosis from afar

“York's behavior has over the years exhibited overwhelming evidence that he suffers from some form of schizophrenia, which would account for his erratic changes of persona, massive self-aggrandizement, and his numerous fanciful and counterfactual claims about his identity. York's massive and frantic outpouring of literature, especially the tendency for it to have every word capitalized, is also consistent with such a diagnosis.”

user:Jacrosse speculates here that York is schizophrenic, based on his erratic doctrine and idiosyncratic use of language. I think this mostly amounts to "I think he's crazy,"; though it is couched in medical-sounding language, and is therefore a POV violation. Readers are free to come to their own conclusions about York's mental condition from the evidence of his behavior and do not need to be coached in this regard. -Moorlock 22:43, 10 December 2005 (UTC)

I thought the article mentioned somewhere that he was diagnosed with an assortment of mental disorders as part of his trial by a psychologist.Pstanton 23:04, 15 November 2008 (UTC) —Preceding unsigned comment added by Pstanton (talk • contribs)

It is not a matter of whether he is crazy. That should not concern anyone. All geniuses are characterized as crazy. I am amazed at the writer's interest in Malachi York. Have you been following him for long? — Preceding unsigned comment added by Kuluwm0 (talk • contribs) 23:45, 3 February 2011 (UTC)

Missing sections

Two sections are entirely blank, containing only links to other articles. Please add summaries to this article to improve its balance. 62.31.55.223 14:09, 22 May 2006 (UTC) It is not a matter of whether he is crazy. That should not concern anyone. All geniuses are characterized as crazy. I am amazed at the writer's interest in Malachi York. Have you been following him for long? — Preceding unsigned comment added by (UTC)

Cult Leader?

Is there a category for Cult Leader? Also, are there any Native American activists who have pubicly stated they find this philosphy offensive? My Dad's Native and I find this very offensive. —The preceding unsigned comment was added by 66.63.206.7 (talk) 07:49, 23 January 2007 (UTC).

Some Mongoloid Native Americans wish to disconnect themselves from the darker Africoid Native Americans but that doesn't invalidate their indigenous statehood. There is a plethora of evidence (ex: The Olmecs) that prove there was a migration to America by technically advanced West Africans. Not only that, many of your so-called African slaves mated with Natives who's "indian reservations" where built right next to slave camps. Mario Van Peebles once stated that over 90% of all so-called African Americans are part Native. What right do you have to deny us of Native American Statehood? I classify as African American and yet my Great Grand Mother was raised on a reservation. Nuwaubian Hotep 18:07, 26 August 2007 (UTC)
is mario van peebles a professional race historian? i always thought he was an actor. you know, star of such thrilling cinema as "solo" and who could forget "jaws: the revenge". —Preceding unsigned comment added by 65.2.134.104 (talk) 19:29, 10 November 2007 (UTC)
Just because Nuwaubu claims that there is a "Mongloid" and "Africoid" connection does not make it so. Membership in a tribe is determined BY the tribe, not by the person making a claim.Pstanton 23:03, 15 November 2008 (UTC)
Peebles is not an expert. Henry Louis Gates, Jr. had genetic experts on his TV program that said rumors of Native American ancestry among African Americans were considerably overblown. Many more African Americans have partial European than Native American ancestry. Those African Americans with Native American ancestry did not acquire it as told by Nuwabians, however. Parkwells (talk) 17:50, 25 May 2016 (UTC)

Copyedit

Malachi's birth

Dr. York was not born in 1935, and the reference link for that is empty. I'm in the process of uploading this birth certificate, this should clarify that once and for all. He was born in 1945.

Here's the reference (it shows up on my machine fine, not sure why it's missing on yours): “Philips, Abu Ameenah Bilal The Ansar Cult in America Tawheed Publications 1988, p. 1 (see also: [2]). Philips shows that in 1975 York’s publications changed his declared birth year from 1935 to 1945, to coincide with the 100th anniversary of the birth of The Mahdi, who is popularly believed to have been born in 1845.” -Moorlock 15:35, 26 July 2007 (UTC)
New scholarship by Michael Muhammad Knight convincingly argues that 1945 is the correct date and it should be updated to reflect this. The Philips book is a notoriously unreliable screed. See Knight's book Metaphysical Africa: Truth and Blackness in the Ansaru Allah Community esp. notes on pg. 246-247 Mr Specific (talk) 02:34, 16 March 2022 (UTC)

This question has definitely been resolved, and not only by Knight. Actually, York himself gave his correct birthdate of 26 June 1945 in various places, but also it has been really thoroughly documented by Chuck Morgan at <http://nuwaupianism.com/360-questions/malachi-york/413-ask-the-nuwaupians-on-june-26-1945-was-malachi-york-born-in-ghana-sudan-or-boston/ref> . While Morgan is unfavorable to York, the documentation of his exact origin he assembles is very thorough. Also, with the release of the 1950 US census this year (2022), taken on 5 April 1950 when York was four years old, he is now clearly and unambiguously documented residing with his family at 125 Nostrand Avenue, Unit 1 D, in Brooklyn, NY. This completely refutes the idea he was born in a different year. This idea seems to have come from Bilal Philips only, and while Philips' book is a correct assessment of York's Ansar Allah from the orthodox Sunni Muslim viewpoint, Philips did not have the resources to investigate York's birthdate and thus made an embarrassing mistake on it. Since both York and his supporters as well as his opponents and critics other than Philips all agree that 1945 is his actual birthdate, the article needs to be changed to reflect that. Also, his current age then is 76 (soon to be 77), not 86, a significant difference, I would think.LCalpurniusPiso (talk) 19:30, 1 June 2022 (UTC)

The European slant

Resolved

Dr. York is considered a "black supremacist" by Caucasians and supporters of European rule because he teaches independence and "godship" to disenfranchised Africans, and other minority immigrants in America. However, is this a fair connotation to use within a platform where the ultimate goal is corrected and proper analysis?

Mostly, I think he's considered a "black supremacist" because he has consistently taught that black people are superior to people of other races, in their character, their physical makeup, and their origin. -Moorlock 15:34, 26 July 2007 (UTC)
Because of his Nuwaubu teachings, that africans essentially bred Caucasians to be a slave race, the Nuwaubu page illustrates the racist slant of his teaching more clearly.Pstanton 22:57, 15 November 2008 (UTC)

The Egyptian Church of Christ?

This is wrong. I've never seen it spelled this way. It's always been known as The Egiptian Church of Karast.

If there isn't any evidence to support the notion that is typically spelled incorrectly, lets err on the side of correct spelling --Pstanton 06:33, 20 January 2009 (UTC) —Preceding unsigned comment added by Pstanton (talk • contribs)

Bill Osinski

Bill Osinski is not considered a valid source. His book is mostly yellow journalism filled with half truths, loosely based opinions and lies. His comments should be validated or removed. The libel tag at the top of this page would indidate as such. Why should we view his statements as valid? What are his credentials or associations with Nuwaubu? Here's a response to Bill's Press release which easily defeats all of his moronic and tyrannical analysis of Nuwaubu. Blog about Bill's book Nuwaubian Hotep 17:27, 26 August 2007 (UTC)

That would count as original research, Nuwaubian Hotep. Its definitely against WIkipedia policy for editors to use their own materials in articles, and I think you would have a conflict of interest in writing a review of this book. --Pstanton 06:35, 20 January 2009 (UTC)

I do not live under your law, etc...

Resolved

Where is the reference for this statement please? In all my years studying Nuwaubu I've never heard or read Dr. York make such and outrageous claim about himself. If no reference can be provided it should be removed. Nuwaubian Hotep 17:59, 26 August 2007 (UTC)

Sorry Moorlock but the reference you're citing isn't speaking about Dr. York in particular but rather the African Culture. From what I've read in in pro Nuwaubian material (as opposed to the anti Nuwaubian material you continually cite) He (Dr. York) has never set himself higher than he laws of the United States Government. Nuwaubian Hotep 03:13, 27 August 2007 (UTC)
It is in one of his pre-trial hearing transcripts. I have at least confirmed this and therefore am marking this thread as resolved. --Pstanton 06:31, 20 January 2009 (UTC)
Ah, I found it, here: http://freedryork.com/index.php?option=com_docman&task=cat_view&gid=20&Itemid=82

On page 12 or so of the June 30th, 2003 hearing transcript. It actually goes on for quite a while because the judge just doesn't CARE, but York keeps forcing his lawyers to waste the Court's valuable time by making assertions of sovereignty at inappropriate times. The judge is actually forced to explain at length that the nature of the Court's jurisdiction is not the issue at hand at the hearing. —Preceding unsigned comment added by Pstanton (talk • contribs) 06:46, 20 January 2009 (UTC)

York exercised tight control over the sexuality of his followers.

It should be stated within this quote that this is an observation from someone which may or may not be true. Your referencing it as though it's an absolute. The introductory line needs rephrasing. Nuwaubian Hotep 03:29, 27 August 2007 (UTC)

The very starting of this article is a grammatical nightmare. Someone who cares may want to fix that. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 74.14.98.162 (talk) 03:09, 15 October 2007 (UTC)

The view that York exercised tight control over his followers sexuality is immediately backed up by a quote. --Pstanton 06:32, 20 January 2009 (UTC) —Preceding unsigned comment added by Pstanton (talk • contribs)

Fair use rationale for Image:Doc17sm@.jpg

Image:Doc17sm@.jpg is being used on this article. I notice the image page specifies that the image is being used under fair use but there is no explanation or rationale as to why its use in this Wikipedia article constitutes fair use. In addition to the boilerplate fair use template, you must also write out on the image description page a specific explanation or rationale for why using this image in each article is consistent with fair use.

Please go to the image description page and edit it to include a fair use rationale. Using one of the templates at Wikipedia:Fair use rationale guideline is an easy way to insure that your image is in compliance with Wikipedia policy, but remember that you must complete the template. Do not simply insert a blank template on an image page.

If there is other fair use media, consider checking that you have specified the fair use rationale on the other images used on this page. Note that any fair use images lacking such an explanation can be deleted one week after being tagged, as described on criteria for speedy deletion. If you have any questions please ask them at the Media copyright questions page. Thank you. BetacommandBot (talk) 07:15, 1 January 2008 (UTC)

Fair use rationale for Image:DontStopMyLove.jpg

Image:DontStopMyLove.jpg is being used on this article. I notice the image page specifies that the image is being used under fair use but there is no explanation or rationale as to why its use in this Wikipedia article constitutes fair use. In addition to the boilerplate fair use template, you must also write out on the image description page a specific explanation or rationale for why using this image in each article is consistent with fair use.

Please go to the image description page and edit it to include a fair use rationale. Using one of the templates at Wikipedia:Fair use rationale guideline is an easy way to insure that your image is in compliance with Wikipedia policy, but remember that you must complete the template. Do not simply insert a blank template on an image page.

If there is other fair use media, consider checking that you have specified the fair use rationale on the other images used on this page. Note that any fair use images lacking such an explanation can be deleted one week after being tagged, as described on criteria for speedy deletion. If you have any questions please ask them at the Media copyright questions page. Thank you. BetacommandBot (talk) 06:50, 2 January 2008 (UTC)

Doctorate?!

Resolved

Can someone with some information of York's early life please explain his education to me (and the rest of Wikipedia). For example, he apparently has a Doctorate (as he has the "Dr." in his name) but WHAT exactly does he have a degree in? Or does he just refer to himself as a doctor due to his position as "Master-teacher"? The "Dr." implies that he holds high-level academic credentials of some sort. Can anyone comment on this?Pstanton 23:14, 15 November 2008 (UTC)

I too am attempting to find out what qualifies Dwight York as a Dr. I assume he would have a PhD, but in what field of study? Also, why would a person who doesn't hold themselves to current human standards when it comes to morality, want to apply the human standard of education when it comes to giving himself a title?

In light of the lack of evidence/records of Dwight York having attained a PhD-level education, I recommend that the "Dr." be removed from all references of his name until his standing as a doctor can be confirmed. As stated at the top of this page: "This article must adhere to the policy on biographies of living persons."

—Preceding unsigned comment added by 66.151.227.20 (talk) 19:28, 18 December 2008 (UTC)

Agreed. Apparently he merely uses "Dr." as something to boost his reputation.Pstanton 00:48, 23 December 2008 (UTC)

The conference of the doctorate degree goes back to the old Prussia system of schooling during the late 18th/early 19th century. That system of schooling was brought to the U.S. by the Peabody and Carnegie families. This system was created to dumb down education and make schooling public it can be controlled. Shamans, medicine men and the like from various cultures can be considered doctors. I'm waiting for your response. — Preceding unsigned comment added by Kuluwm0 (talk • contribs) 23:55, 3 February 2011 (UTC)

Early life

I'm rather confused by a point in the early life and ministry section. It says in 1964 he was put on PROBATION after pleading guilty to a MISDEMEANOR charge of raping a 13-year old girl (?!). Since when is child rape a misdemeanor, punishable merely by probation? This is a little hard to believe... He should have at least gotten several years in prison, as rape is a FELONY. Can anyone comment on this? Pstanton 22:27, 1 January 2009 (UTC) —Preceding unsigned comment added by Pstanton (talk • contribs)

According to the SPLC, he was arrested in 1964 at the age of 19 for having sex with an underage, 13-year-old girl. He later went to prison when he violated his probation, as he was arrested for "possession of a deadly weapon, assault, and resisting arrest. As a result, he served three years in prison.""Nuwaubian Nation of Moors"Parkwells (talk) 12:33, 26 May 2016 (UTC)

Liberian diplomat?

Just curious, did the Liberian government or the U.S. State Department ever see fit to comment on his claim that he had Liberian diplomatic immunity? --Pstanton (talk) 23:04, 21 January 2009 (UTC)

There are a lot of dead links in the reference section, can anyone find alternative sites? --Pstanton (talk) 00:38, 13 March 2009 (UTC)

Try using Internet Archive. For instance, you can replace the dead link http://www.officialnaia.org/Without%20flash/indexa.htm with http://web.archive.org/web/20060205030742/http://www.officialnaia.org/Without+flash/indexa.htm

How is it both?

This artical under two contradictory Categories

  • Category:Former Muslims
  • Category:Converts to Islam.

so how its come? —Preceding unsigned comment added by نسر برلين (talk • contribs) 03:53, 4 November 2009 (UTC)

I believe it's a temporal thing. York converted to Islam, and then abandoned Islam for a faith of his own invention. —— (talk) 04:16, 4 November 2009 (UTC)

Chief Black Eagle redirect?

Is there any evidence that York used the alias Chief Black Eagle? I see an alias in the aliases section Chief Black Thunderbird Eagle," but I don't see where he used the shorter version. Still, that redirects here at present from the Black Eagle (disambiguation) page. I'm working on the Shoshone leader user:Duff/Chief Black Eagle article in userspace and I want to work out the disambig matter before I post it up. To me, it seems the search for Chief Black Eagle should lead to the real guy, not the guy who may or may not have used the name as an alias. I don't see a problem with both listings on the disambig page, but 'go' should lead to the main guy, and so should clicking on his name in that list. I want to change the Redirect and the Disambig page to straighten that out. Comments? Duff (talk) 03:52, 15 March 2010 (UTC)

Makes sense to me. -— (talk) 04:29, 15 March 2010 (UTC)

What the....

It says he pled guilty to "the misdemeanor charge of raping a 13-year-old girl".

How on earth is a heinous crime like raping a 13-year-old girl only a misdemeanor rather than a felony???? Stonemason89 (talk) 06:00, 14 February 2011 (UTC)

"Quotation" "marks"

there are way too many "words" in "quotation marks" in the article, they add absolutely "nothing" and I would argue are a violation of "neutral" "Point of 'View'" — Preceding unsigned comment added by 96.251.83.98 (talk) 22:38, 26 April 2012 (UTC)

Sources

While published books on this topic are listed, too many cites in the article are made to in-house websites of the organization. Given the scale of the federal investigation and trial, there must have been other coverage in Reliable Sources. These are needed to be added to the article. As it stands, it is seriously flawed. I have deleted sections sourced only to the group's own website. Parkwells (talk) 17:54, 25 May 2016 (UTC)

Hello fellow Wikipedians,

I have just added archive links to 4 external links on Dwight York. Please take a moment to review my edit. If necessary, add {{cbignore}} after the link to keep me from modifying it. Alternatively, you can add {{nobots|deny=InternetArchiveBot}} to keep me off the page altogether. I made the following changes:

When you have finished reviewing my changes, please set the checked parameter below to true to let others know.

checkY An editor has reviewed this edit and fixed any errors that were found.

Cheers.—cyberbot IITalk to my owner:Online 16:15, 10 January 2016 (UTC)

Hello fellow Wikipedians,

I have just added archive links to 5 external links on Dwight York. Please take a moment to review my edit. If necessary, add {{cbignore}} after the link to keep me from modifying it. Alternatively, you can add {{nobots|deny=InternetArchiveBot}} to keep me off the page altogether. I made the following changes:

When you have finished reviewing my changes, please set the checked parameter below to true to let others know.

This message was posted before February 2018. After February 2018, "External links modified" talk page sections are no longer generated or monitored by InternetArchiveBot. No special action is required regarding these talk page notices, other than regular verification using the archive tool instructions below. Editors have permission to delete these "External links modified" talk page sections if they want to de-clutter talk pages, but see the RfC before doing mass systematic removals. This message is updated dynamically through the template {{source check}} (last update: 5 June 2024).

  • If you have discovered URLs which were erroneously considered dead by the bot, you can report them with this tool.
  • If you found an error with any archives or the URLs themselves, you can fix them with this tool.

Cheers.—cyberbot IITalk to my owner:Online 00:01, 13 February 2016 (UTC)

Hello fellow Wikipedians,

I have just modified 3 external links on Dwight York. Please take a moment to review my edit. If you have any questions, or need the bot to ignore the links, or the page altogether, please visit this simple FaQ for additional information. I made the following changes:

When you have finished reviewing my changes, you may follow the instructions on the template below to fix any issues with the URLs.

This message was posted before February 2018. After February 2018, "External links modified" talk page sections are no longer generated or monitored by InternetArchiveBot. No special action is required regarding these talk page notices, other than regular verification using the archive tool instructions below. Editors have permission to delete these "External links modified" talk page sections if they want to de-clutter talk pages, but see the RfC before doing mass systematic removals. This message is updated dynamically through the template {{source check}} (last update: 5 June 2024).

  • If you have discovered URLs which were erroneously considered dead by the bot, you can report them with this tool.
  • If you found an error with any archives or the URLs themselves, you can fix them with this tool.

Cheers.—InternetArchiveBot (Report bug) 10:20, 30 December 2017 (UTC)

"Baa Baa" listed at Redirects for discussion

The redirect Baa Baa has been listed at redirects for discussion to determine whether its use and function meets the redirect guidelines. Readers of this page are welcome to comment on this redirect at Wikipedia:Redirects for discussion/Log/2023 August 5 § Baa Baa until a consensus is reached. Shhhnotsoloud (talk) 09:00, 5 August 2023 (UTC)

Retrieved from "https://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=Talk:Dwight_York/Archive_1&oldid=1253031091"