Talk:Dora Wheeler Keith

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Page creation name

Difficult to know how to title the page of a woman artist who used three names: her maiden name Dora Wheeler, her married name Mrs. Boudinot Keith, and -- I guess daring for a proper 19th Century woman -- her use of her own maiden name conjoined with her husband's last name, Dora Wheeler Keith on some artwork. I've tried to give all names their due, since she used one here and another there.ElijahBosley ^{(talk ☞)} 19:24, 9 December 2015 (UTC)[reply]

New source

A pair of recent edits have added many citations to a three-part biography of Wheeler:

Weiss, Ila (2022). Candace Wheeler, A Creative Life: Book One, Genesis (1827-1876). Kindle Direct.
Weiss, Ila (2023). Candace Wheeler, A Creative Life: Book Two, Fruition (1876-1892). Kindle Direct.
Weiss, Ila (2023). Candace Wheeler, A Creative Life: Book Three, Bounty (1887-1923). Kindle Direct.

Information online about the source is a bit sketchy, but it appears to have been released for Kindle only and not have an ISBN. I strongly suspect that it is self-published. I can't find much online about the author, Ila Weiss, beyond that she also appears to have written a biography of Sanford Robinson Gifford published in the same manner. What makes this source likely reliable? Best, Wham2001 (talk) 06:53, 27 July 2023 (UTC)[reply]

The critical biography of Sanford R. Gifford (art and life) was published by the University of Delaware Press and is widely cited as the fundamental source on Gifford. The 3 volume critical biography of Candace Wheeler, recently self-published on Kindle Direct (to compensate for time lost due to the Covid pandemic, in 3 volumes due to online length restrictions) is equally scholarly and authoritative. It contains much new information on Dora Wheeler Keith based on extensive research into primary sources, and includes many illustrations of her work not previously easily accessible. This source should appear among the main references on the Dora Wheeler Keith page. Please let me know how to accomplish that, as the list is locked. Steinway315008 (talk) 20:01, 30 July 2023 (UTC)[reply]

Self-published sources are usually not suitable for use on Wikipedia: see this section of the "Verifiability" policy, but there is an exception for self-published sources by subject matter experts. Do you know what Weiss' credentials are? I could find very little information about them online, but I have to admit not looking very deeply.

Regarding the sources list, I suspect that the reason you are struggling to edit it is that you are using the "Visual editor", which is unfortunately, despite the WMF's best efforts, unsuitable for all but the most basic editing. In particular, this article uses the shortened footnote or "Harvard" style of references, which essentially are unusable with the visual editor. I suggest switching to the Wikitext editor – though Wikitext is a bit complex at first once you get the hang of it it's much easier and more efficient to use than the visual editor. You should also install this script, which will warn you if something is wrong with the referencing on articles that use shortened footnotes. Currently the article has a number of "multiple-target" errors (where multiple long-form references are pointed to by the same short-form reference) – I will fix those later if you or somebody else don't get to them before me

Best, Wham2001 (talk) 06:06, 31 July 2023 (UTC)[reply]

Thank you for the information regarding editing. I will certainly look into Wikitext.

As to Ila Weiss, she has a PhD from the Department of Art History and Archaeology, Columbia University. She is a well-known scholar of American art, considered the leading expert on Sanford R. Gifford. Since publishing her widely cited book, Poetic Landscape: the Art and Experience of Sanford R. Gifford, in 1987, she turned her attention to researching and writing a similarly authoritative critical biography of Candace Wheeler that encompasses her immediate family. This book, Candace Wheeler: A Creative Life, contains more information on Dora Wheeler Keith's life and work than any other source by far. It was self published on Kindle to make it immediately available to scholars in the field after the long delay in placing it with university presses caused by the pandemic. It should certainly comply with Wikipedia's exceptions to self-published sources. Steinway315008 (talk) 17:32, 31 July 2023 (UTC)[reply]

Thanks! She certainly sounds like the real deal. I will tidy up the references now. Best, Wham2001 (talk) 18:00, 1 August 2023 (UTC)[reply]

Now done. I removed the duplicative long-form references from the text as well. I also removed what I think was an attempt at giving a reference for the short description – this isn't necessary (and doesn't work) as its contents can be sourced in the article body. Best, Wham2001 (talk) 18:15, 1 August 2023 (UTC)[reply]

Thank you very much! Rereading the page I noticed an omission that could be rectified. There is a reference to the painting, "Daphne's Nymphs," that would be interesting and helpful to illustrate. A very good reproduction of it from the New York Public Library's Dora Wheeler Keith Artist's File is reproduced in Weiss (2023a). It is captioned, "Decorative Panel--Daphne's Nymphs, Harper's Black and White Prints, 1892, New York Public Library, Dora Wheeler Keith Artist's File, microfiche K100/A4." I do not know if it meets Wikipedia's copyright requirements, nor how to add it if it does. Would you be able to use the digital file?

Also, a small possible improvement in punctuation would be to remove the comma in: "23rd Street studio [,] against a shimmering gold backdrop"... Steinway315008 (talk) 19:48, 1 August 2023 (UTC)[reply]

I've removed the comma – that's the sort of edit that should work fine with the Visual Editor too

Regarding the painting, to use the reproduction it will need to be freely licensed, and in practice I think this means that you will need to convince yourself that it's in the public domain. Image copyright is something that I find almost incomprehensible, but there is advice here here. Instructions on how to upload images can be found here. If you do conclude that the image is in the public domain and manage to upload it, I can help with inserting it into the article – that's the easy part! Best, Wham2001 (talk) 05:53, 2 August 2023 (UTC)[reply]