Talk:Communications in Indonesia

Indonesia Top‑importance

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Telecommunications Mid‑importance

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Mid	This article has been rated as Mid-importance on the project's importance scale.

Top priority?

Hmmm: is this really top priority ? Maybe it should be downgraded a bit on the priority scale. --Smilo Don 15:51, 18 September 2007 (UTC)[reply]

I'd agree with that. Perhaps medium. Let's wait like two weeks and we can change the scale. — Indon (reply) — 07:28, 19 September 2007 (UTC)[reply]

On the second thought. The scale of priority should be considered with Wikipedia Indonesia Project, not to the subject itself. It might not be importance for Indonesia, but it is important for this WP:INA project. — Indon (reply) — 07:29, 19 September 2007 (UTC)[reply]

priority is not so much the issue - its a very poorly developed article - needs work on it rather than any particular status. Satu Suro 09:19, 21 September 2007 (UTC)[reply]

Collaboration?

This article has had a few votes for Collaboration of the fortnight but I am reluctant to chose it as the collab until there is a consensus on what this article should contain. On the other hand, it is a good candidate for a collab as it is so underdeveloped. I don't (yet) have any views myself on how this article should look but I can comment on any other editor's suggestions. Can we discuss here before choosing it as the collab? --Merbabu 09:25, 21 September 2007 (UTC)[reply]

OK - Indonesia is a nation state made up of a large number of islands. When Tambora erupted in the early 1800's the information about the effects took weeks if not months to get to batavia. OK so now there is quite a different process and means of information flow within the archipelago - and there obviously is a history to it - probably not exciting or sexy - but nevertheless during the old order, and the new order - certain measures were taken to increase the means and methods of communication between the administrative centres and the various regional centres. I think the process of change and the processes of estriction that occurred in the two orders and sicnce are something that need to exist in this article - not just a snapshot of current services.

If someone is still short on this - folklore has it that during the old order information restriction was practiced as much as in the new order - instances as example can be probably found and cited. It actually requires a sense of who might have written material on this - or as i suspect - little or nothing on the web - but some texts might have useful glimpses of the way that both the old order and new order created circumstances for the development of communications as it might have suited the government first and then the populace (ok hands up anyone who might remember satelite dishes on the top of buildings in the 1980s?) - the politics of access to the palapa satelites - (ie the military component versus joe public component).

In the late new order era the rise of the radio stations - the fm stations - and the internet access - as well as the tv networks all need further info.

Obviously not easy stuff for grab off the web and lets go - there may well be stumbling blocks to some of the info - but from my personal experience of Yogya about 12 years ago - I would say that to not have a well developed article with info about the ways the government either helped or hindered - (regardless of the status or priority) would be as remiss as not having the articles on the ideologies the old order and new order so skilfully played with to sustain their positions on various issues. Satu Suro 10:28, 21 September 2007 (UTC)[reply]

thinking about it further - the very structure of communications in indonesia in the last 50 years - how it was dragged late into some areas (listrik masuk desa anyone? there is another one) - and how it served the powerful and the processes of the powerful in jakarta - there is a lot more to it than simply listing stations and services Satu Suro 10:34, 21 September 2007 (UTC)[reply]

Sounds like you will be major contributor to any future collab. ;-) --Merbabu 10:47, 21 September 2007 (UTC)[reply]

Yes, I will support for this as collab if SS is going to involve there. ;-) Just kidding. Well, I don't know for sure how the outline of this article is. I'm going to dig into this matter soon. Let's see if I can come up with nice structure. BTW, this article relates with Internet in Indonesia that I've just downgraded several days ago. *oops*. :"> — Indon (reply) — 11:34, 21 September 2007 (UTC)[reply]

Look at other "Communications in xxx" articles. I've added a bit about international cables, as I found a bit like that in the Australian article, and would find it interesting. I suggest including both historic and modern comms between the islands as well as international. --Scott Davis ^Talk 12:22, 21 September 2007 (UTC)[reply]

Lets use the US Communications article for guidance. It's not that great either IMO, but it seems that none of these articles by country are very good. Looks like our main problem is it has bits on pieces that should be put elsewhere - namely, the undersea cables and satellites. If we must we can just add a list of undersea cables and satellites, but we need to clean up the main lists first. I'll try to gather up some mockup structure for this. --Steax 21:18, 21 September 2007 (UTC)[reply]

Maybe - that is not what I was pointing to above - thats what I consider needs to be on another page again - great for a static 'picture' of the current state of the structure - but maybe the idea i put up above in fact needs to be on a separate article the development of... or the history of - as opposed to the example from the states - that is not telling anybody how it became that way - it is just a stats and outline of services page Satu Suro 00:35, 22 September 2007 (UTC)[reply]

So do i make this the collab starting tomorrow for two weeks? OR do we go with Sutan Sjahrir? (Kingdom of Sunda actually has more votes, but I don't believe either of the nominees are active and/or will get involved). --Merbabu 02:51, 22 September 2007 (UTC)[reply]

I was also intending to point out that history and development are interesting. When I added the international links, I was actually looking to add the historic connections - the Overland Telegraph linked Southeastern Australia to the rest of the world via Indonesia. That means there was already a connection from Java to Europe, but I didn't find any info about it. There's no point trying to split the article in two or more until there's a good overview that's too big. Then you can identify which bits better fit in subsidiaries. It might be history and development, or mass media, or electronic communications/television and radio, or international, inter-island, and intra-island. --Scott Davis ^Talk 05:20, 22 September 2007 (UTC)[reply]

Based on comments above, I think we have support not only from WP:INA but others. I'd suggest to have the following structure:

History
Infrastructure
Media
1. Telephone
2. Radio
3. Television
4. Internet
Regulations

I may help to find official regulations. — Indon (reply) — 07:20, 22 September 2007 (UTC)[reply]

OK - I will make this collab by Sunday night for two weeks. --Merbabu 07:25, 22 September 2007 (UTC)[reply]

If that helps move the article away from being a list of the variation in technical thingoes - and actually into the effects on Indonesia - then I would support that Satu Suro 07:31, 22 September 2007 (UTC)[reply]

Agreed - i think it would be easy for this article to turn into a mindless directory, which is what wikipedia is not. --Merbabu 07:32, 22 September 2007 (UTC)[reply]

Ok then how about this. We first fill in these basic points first, for each catagory of media:

Brief history - a bit about the first use and date, no details needed
A few providers - just name a notable few
Associated infrastructure - for example, about TV coverage etc
Current Usage - how widespread it's being used, in popular culture, etc

These points go into each Telephone, Radio, TV, and Internet. Lets try to avoid lists altogether - if we need a list, we should just make a new article (List of Telephone Operators in Indonesia, etc). I'll try to do this to one of them, for an example. --Steax 23:55, 22 September 2007 (UTC)[reply]

I have set up the new page structure and filled it in with some of my basic knowledge (from school and books), so I think we should now start to fill it in. --Steax 23:00, 9 November 2007 (UTC)[reply]

Sources

Chapter 2 of Ricklefs' "A History of Modern Indonesia" has some interesting historical information about geography, communication, and kingdom building. This would be good for a history section. --Merbabu 07:32, 22 September 2007 (UTC)[reply]

Telecommunications in Indonesia

I think the title should be changed to Telecommunications in Indonesia to better reflects the content and to align to other articles in Category:Telecommunications by country. --ivanlanin 12:44, 14 October 2009 (UTC)[reply]