Talk:Coexist (image)

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A fact from Coexist (image) appeared on Wikipedia's Main Page in the Did you know column on 2 December 2015 (check views). The text of the entry was as follows:

Did you know... that the Coexist symbol used on bumper stickers started life as a 3 m × 5 m (9.8 ft × 16.4 ft) outdoor poster in a juried art exhibition in Jerusalem?

A record of the entry may be seen at Wikipedia:Recent additions/2015/December. The nomination discussion and review may be seen at Template:Did you know nominations/Coexist (image).

Wikipedia

Image

Commons:File:Coexist-bumpersticker.jpg exists but it is a copyright violation. I've nominated it for deletion with a recommendation of "reduce quality and transwiki to :en . If you add the image please watchlist both the Commons file and the does-not-exist-yet :en file at en:File:Coexist-bumpersticker.jpg.

The original was downloaded from Flickr at https://www.flickr.com/photos/pbyrne/165212878/ . It is (or was) labeled as "free" on Flickr but http://www.thedailybeast.com/articles/2014/12/21/coexist-s-bonehead-bumper-sticker-politics.html stongly suggests it is not free. davidwr/(talk)/(contribs) 15:34, 18 October 2015 (UTC)[reply]

Broaden scope and rename to CoeXisT (symbol)

In light of these ([1], [2], [3], and more) which talk about the symbol's use by the original creator and by Bono's (U2) use of it, I think we should expand the scope of this article to include all uses of the symbol

If we do that in the next few days, there's a good chance it can be WP:DYN material.

If there are no objections within the next day or so, I invite any editor to move the page to CoeXisT (symbol) (CoeXist and Coexist should not coexist unless one of them is a redirect, it's just too confusing), create a redirect at Coexist (symbol), and start expanding the article. If nobody objects and nobody moves it, I will move it myself. davidwr/(talk)/(contribs) 02:20, 19 October 2015 (UTC)[reply]

I would actually object to the "CoeXisT" styling for the title. Most of the variants use symbols for each of the letters, not just "C", "X", and "T", and often it is rendered as "COEXIST" with all letters in capitals. Coexist (symbol) might be okay, although the more prominent uses seem to be as bumper stickers. At least that's what I'm finding so far in the sources (which are much more plentiful than I would've thought). Dohn joe (talk) 03:05, 19 October 2015 (UTC)[reply]

Fair enough, but the original creator referred to his design as CoeXisT, so it is going to be a plausible search term. Even if Wikipedia's search engine is case-sensitive, external search engines may not be, so a redirect will need to be created at CoeXisT to point to SOMETHING - either this page, Coexist, or Coexist (disambiguation).

In any case, do you object to changing the scope to include obviously-related variants and usages (posters, banners, Bono's headband, etc.) of this symbol and changing the page title accordingly? davidwr/(talk)/(contribs) 03:23, 19 October 2015 (UTC)[reply]

I think those redirects are fine. And so is expanding the scope to include all related images. As for the title, maybe Coexist (image), as it is more an image made up of symbols than a symbol itself (although it has acquired some symbolic attributes itself). Dohn joe (talk) 20:38, 19 October 2015 (UTC)[reply]

Thanks. I prefer "symbol" but I can live with image. If nobody objects within about 24 hours of my initial message in this section, go ahead and make it happen. If you don't, I'll do it the next time I get online after that time. davidwr/(talk)/(contribs) 20:59, 19 October 2015 (UTC)[reply]

Let's get this ready for WP:DYN and the Main Page

There's more than enough material, it just needs to be filled in, tightened up, and run through a review. We've got a few more days before we have to submit it but I'd like to submit it by Wednesday evening (USA time) if possible. Please look at Wikipedia:Did you know and make whatever changes are needed to increase the quality of the article and increase the chances this will be on the main page.

By the way, as much as I'd like to see the concert picture on the main page, there's lingering doubt that the concert image - or any image where this design is a prominent part of the image - would be "free" when used in this article, and I don't want to push my luck at DYN review. davidwr/(talk)/(contribs) 04:42, 20 October 2015 (UTC)[reply]

@In ictu oculi and Dohn joe: I've nominated this article for Did You Know?. Please consider improving the article and/or suggesting better "hooks". davidwr/(talk)/(contribs) 05:37, 23 October 2015 (UTC)[reply]

B-class assessment

To get to B-class the "legal disputes" section must be brought up to date, and the other sections should be polished a bit. davidwr/(talk)/(contribs) 05:35, 23 October 2015 (UTC)[reply]

Copyright

Since the original image's authors and the contest sponsors claim (or claimed, as of 2005) that the original art was under copyright and there is good reason to think that copyright is valid in its native country (Poland),^[1] any image which includes the Crescent (or Crescent and star) for the C, the Start of David for the X, and a Cross for the T should probably be considered "a derivative of a work which is non-PD in its country of origin, and which as of 2005 was claimed to be under copyright in the United States, and therefore under a copyright cloud". It would help a lot if someone could find a definitive legal answer to the question of its US copyright status. As for derivative images, if they were created in the United States and are clearly NOT pd-ineligible they will have their own copyrights attached to them, even if they underlying work is deemed pd-ineligible in the United States. The bottom four images at Jen (2008-05-27) ("External links") are examples of images that almost certainly contain a US copyright above and beyond that of the original design. davidwr/(talk)/(contribs) 14:08, 23 October 2015 (UTC)[reply]

References

^ Butler, Susan (2005-08-06). "Legal Matters: One Design, Many Claims: Can they Coexist?". Billboard. 117 (32). Nielsen Business Media: 10. ISSN 0006-2510. Archived from the original on 2015-10-23.

Merger proposal

CC: @Davidwr, Tbhotch, Dohn joe, Claire Parker, Malaiya, and Akamarck:

Coexist Foundation and Coexist (image) are both pages that on their own could easily be categorized as a stub. I propose merging Coexist (image) with Coexist Foundation into the existing disambiguation page Coexist, with the for hatnote. The opening paragraphs could talk briefly about the movement, image and organization, with subsequent sections with more details. GeekInParadise (talk) 20:14, 17 March 2019 (UTC)[reply]

Oppose. It's absurd to merge an article about a global organization into an article about a single image. If anything the reverse should occur. Barring that, leave each article separate as they are now. Softlavender (talk) 23:33, 21 May 2019 (UTC)[reply]

[1] Butler, Susan (2005-08-06). "Legal Matters: One Design, Many Claims: Can they Coexist?". Billboard. 117 (32). Nielsen Business Media: 10. ISSN 0006-2510. Archived from the original on 2015-10-23.

[1]