Talk:Deaf bing

Article title and list criteria

I'm proposing a rename of this article to "List of deaf cultural tendencies". I've kind of intertwined here what might conceivably be addressed as two separate issues, namely: whether this should be a list article, and whether the expression "Deaf bing" should be part of the article title, but I decided that combining the two was the best way to do it. Taking the second issue first:

First of all, "Deaf bing" is both a neologism, and opaque. The term "deaf bing" is concise, but has almost no visibility on the web (58 results), and none in books (all hits are fortuitous colocations, typos, or OCR errors). A natural, descriptive title with words like "Deaf cultural tendencies" would be better for almost all users for reasons of clarity. A social media hashtag that is in vogue, should not generally be the title of a Wikipedia article, unless it takes off and shows staying power, and garners significant coverage in reliable sources. An example of the latter, would be Me too movement, but even there, the hashtag is qualified. "Deaf bing" is nowhere close to this in usage.

Secondly, this article appears to be a List article, and as such, should be renamed to List of <something>, as it is clearly a list and matches the structure at WP:STANDALONE. The main section which comprises 90% of the article content, is already a list, and is entitled "List of common deaf tendencies", which is quite close to the proposed article title. The article has already been renamed once before; it was formerly "Deaf Culture - Deaf Bing" in all caps).

Note that I'm not making a Notability argument, otherwise I'd propose deletion. "Deaf bing", as pointed out in the article, is a hashtag that was popularized in 2016, but the concept underlying it has existed for much longer. In particular, it was the subject of a presentation at an Oakland conference in the early 1980s, called, "deaf puh, what?", the "Puh" being the way the mouth movement accompanying the sign tend-to was rendered at that time, which decades later was picked up as "Bing". In any case, the article is about deaf cultural tendencies. If rendered as a non-list style article, the title should be Deaf cultural tendencies. If rendered as a List article, then "List of deaf cultural tendencies" or similar. (The word "common" is not necessary; by the nature of article title scope, one would expect the content to be *common* tendencies, at least in proportion to coverage in reliable sources.)

Another issue related to the title issue, has to do with the content. Since Wikipedia is not an indiscriminate collection of information, the items that belong in the list cannot be just whatever some editor wants to stuff in there. It has to have some theme, a set of rules if you wish, where a reasonable editor could easily determine that "this belongs in the list, but that does not belong." This is covered by section WP:LISTCRITERIA in the guideline, and that should be carefully adhered to, and probably described in the introduction, or at the very least, on the talk page.

I consider this an uncontroversial move, at least the "Deaf tendencies" part of it anyway, and so subject to a discretionary move without discussion such as Þjarkur performed on technical grounds earlier. However, because of the additional factor of making it a list article or not, I thought it worthwhile to open for discussion. (I also thought it would be useful to expose WikiEd students to Wikipedia's consensus-building processs. If there appear to be some objections to a move, I'll convert this into a more formal request for move format. I can see a third possibility for this article as well: merge the content into Deaf culture as a new section, and convert this to a redirect. (If the article is kept, it should become a Child article of Deaf culture in summary style.)

As far as the appropriate style for formatting a list article, please see MOS:LIST. Adding @Miajgoldberg, Hillarypatricia, John B123, Þjarkur, and Shalor (Wiki Ed):.

Note to new users: you are more than welcome to comment here. Wikipedia talk pages are about improving an article based on Wikpedia policy and guidelines; it's not merely a forum for registering one's personal opinion about something. When commenting, please guide your thoughts based on policy and guidelines. Some relevant ones to look at regarding this discussion have already been linked above, but for convenience, here they are: WP:Article titles, WP:Notability, WP:Stand-alone lists, WP:LISTCRITERIA, WP:Manual of Style/Lists, and WP:Moving a page. Thanks, Mathglot (talk) 00:28, 8 May 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Based on Shalor's comment at User_talk:Miajgoldberg#Deaf_Bing, it sounds like you might be leaning towards the merge-into-Deaf culture option; but prefer to hear from you directly about what you prefer. Mathglot (talk) 00:47, 8 May 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Strong support for a move to a more clear title. It's not even clear to me that the neologism is widespread enough to mention. Ideally this would be merged into Deaf culture, preferably not as its own section, and in prose form rather than list form. Having a standalone article reminds me a bit of these Buzzfeed-style listicles, and I don't recall many other standalone articles on "relatable" things. – Thjarkur (talk) 08:27, 8 May 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Thank you Mathglot! I share in your concerns here, particularly given the title. Something else that needs to be taken into consideration is that this seems to take a fairly Western stance on the topic of deaf cultural tendencies so this needs to take more of a global perspective. Deaf bing does look to be more of a Western thing, but there's huge value in expanding the coverage of deaf culture on a global scale. Shalor (Wiki Ed) (talk) 14:59, 8 May 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Based on responses, I think I agree that it should be merged into Deaf culture. Let's see if there are other comments forthcoming. Mathglot (talk) 11:16, 10 May 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Or rather, based on previous discussions at Talk:Deaf culture#US or global? and Talk:Deaf culture in the United States#Merge proposal, the destination should be Deaf culture in the United States. Mathglot (talk) 19:26, 15 June 2020 (UTC)[reply]

I've moved the section content to Talk:Deaf culture in the United States#Merge from Deaf bing for discussion preparatory to a content merge, and changed this article to a redirect. Adding Shalor. Mathglot (talk) 20:24, 15 June 2020 (UTC)[reply]