Talk:Darius Morris

Prior page

The log page for this page has one entry: "04:47, 13 April 2005 Moncrief deleted "Darius Morris" ‎ (content was: 'Born October 10, 1982, is a man that resides on the south side of Chicago{{del}}')". Presumably this was not for the same subject.--TonyTheTiger (T/C/BIO/WP:CHICAGO/WP:FOUR) 03:13, 11 March 2011 (UTC)

GA Review

This review is transcluded from Talk:Darius Morris/GA1. The edit link for this section can be used to add comments to the review.

Reviewer: AIRcorn (talk) 15:05, 23 April 2011 (UTC)

Hi Tony. I am willing to review this article. I only know a little about American basketball and am only slightly familiar with basketball in general, so I apolagise in advance if I ask questions which have obvious answers. However, as it has been unreviewed for over a month I thought I would take it on.

No link rot, one DAB double double.

• dab fixed.--TonyTheTiger (T/C/BIO/WP:CHICAGO/WP:FOUR) 16:45, 23 April 2011 (UTC)

I will go through each section individually and leave the lead to last. As this is a short article and because you are an experienced Good Articler (I first ran across you over a year ago at the Nobel Prize GAN) I will make suggestions that may not be necessary to acheive Good Article status, but I feel would improve the article or confused me or peaked my interest. I am sure you know more about the criteria than me, so can distinguish which are nitpicks and which are genuine concerns. One general thing I noticed is that the body reads like a collection of praise and records. While it is all sourced and not really an issue (apart from one sentence I found uncomfortable that is mentioned below) it would be good to have some extra information on his early years and personal life. However, I understand that he is in the beginning of his career and this might not be possible. I look forward to your responses. AIRcorn (talk) 15:05, 23 April 2011 (UTC)

High School

*In high school, Morris, who is the son of Dewayne Sr. and Robin Morris, attended Windward School. Does Dewayne need the Sr. added to his name and the "who is" is a bit redundent.

• • Who is removed, Sr. necessary.--TonyTheTiger (T/C/BIO/WP:CHICAGO/WP:FOUR) 16:12, 23 April 2011 (UTC)

*Morris was invited to numerous All-star basketball camps hosted by the likes of LeBron James, Steve Nash, National Basketball Players Association and Nike. Is "the likes of needed"? Would add "the" before NBPA.

• • O.K.--TonyTheTiger (T/C/BIO/WP:CHICAGO/WP:FOUR) 16:18, 23 April 2011 (UTC)

*He was twice named first team All-State in California. Sorry it might be because I am a non-American, but this makes no sense to me. How can a person be named a team?

• • Fixed.--TonyTheTiger (T/C/BIO/WP:CHICAGO/WP:FOUR) 16:20, 23 April 2011 (UTC)

*He was also named the MVP of numerous tournaments and invited to participate in numerous All-star games, including the Academic All-American Classic. Is there a number for the numerous? As you specify the Academic All-American Classic is this notable enough to red link (I could not find a wikilink). If not why does it deserve singling out from the other numerous games? Also MVP might be better spelled out the first time.

• • The point of noting that tournament was not because of the notability of the tournament but rather because of the meaning of the term Academic All-American, which means he is more than a baller. He is also a good student.--TonyTheTiger (T/C/BIO/WP:CHICAGO/WP:FOUR) 19:10, 23 April 2011 (UTC)
    • Can Academic All-American be wikilinked then AIRcorn (talk) 12:27, 27 April 2011 (UTC)
      • Actually, if you read the Academic All-American article, you will note that it is illegal for other organizations to use the term, so if we link the term to an illegal use, that might be a problem.--TonyTheTiger (T/C/BIO/WP:CHICAGO/WP:FOUR) 14:32, 27 April 2011 (UTC)
        • I would be interested to know what the general consensus is on that issue is for future reference, but it does not need to be linked. AIRcorn (talk) 11:51, 28 April 2011 (UTC)
• Morris and two Division I recruit teammates led Windward High School to the California Division V state title. Led seems a bit POV, unless he was captain or it is stated in a source. Also I can't find in the source where it says Winward won the California Division V state title. I would also add the year somewhere in the sentence.
  • Once we say he repeatedly won MVP awards at tournaments saying he led them to the state championships seems par for the course, IMO.--TonyTheTiger (T/C/BIO/WP:CHICAGO/WP:FOUR) 18:59, 23 April 2011 (UTC)
    • I feel that this is still original research unless stated in a source. I could not find anything in the source that supports the rest of the sentence either. AIRcorn (talk) 12:27, 27 April 2011 (UTC)
      • I don't understand your point. What "rest of the sentence".--TonyTheTiger (T/C/BIO/WP:CHICAGO/WP:FOUR) 22:53, 27 April 2011 (UTC)
        • I went to the cited reference read the section on Michigan and searched for Darius, Morris, California Division and Windward and could find nothing that supports any part of the sentence as it is written. AIRcorn (talk) 11:51, 28 April 2011 (UTC)
          • I did not notice that the page updates regularly. I need the April 2009 version of that page. Right now, I am having problems with using The internet archive for that page. I am hoping that this is a temporary situation.--TonyTheTiger (T/C/BIO/WP:CHICAGO/WP:FOUR) 14:19, 28 April 2011 (UTC)
            • Found a source that says: "Led Windward to a 29-6 record ... CIF Division 5 Playoff Champions after defeating St. Joseph's (69-53) for the school's first ever state title, closing with a game-high 25 points, eight rebounds and four assists". About to add it.--TonyTheTiger (T/C/BIO/WP:CHICAGO/WP:FOUR) 03:48, 1 May 2011 (UTC)

*Darius Morris received MVP of Olympic League, CIF Division 5A Southern Section Player of Year, and CIF Division 5A State Player of Year. I feel "was named the" would read better than "recieved" as this sentence is currently written. I know CIF is wikilinked in the lead, but I would consider spelling it out and linkin it here too.

• • O.K.--TonyTheTiger (T/C/BIO/WP:CHICAGO/WP:FOUR) 16:32, 23 April 2011 (UTC)

*Also Darius was awarded a John Wooden High School Player of the Year Award,[4] received by Jrue Holiday the year before and the likes of Jason Kapono and Tayshaun Prince in the past. "a" do more than one person receive this awars each year? The name dropping of pevious winners is borderline POV.

• • I could remove this bit if that is what you want. I think it is an artifact of content I copied from the 2009-10 or 2008-09 Michigan articles.--TonyTheTiger (T/C/BIO/WP:CHICAGO/WP:FOUR) 18:56, 23 April 2011 (UTC)
    • It is borderline and I think it would improve the article, but it is up to you and I won't fail it on this point. AIRcorn (talk) 12:27, 27 April 2011 (UTC)
      • I cut it down to just "received by Jrue Holiday the year before".--TonyTheTiger (T/C/BIO/WP:CHICAGO/WP:FOUR) 14:35, 27 April 2011 (UTC)

*He was ranked as the 11th, 15th and 20th best point guard in the nation by ESPN, Rivals.com and Scout.com, respectively. Out of all basketballer players or just those at High School level?

• • HS.--TonyTheTiger (T/C/BIO/WP:CHICAGO/WP:FOUR) 16:34, 23 April 2011 (UTC)

*What does ESPN grades mean in the table? I don't really follow the rankings either.

• • This is about the 50th article I have used this template in and no one has asked that. I will assume this a point of confusion due to your lack of interest in basketball and that the average person who would be interested in this article would understand it.--TonyTheTiger (T/C/BIO/WP:CHICAGO/WP:FOUR) 16:36, 23 April 2011 (UTC)
    • Maybe they would, but the article should be written for the average wikipedian reader. I notice under notes it says that the ESPN grade is out of a 100 so this makes more sense. It mentions the 11, 15 and 20 rankings in the body, so maybe the 77 and 100 could be as well. AIRcorn (talk) 12:27, 27 April 2011 (UTC)
      • Done.--TonyTheTiger (T/C/BIO/WP:CHICAGO/WP:FOUR) 14:42, 27 April 2011 (UTC)

College

*As a freshman with the 2009–10 team, Morris averaged 4.4 points and 2.6 assist per game on 24.3 minutes of playing time. "on 24.3 minutes of playiong time"? "during"?

• • fixed.--TonyTheTiger (T/C/BIO/WP:CHICAGO/WP:FOUR) 16:40, 23 April 2011 (UTC)

*Three times he scored in double digits including his first career game. Comma before including. Maybe add "has" "the" and "durng"?

• • Yes with the comma, not so much with the others.--TonyTheTiger (T/C/BIO/WP:CHICAGO/WP:FOUR) 16:43, 23 April 2011 (UTC)

*Ann Arbor media felt his omission from the 67-man 2011 Bob Cousy Award watchlist was controversial Don't really like this. Any award is going to be criticised, especially from media close to one of the "unlucky ones".

• • The point is that it is not arguable whether he is one of the top 67. He is like one of the top 10. Even the Wall Street Journal show how he might be number one.--TonyTheTiger (T/C/BIO/WP:CHICAGO/WP:FOUR) 16:48, 23 April 2011 (UTC)
    • Can the Wall street journal be used as a citation and attributed then? AIRcorn (talk) 12:27, 27 April 2011 (UTC)
      • It already is.--TonyTheTiger (T/C/BIO/WP:CHICAGO/WP:FOUR) 20:10, 27 April 2011 (UTC)
        • The wall street journal article referenced further down does not mention the Bob Cousy Award so it cannot really be inferred to him missing out on the watchlist. Can controversial be changed then to something else. None of the references actually says controversial, "surprised" is mentioned though. AIRcorn (talk) 11:51, 28 April 2011 (UTC)
          • Switched controversial to a surprise.--TonyTheTiger (T/C/BIO/WP:CHICAGO/WP:FOUR) 14:09, 28 April 2011 (UTC)
            • Thanks AIRcorn (talk) 11:02, 29 April 2011 (UTC)

*Morris repeated as player of the week on January 31, 2011 sharing the award with Talor Battle, after becoming the third Michigan Wolverines men's basketball player (following Gary Grant and Manny Harris) to record a triple double He can't be the player of the week if it is shared. I know that is how it is sometimes recorded, but for readability could it be changed to "joint player of the week" or "shared player of the week with..."

• • Fixed, I think.--TonyTheTiger (T/C/BIO/WP:CHICAGO/WP:FOUR) 16:50, 23 April 2011 (UTC)

*On February 1, 2011, The Wall Street Journal calculated that Morris was by far the most valuable player to his team among major conference players because his combined assists and field goals made account for over 53% of his team's points. This is a bit awkward "calculated" and "made account" don't seem to fit. Suggest a reword.

• • Field goals made is a common basketball statistic. Made does not go with account. What is wrong with calculated? Would you prefer estimated?--TonyTheTiger (T/C/BIO/WP:CHICAGO/WP:FOUR) 18:26, 23 April 2011 (UTC)
    • Is "made" needed then, I would assume it is measuring the successful ones. Calculated just sounded wrong, like it is part of a mathmatics formula. However I see the source uses calculated so it is fine. AIRcorn (talk) 12:27, 27 April 2011 (UTC)
      • removed made.--TonyTheTiger (T/C/BIO/WP:CHICAGO/WP:FOUR) 20:13, 27 April 2011 (UTC)

*Morris established a new Michigan single-season assists record during the 2011 NCAA Men's Division I Basketball Tournament (235, 35 games). would put (235 in 35 games) to make clearer. Ditto for the others

• • O.K.--TonyTheTiger (T/C/BIO/WP:CHICAGO/WP:FOUR) 18:32, 23 April 2011 (UTC)

*Following the 2010–11 Big Ten Conference men's basketball season, Darius Morris was selected as a third team All-Big Ten selection by both the coaches and the media I think I get it now. He was named in the third "best" team from all players in the Big Ten. Is this position based (i.e. equivalent to being the third best point guard)?What does the All in front of Big ten signify?

• • In sports All-X teams generally are honorary all-star teams. In this case we are talking about the best players in the Big Ten Conference. Yes, he was the third best in the Big Ten, essentially.

*Morris was also a National Association of Basketball Coaches (NABC) Division I District 7 All‐District second team choice. Since the Big Ten Conference was its own district, this is equivalent to being named second team All-Big Ten by the NABC. And I am lost again. Are the NABC coaches different from the coaches in the previous sentence or is it the same coaches selecting for a different area/team/division. I don't quite follow why it is equivalent to a second choice for Big Ten. It probably has something to do with the All in front of District.

• • The prior award was by the Big Ten coaches only. This is a national coaching association. The national coaches were voting on players from the Big Ten region, making it a similar selection to the prior recognition. Let me know if you wan the text altered.--TonyTheTiger (T/C/BIO/WP:CHICAGO/WP:FOUR) 18:42, 23 April 2011 (UTC)
    • I get it now. It would be good if it was made clearer in the article. Specify it was the Big ten coaches (and media) making the All big ten selections. Should be "Big Ten Conference is its own district" unless this has since changed. AIRcorn (talk) 12:27, 27 April 2011 (UTC)
      • O.K.--TonyTheTiger (T/C/BIO/WP:CHICAGO/WP:FOUR) 22:32, 27 April 2011 (UTC)

Lead

Nothing to say about this. It reads fine and actually made some things clearer for me.

Sorry about taking apart nearly all of your sentences. At least you know I read the article thouroughly :). If you feel my lack of Basketball understanding is a problem with my reviewing let me know and I will be happy to let someone else take it over. Cheers AIRcorn (talk) 15:05, 23 April 2011 (UTC)

I have just two points of concern that are not struck out above. They relate to criteria 2 (Verifiability) and criteria 3 (Neutrality). AIRcorn (talk) 11:51, 28 April 2011 (UTC)

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