Talk:Dorothy Levitt

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Early life

Here's some stuff about Dorothy Levitt I've just posted on my blog comments as a reply to a comment from the author of this wiki - just in case you miss it:

"Hi autodidactyl, just spotted your comment.

Here's what I posted on the TNF forum about Dorothy Levitt:

"I didn't know there was a mystery about Dorothy Levitt but if there is, perhaps this might give a clue.

In the 6th November 1903 issue of the Times there is a report of a court case involving Dorothy Levitt and her friend Hena Frankton, they claimed damages against a van driver who had hit their car. In the 1901 Census Miss Frankton is a boarder with the family of a John and Julia Levit, no Dorothy in the household but the Levit's do have a daughter Elizabeth, aged 19, a typist. Go back to the 1891 Census and the family name is Levi and the father's name listed as Jacob rather than John.

Anyway perhaps the typist Elizabeth Levi or Levit was the real name of Dorothy Levitt, secretary at the Napier Motor Company."

So there is the basis of my theory that Dorothy Levitt was Elizabeth Levi born around 1882 in Islington/Hackney. Possibly the Elizabeth Levi birth registered March quarter 1882 in Hackney, ref Hackney Ib 519.

What happened to Dorothy? She was living in a flat. 1n Portman Mansions, Paddington, until 1913, but I haven't been able to find anything else." —Preceding unsigned comment added by Einion clud (talk • contribs) 11:07, 24 November 2007 (UTC)[reply]

Thanks Einion clud, I had already read TNF (it's almost a bible), checked the census sources and updated the wiki assuming it to be hard fact. I will now moderate the terminology to reflect the 'element of doubt'. Autodidactyl (talk) 12:57, 24 November 2007 (UTC)[reply]

For the benefit of those (like me) irritated that neither of the above editors explained what TNF actually was, it's The Nostalgia Forum on the Autosport website. 81.153.106.38 (talk) 01:20, 26 June 2010 (UTC)[reply]

Death

She appears to have died in 1922 from her will. I tried to post details on the Autosport board but gave up.

Father originally Jacob Levi born ABT 1851 Aldgate according to 1891 census, in 1901 he is John Levit then 1911 John Levitt born Portsmouth but being employment in tea trade in 1901 and 1911 seems a common thread.

Mother is Julia (maiden name Raphael according to one tree) born about 1858 Aldgate. Maiden name confirmed by marriage Q1 1877 in London City. Again a tree suggests she died in 1942 but not confirmed that.

In 1901 and 1911 there is a sister Elsie born ABT 1893 London. Her birth in the index is Q1 1892 Islington and full name Elise Ruby Levitt. A tree suggests she married Clarence Lewis. Marriage in Q3 1917 of Elsie R Levi to Mark S C Lewis in Willesden.

There is a birth of a Elizabeth Levi Q1 1882 in Hackney. Dorothy Levitt is living at Portman Mansions until at least 1913 (telephone directory)

In the 1901 census Hena Frankton is with the family so confirms the same family

Probate was granted 27 Sep 1922 for death of Dorothy Elizabeth Levitt of 50 Upper Baker Street who died 17 May 1922. Probate to Elsie Ruby Lewis (wife of Mark Solomon Clarence Lewis). Estate £224 2s 5d

It could all be coincidental but everything suggests she died in 1922. --jmb (talk) 15:38, 10 January 2011 (UTC)[reply]

Death registered of a Dorothy E LEVI Q2 1922 in Marylebone, age is given as 38 which is close enough to the right age. --jmb (talk) 15:48, 10 January 2011 (UTC)[reply]

Elsie died Brighton 1963 and her husband 1970 also Brighton. --jmb (talk) 22:34, 10 January 2011 (UTC)[reply]

Query: Southport Speed Trials Advice please

I'm currently writing an article on Dorothy Levitt and would like to check the date in 1903 that Dorothy Levitt competed in the Southport Speed Trials. I would welcome advice from contributors to the Wikipedia article, which, by the way, I think is an excellent article.

Various sources give 4 July 1903 for the date that Dorothy competed in the Southport Speed Trials. However, I've been reading Dorothy's book The Woman and the Car, and in the introductory 'personal sketch' at the front of the book, which includes extracts from her motoring diary, she gives the date of the competition as 3 October 1903.

I'm sure contributors have seen Dorothy's book so I would be very grateful if anyone can shed light on this discrepancy. According to Dorothy's diary extracts, she became the first Englishwoman to take part in a 'motor car competition' in April 1903 ("Did not win. Will do better next time"). Did the Glasgow-London run in May 1903; won the Gaston Menier Cup, Trouville, France in August; did the 1000 Reliability Trials in September 1903, did Light Car Trials in September 1903, then in October 1903 competed in the Southport Speed Trials.

I look forward to hearing back from contributor(s).

Many thanks for your help. Ann K (----) — Preceding unsigned comment added by Annk (talk • contribs) 22:03, 15 February 2012 (UTC)[reply]

Hi Ann K,

Liverpool Motor Club - History says that they ran their first trial on 4 July 1903. The site does not mention when they ran a second trial but it seems unlikely that it was only 3 months later in an age before email. I suggest that you write to them and ask. Good luck. Chienlit (talk) 16:37, 25 February 2012 (UTC)[reply]

Your questions about her intense competitive schedule for 1903 is both interesting and would lead to a possibility of a rewrite/caveat. Although I wrote much of the article I used nothing other than online sources, and I have spent several years watching bits of my prose permeate the internet so that 4 July 1903 is now 'the truth'. I suggest that you raise your question at Einon Clud's Radnorian blog Radnorian because he appears to be a clear thinker with a mass of archive material about that period. Good luck. Chienlit (talk) 16:52, 25 February 2012 (UTC)[reply]

I would rate your schedule gleaned from her book as much more reliable than the summary/derivative online sources that I used/quoted, and would encourage a rewrite (or actually do it myself if I could read the book) - but what was the event in April? Chienlit (talk) 16:29, 27 February 2012 (UTC) (p.s. AnnK - If you are able to paste a scan/jpg of the relevant pages here (or email me) I will happily do the rewrite/correction. Peter) Chienlit (talk) 16:29, 27 February 2012 (UTC)[reply]

I also suggest that you contact the BBC playwright Jerome Vincent. His radio 4 drama implied so much that seems to be accurate/credible that I wonder what his sources were. (The Fast Girl Program notes and background about Dorothy Levitt for a BBC Radio play by Jerome Vincent.) I tried to email him via the BBC but never received a reply. Good luck. Chienlit (talk) 17:03, 25 February 2012 (UTC)[reply]

Jerome Vincent's original BBC radio play implied a country / horse riding / Sussex lifestyle - possibly pure fiction. She drove at South Harting and Brighton and Bexhill on Sea etc. Levitts are noted in the East Grinstead area, see http://www.roll-of-honour.com/Sussex/EastGrinsteadWW2Civilian.html. ... and Selwyn Edge had an estate at Ditchling, Sussex (and JV implied that they met while she was on her horse and was either visiting or passing. Fiction?). If you are minded to do any more this may help. Chienlit (talk) 10:55, 26 February 2012 (UTC)[reply]

3rd October 1903 is the correct date, confirmed by news reports in the Guardian and Times newspapers dated 5th October 1903 — Preceding unsigned comment added by 92.6.45.113 (talk) 08:57, 27 February 2012 (UTC)[reply]

Hello URL - are you able to post links to the Guardian and Times pages ? Please. Chienlit (talk) 16:29, 27 February 2012 (UTC)[reply]

Hi Chienlit, I'm not quite sure how to use the talk pages, so hope I'm doing this correctly. Thank you for your various messages about information on the Dorothy Levitt page and for posting on the Radnorian site; I agree that the research on that is very good. So it your Wikipedia article by the way. Very good. I've worked in publishing for many years, as an editor and writer, and know how easy it is for all of us to to use information in good faith that gets used by other people ending its life as hard 'fact'. It's only because I've been writing the entry on Dorothy for the Dictionary of National Biography (DNB) that I began to get anxious about the discrepancy. It's good to know that the October date appears to be the right one. I'd seen The Times article but have not seen the Guardian. Like you, I tried to get hold of Jerome Vincent but without success. I didn't hear the play but reading the synopsis I would really like to know on what he based the information about Edge meeting Dorothy Levitt. The preface to her book mentions that he met her in the West Country so that's another mystery. It's possible that Edge's biography includes information that would be worth following up, which I may well do because I would like to write a book about Dorothy Levitt if more material can be found. Your Wikipedia article gave me a lot of genealogical leads for which I am very grateful and I've followed them further and now have Dorothy's ancestry back to her great grandparents on her mother's side. I have also put a letter in the Jewish Chronicle asking if there's anyone out there who might have more information. I know that Dorothy had two nephews, born in Brighton and Steyning. Both of them are now dead and I don't know if they had children who might still be alive. The mystery of what happened to Dorothy between 1910 until her death in 1922 remains a mystery. I did contact the FANY in case she served with them during the First World War but they confirm that she did not. Anyway, if you can let me have an email, I would be very happy to scan in the pages from Dorothy's book that relate to her motoring engagements in 1903 and others. With best wishes, Ann (Annk (talk) 00:34, 28 February 2012 (UTC))[reply]