Talk:DJ AM/GA1

GA Review

Article (edit | visual edit | history) · Article talk (edit | history) · Watch

Reviewer: Ritchie333 (talk · contribs) 08:04, 27 July 2015 (UTC)[reply]

I will review.

Lead

Dablinks is complaining about a circular redirect to Adam Goldstein, but I can't find it in the source text.

Hmm I can't find the offending link either, confused. Freikorp (talk) 12:41, 27 July 2015 (UTC)[reply]

The 2008 South Carolina Learjet 60 crash probably belongs on the second paragraph, as it's not his principal claim to notability. I would also briefly mention him taking legal action against Learjet and Goodyear.

I've moved the info to the second section and shortened it. Freikorp (talk) 12:41, 27 July 2015 (UTC)[reply]

I see a number of citations to People in the article. I seem to remember some debate over whether or not this was a suitable source for biographies

Hmm, I didn't know that. Do you know what the end result of the debate was? I'd be happy to try and find alternate sources if you think that's necessary. Freikorp (talk) 12:41, 27 July 2015 (UTC)[reply]

More later.... Ritchie333 ^(talk) ^(cont) 08:04, 27 July 2015 (UTC)[reply]

Early and personal life

"Goldstein was born in Philadelphia, Pennsylvania to a Jewish family" - neither the claim he was born in Philadelphia nor his Jewish family is in the citation given. Also, his date of birth does not have an inline citation in either the lead, the infobox or the body.

I've moved the citation to something that it did back up, not sure how that happened. I found a new source for both his date of birth and place of birth. Freikorp (talk) 11:20, 28 July 2015 (UTC)[reply]

"As a child, he was verbally abused by his father..." - the claims in this sentence are so strong that I think they will need an additional source.

I've added another citation and reworded it to come across as Goldstein's opinion, rather than a hard fact. Freikorp (talk) 12:06, 28 July 2015 (UTC)[reply]

"Goldstein attended the elite Quaker school" - is "elite" the most appropriate word here?

Removed. Freikorp (talk) 11:13, 28 July 2015 (UTC)[reply]

"After his parents divorced he moved with his mother to Los Angeles where he began experimenting with drugs" - the source given says that there was a strong culture, but does not specifically say he used them at all. I think this bit needs to be rewritten to emphasise that

Good point. Reworded. Freikorp (talk) 11:45, 28 July 2015 (UTC)[reply]

The variety source also mentions that DJ AM did not know who his real father was until he was an adult

Added this information to the article. Freikorp (talk) 11:47, 28 July 2015 (UTC)[reply]

"At one point, he attempted suicide but was unsuccessful when the gun did not go off" - I'm uncomfortable with this claim as the citations are to People and Glamour - can we cite this to a broadsheet or book source instead?

I understand Glamour isn't exactly Time magazine, but the article is an interview with Goldstein, not just an article about him; accordingly it's very unlikely to be inaccurate. I don't see the problem with using this source to back up this claim. Freikorp (talk) 11:53, 28 July 2015 (UTC)[reply]

More later Ritchie333 ^(talk) ^(cont) 09:12, 28 July 2015 (UTC)[reply]

Career

The work between 2001 and 2008 seems to be rather glossed over and reduced to a "list in prose". I think we could say a little bit more about them; for example, the source given shows his collaboration with Madonna was DJing at her party in Beverley Hills.

I'll leave this for now, but thanks for the feedback. Freikorp (talk) 11:56, 28 July 2015 (UTC)[reply]

"Goldstein was released from the hospital" - don't need "the hospital" as its obvious from context in the previous sentence

Removed. Freikorp (talk) 11:13, 28 July 2015 (UTC)[reply]

"He finished filming Gone Too Far, a reality show for MTV in which he and concerned families staged interventions for drug abusers" - the Daily Mail and OK! are completely unacceptable sources (quick wave to John) for a biography and should not be used. I've removed the cited information, although he is dead, his friends and family are not so there's still a borderline possibility of violating WP:BLP here

I didn't know about those sources being unreliable for a biography. Thanks for letting me know. Freikorp (talk) 11:17, 28 July 2015 (UTC)[reply]

"Eight episodes of Gone Too Far had been shot before his death was discovered on August 28" - this sentence may be better reworked into the previous one, explaining it was his final television series. His date of death is given later in the article, so I don't think it's needed here

Thanks for fixing this one for me. Freikorp (talk) 11:17, 28 July 2015 (UTC)[reply]

"Goldstein had reportedly told his addiction-program sponsor that he would return to rehab while shooting the series" - I don't really think this sentence adds much to the article

I've replaced it with something I think is more appropriate. Freikorp (talk) 11:26, 28 July 2015 (UTC)[reply]

"In 2009 he also appeared in the documentary Downtown Calling" - this sentence looks out of place here, coming after the lengthy discussion over Gone Too Far - perhaps it could go earlier?

Done. Freikorp (talk) 11:37, 28 July 2015 (UTC)[reply]

Death

"from an apparent drug overdose" - why the "apparent" here?

Well it was apparent at the time he was found dead, it wasn't confirmed until later. I don't think it would be appropriate to say we has found dead from a drug overdose as the case of death was not determined until later. Do you think I should just remove "from an apparent drug overdose" in its entirety and just leave the cause of death being discovered later? Freikorp (talk) 11:13, 28 July 2015 (UTC)[reply]

I'd probably go with "suspected drug overdose" Ritchie333 ^(talk) ^(cont) 12:01, 28 July 2015 (UTC)[reply]

What was the critical response to his documentary film?

I've added a review of the film to the article. Freikorp (talk) 11:43, 28 July 2015 (UTC)[reply]

Summary

@Freikorp: I'm sorry, but I can't see an obvious way of this getting up to GA status in a short period of time. The key problem is one of scope and verifiability; there are just too many tabloid or tabloidish sources used in the article and too many heavy claims of drug taking and suicide that need stronger sourcing. His career up to 2008 is more or less glossed over, and the article's focus doesn't really seem to be enough on his DJing, which I think it should. Have a look at Eminem to see the typical sort of structure and sourcing a GA should take. Ritchie333 ^(talk) ^(cont) 09:35, 28 July 2015 (UTC)[reply]

@Ritchie333: No worries I understand, thanks for the review. I won't be renominating this one anytime soon but it's good to know what I or someone else needs to focus on before it is ever nominated again. My goal is to improve the article, not just to have a shiny green token in one corner, so if you could give my responses to your points and my recent changes to the article a quick look over and give me any final feedback I would very much appreciate it. Thanks. Freikorp (talk) 12:00, 28 July 2015 (UTC)[reply]

Not a problem. I'll have a look through the changes and see what else there is, but there isn't that much as general suggestions of what to do are quite broad. Regarding the Daily Mail, the paper is a perennial topic on the reliable sources noticeboard; indeed, there's one on there now. I don't recommend using it, which is different from a blanket ban but I certainly wouldn't trust its ability to get biographical facts accurate, particularly when the subject has survived a plane crash and died from a drug overdose. Ritchie333 ^(talk) ^(cont) 12:05, 28 July 2015 (UTC)[reply]