Talk:Crimea (disambiguation)

Requested move to 'Crimea'

The following discussion is closed. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.

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Crimea (disambiguation) → Crimea

The name 'Crimea' does not solely refer to the peninsula. It refers to many different things, such as: the Autonomous Republic (defunct), the Republic of Crimea (country), the Republic of Crimea (Russian federal subject), the Peninsula itself, and other historical names. As we must remain impartial so as to not give undue weight to a name, I believe that what is best is to make 'Crimea' simply a disambiguation page.

 Question: do you support or oppose making the Crimea article a disambiguation page? If so, why?

—Ahnoneemoos (talk) 20:05, 23 March 2014 (UTC)

The discussion above is closed. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.

I moved "Crimea (disambiguation)" to "Crimea" on March 24 per disambiguation guidelines, which state that a page should not be located at "XXX (disambiguation)" when the "XXX" title is vacant and is not a primary topic. "Crimea" was redirecting to "Crimean Peninsula" on March 24 and there existed no consensus that "Crimean Peninsula" is the primary topic for "Crimea". If such a consensus is reached in the future, the move can be reversed.—Ëzhiki (Igels Hérissonovich Ïzhakoff-Amursky) • (yo?); March 24, 2014; 14:29 (UTC)

primary meaning(s)

People who want to have an opinion on what "Crimea" refers to precisely, and what may be the "primary" sense of the term, might do well to first consider the information given at Name of Crimea and History of Crimea.

Historically "Crimea" did not refer to the peninsula, it referred to the entire territory of the Crimean Khanate. The khanate was not named after the peninsula, as one might naively assume, but the peninsula after the khanate (and yes, that was named after its capital, as was perfectly common practice, c.f. "Muscovy", "Byzantium", etc.).

"Crimea" continued to refer to not just the peninsula, but much of what is today the Kherson Oblast as well. Hell, Kherson itself is even named "peninsula" even though it isn't on the peninsula at all.

It was only after 1921 that "Crimea" as a territory finally came to coincide with the peninsula. This lasted for a full 23 years, until 1944. After that, Sevastopol was detached from the "Crimean Oblast". In 1978, it was re-attached. In 1991 it was detached again.

The point is, that there was never any political entity that co-incided with the Crimean peninsula except for a brief period of 1921-1944, and that was partly as a mere 'district' (Bezirk) under Nazi occupation, and (I think?) 1978-1991.

Before 1921, "Crimea" referred to a much larger area than the peninsula, and after 1944, it could refer to the peninsula, but then only as long as it was not equated with a political entity, as the largest city had been detached from that.

The point is that it is highly dubious that unqualified "Crimea" in English can refer to either "Crimean Republic" now in existence. If you want to refer to the (Autonomous|) Crimean Republic, you need to say "(Autonomous|) Crimean Republic". If you just say "Crimea", you are referring to the peninsula, but you aren't being very clear about it.

There, "Crimean peninsula" is the "primary meaning" of "Crimea", but that doesn't mean that "Crimea" is the best way of referring to the Crimean peninsula.

Arguably, Crimea is now once again incorporated as an administrative entity, as the Crimean Federal District in the RF. At least that's the status quo de facto. This will most likely turn into a frozen "conflict" much like Cyprus, Kosovo or Jerusalem and people will just become used to it. or not. The point is that

• "Crimea" in the RF is the Federal district, not just the "Republic",
• in Ukraine, "Crimea" should be considered as corresponding to "the Autonomous Republic of Crimea plus the 'city with special status' Sevastopol", not just the Republic.

So there, I have given a rationale. Could people who disagree with this at least provide a coherent counter-rationale to what I just explained rather than simply reverting stuff. --dab (𒁳) 10:01, 26 March 2014 (UTC)

Content removal

• User:Dbachmann removed content about the ASSR 1991–1992 [1] Tibet2014 (talk) 22:38, 7 April 2014 (UTC)
• User:Dbachmann removed content about the independent Republic in 2014 [2] Tibet2014 (talk) 22:50,
• User:Dbachmann changes RSFSR to Soviet Union [3], but Soviet Union did not exist in 1921. Tibet2014 (talk) 22:52, 7 April 2014 (UTC)

Hi there Tibet2014! I see you have some concerns about the article and edits by a user. Before getting into details, please remember to assume good faith about other users. This is the appropriate place to start a discussion about the edits and to reach a consensus about the issue. From what I can tell, you want to include more articles in the list and change a few words and in the past Dbachmann has removed those articles. So, let's discuss why you think they should be included and let others join in. EvergreenFir (talk) 23:06, 7 April 2014 (UTC)

I have no concerns and see no reason to assume anything about the faith of other users here. I just made a note regarding the content removal, so people can see how editing in Wikipedia by some users is done. They just come in and delete. Full stop. Tibet2014 (talk) 15:22, 12 April 2014 (UTC)