Talk:Cocaine Blues

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dates

This has the "original" recording in 1947 and Woody Guthrie's in 1944. Something must not be right. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 216.85.170.148 (talk) 21:56, 8 July 2015 (UTC)[reply]

Dylan

What about the Dylan song of the same name? Do we disambigue (I wish that was a word) to the Dylan article? I know there's no actual entry on the song, but I came here looking for the Dylan, not the Cash. - Darkhawk

Agreed-- Dylan's version is a completely different song, as is the one referred to here for Townes van Zandt. In the beginning of TVZ's performance of the song from his 1977 album "Live at the Old Quarter," he explains that the song (the other version) is from a post-WWII era when it was commonplace to treat returning war veterans with cocaine, especially in New Orleans. It was also famously covered by Jackson Browne. The Johnny Cash-covered song referred to here is a completely different song. --Greensheep 21:41, 7 March 2007 (UTC)[reply]

Dylan's Version, TVZ's Version and also Keith Richards Version are all based on Gary Davis Version. However Richard's Version is wrongly credited as Johnny Cash cover... —Preceding unsigned comment added by 91.64.150.194 (talk) 11:53, 16 September 2009 (UTC)[reply]

I also came here looking for the Dylan version. This article definitely needs a rewrite, and soon, since most people probably do not visit the "Talk" page. Nice1al (talk) 18:10, 4 February 2014 (UTC)[reply]

Burroughs

I'm going to remove the part about the Wille line being a reference to Burroughd. It (along with several others) is actually a line from a old folk song called Little Sadie.

Luke Jordan (not Dylan)

That is not a Dylan song, but a song Dylan covered. Luke Jordan first wrote it back in the 20s and the Rev. Gary Davis re-worked it (I think Dylan based his version on Davis's). So many others have played it as well.

I do think that this entry *must* refer to the other song of the same name.

Rev Gary Davis

This claim in the current page is incorrect:

"This song originates from Rev. Gary Davis, who Dave Van Ronk and others learnt the song from. Interestingly, the only recorded version from Rev. Gary Davis, recorded in later years is an instrumental."

In fact, the instrumental, as heard on Pure Religion & Bad Company was recorded in 1956. However, two other versions were recorded later, one in 1962 the other in 1964. Both of those were sung and not straight instrumentals. All three versions are available on Stefan Grossman's Country Blues Guitar instructional DVD. One of the versions (1962 I believe) is also available on the Demons and Angels three CD disc set. —The preceding unsigned comment was added by Jmaynardg (talk • contribs) 19:24, 17 April 2007 (UTC).[reply]

Several songs; one article

I suggest this article be organized as one article about several similarly named songs. ("Cocaine Blues is the name of several different songs, including examples attributed to TJ Arnall, Luke Jordan, and Rev. Gary Davis, each recorded by various performers.") Then go on to discuss each song. As it is now, this article starts out like it's just about one of these songs, but then finds it necessary to mention the others, as though thier existence was counter-evidence to the thesis.

A related issue is that this article is bound into the Johnny Cash mini-web, as though Cash's recording is the definitive subject matter of the article's title. (I.E., anyone coming here to read about "Cocaine Blues" is thinking of the Cash record; the others are side notes.) I personally believe the Gary Davis song is at least as well known. And user Darkhawk admits to coming here looking for something else.

Another solution might be multiple (3? 4?) articles with a disambiguation page. I think this is undesirable, as the separate articles would each be quite small. Thoughts? Hult041956 18:29, 5 September 2007 (UTC)[reply]

Cocaine Habit Blues

This is the third song mentioned here, also called Take a Whiff on Me. I have started a page. The earliest recoding I can find are Lead Belly. It has the line "Cocaine's for horses, not for men, the doc says it'll killme, but he don't say when" Pustelnik 19:08, 3 December 2007 (UTC)[reply]

The Billy Hughes version

This article is supposed to be about the Johnny Cash song from his Folsom Prison concert, but since the song is credited to T.J. “Red” Arnall from Slumber Nichols’ Western Aces, it should probably mention the Billy Hughes version, also said to be written by Arnall.

The Hughes version is much more graphic:

“I heard a man calling my baby’s name.

I opened up the door and I blew out his brain.”

It is also more sympathetic to the main character:

"I come home from work in that old Tulsa town,

I caught my baby traveling and I shot her down."

and with the plainclothesman telling him:

“You shot your woman and a rounder too.

They may have had it coming, but it’s bad for you.”

and the Cocain Kid replying:

"But under those conditions I would do it again."

It may be that the Hogsed version (the one recorded by Cash and others) was directed toward the general public and the Hughes version directed toward the Okies in the Central Valley, since only they would have known where and what “Mac” was and would have needed a reason for the sentence being only “ninety-nine years” instead of the electric chair. TestsPoint (talk) —Preceding comment was added at 14:47, 4 March 2008 (UTC)[reply]

Image copyright problem with Image:Cocaine Blues.ogg

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This is an automated notice by FairuseBot. For assistance on the image use policy, see Wikipedia:Media copyright questions. --01:27, 20 May 2008 (UTC)[reply]

Substituted...

"Substituted Folsom for San Quentin" means it originally said San Quentin and Cash replaced it with Folsom. If you said "substituted San Quentin by Folsom, that would also be right. Baseball Bugs ^{What's up, Doc?} 14:08, 4 August 2008 (UTC)[reply]

Sorry, you are right! I guess I have problems with the meaning of "substituting for", because I thought it meant the opposite! Can we go with "substituted by", as I think that has a clearer meaning? BobFromBrockley (talk) 14:14, 4 August 2008 (UTC)[reply]

I think that's less common usage. Baseball Bugs ^{What's up, Doc?} 14:25, 4 August 2008 (UTC)[reply]

Take a whiff on me/Gary Davis version

Resurrecting the debates earlier on this page, which I am new to. The traditional song associated with Gary Davis, not mentioned in the article, is surely more well known than the Little Sadie variant. The Gary Davis version and "Take a Whiff on Me"/"Cocaine Habit Blues" are close relations. I'm wanting to edit Gary Davis into this article, but am afraid of messing up work that other people have done! BobFromBrockley (talk) 14:18, 4 August 2008 (UTC) Some of the people listed under others who have recorded this song (e.g. Nick Drake, Van Zandt) actually did the Gary Davis song, not the Little Sadie song. BobFromBrockley (talk) 14:20, 4 August 2008 (UTC)[reply]

OK, I've added a lot and re-ordered the other songs section, which is now as long as the rest of the article, making me wonder if this is the right way to go. BobFromBrockley (talk) 13:40, 6 August 2008 (UTC)[reply]

Another version of Cocaine Blues.

I would just like to add that Australian country singer Slim Dusty sang a version of this song called 'Whiskey Blues' which appeared on the 1986 album "Slim Dusty's Beer Drinking Songs of Australia". The lyrics have been changed to tame down the song and the name of Australian places have been used to replace the American names such as Parramatta Pen to replace Folsom Prison and Bendigo replaced Mexico. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 58.109.54.84 (talk) 11:28, 18 December 2008 (UTC)[reply]

Rework?

The article states "[...] a reworking of the traditional song "Little Sadie". Sure it's a reworking? The song was already known in the 1920s, when Riley Puckett recorded it as "Chain Gang Blues" in 1927 with nearly the same lyrics as the Arnall version. I'd rather say Arnall simply took the song and renamed it - John Dilleshaw also recorded it in the late 1920s and so did other artists before the recordings in the 1947-1948 period. 80.228.199.238 (talk) 19:04, 12 July 2011 (UTC)[reply]

Moved

I have moved this article from Cocaine Blues where I have created a simple disambiguation page. Would future editors please help to separate these articles and improve the disambiguation page.Mnealon (talk) 20:15, 31 August 2011 (UTC)[reply]

I strenuously object to these page moves, you have made a mess of things, and made no attempt to discuss the matter or gain consensus. You should revert your move, and wait until a consensus has been reached before attempting this again. ---RepublicanJacobite_TheFortyFive 17:52, 1 September 2011 (UTC)[reply]

New lede

This article needs a new lede explaining that the subject of the article is a folk song of unknown origin, which through various permutations, has been sung and recorded under various titles, with varying lyrics, by a wide variety of musicians, and for a very long time. By beginning the article with the "Red" Arnall version, I think we are only encouraging confusion. The Arnall version should be one of the sections, while the lede makes clear that several, slightly different, songs are being discussed. ---RepublicanJacobite_TheFortyFive 18:27, 12 September 2011 (UTC)[reply]

Yes.

The current opening sentence ""Cocaine Blues" is a Western Swing song written by T. J. "Red" Arnall ..." is just wrong. At least in my circles (Canadian who was young in the 60s) the Gary Davis version and its descendants are "Cocaine Blues" and Arnall's version is at best a footnote. Pashley (talk) 21:11, 14 April 2016 (UTC)[reply]

Gary Davis

The Gary Davis version of the song is if anything better known and certainly based on a song he learned much earlier than the writing credit given in the article. — Preceding unsigned comment added by Pluffonthegreen (talk • contribs) 20:55, 14 December 2011 (UTC)[reply]

Dave Van Ronk

Important song for folk icon DVR. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 217.42.138.20 (talk) 14:56, 4 October 2013 (UTC)[reply]

Date of Dillinger song

Please put the date of the Dillinger song release, "Cocaine, running around my brain". I can't find the date anywhere, and I've got .......... . https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=b8u90LwP-Ss

.

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Four songs in one article: Split article? WP:CONCEPTDAB?

The text of this article currently covers at least 4 songs.

The intro only mentions the T. J. "Red" Arnall reworking of "Little Sadie", but the Other songs titled "Cocaine Blues" section also covers:

"Cocaine Habit Blues"/"Take a Whiff on Me"/"Cocaine Blues" — several variants, (some credited to Reverend Gary Davis and sometimes also confusingly called "Cocaine" (cf. JJ Cale's unrelated Cocaine (song).)
"Tell It to Me"/"Cocaine Blues"/"Let The Cocaine Be", a jug band song possibly derived from "Take a Whiff on Me" (above)
"Cocaine"/"Simply Wild About My Good Cocaine"/"Cocaine Blues", recorded by Luke Jordan and related to "Furniture Man"

Having four songs covered in one article without notice of this fact in the introduction serves readers poorly. One possibility is to split the material on the four songs, but this is problematic due to title overlap and questionable authorship as well possible connexions between the different songs. (NB "Take a Whiff on Me" already has a separate article.) Another possibility is a WP:CONCEPTDAB dealing with the various pre-rock era Cocaine songs, but I'm not sure what precedent there is for this with song articles at Wikipedia. Any thoughts? — AjaxSmack 21:33, 12 December 2018 (UTC)[reply]

I think it really just depends on the case for independent notability for each of the 4 songs. Do they meet the WP:GNG on their own? Then yes. If they don’t, definitely not. Sergecross73 msg me 23:38, 12 December 2018 (UTC)[reply]

This article is almost a WP:BROADCONCEPT article as it is. How about rearranging it to do that job and split off any articles that can stand on their own, while keeping others as a sub-section of this article?. - X201 (talk) 09:35, 14 December 2018 (UTC)[reply]

Perhaps the most important thing about these songs is their relationship with each other. Separating into different articles diminishes that importance. --Richhoncho (talk) 18:56, 14 December 2018 (UTC)[reply]

Contradiction in lede & infobox

The lede says this song was written by Red Arnall.

The infobox says it was written by Woody.

Which is correct? — Lawrence King ^(talk) 04:24, 1 February 2021 (UTC)[reply]

San Quentin Pen/Folsom Pen

Arnall wrote and recorded it as San Quentin. So did Roy Hogshed. Cash changed it to Folsom Pen (or wherever he was at the time). Since the article flows from early to later recordings, it makes sense in the original text to use San Quentin Pen. SchmuckyTheCat (talk) 05:57, 15 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]