Talk:Chopin's compositions for piano and orchestra

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MOS for title

The title of this article does not conform to WP:MOS. Normally it should be "Compositions for piano and orchestra (Chopin)", "List of compositions for piano and orchestra by Chopin", etc. For the four ballades, these were separated into four different articles, which now contains Ballades (Chopin). John Rink's book, published by Cambridge University Press, is available online. Mathsci (talk) 12:26, 31 December 2020 (UTC)[reply]

This follows my suggestion above. Probably the title "Compositions for piano and orchestra (Chopin)" would have been better: it is a redirect at the moment, so I will ask User:Graham87 if he could please switch that around.

It is not clear why two pieces for solo piano are listed.

I used the previous model Ballades (Chopin) for creating Scherzos (Chopin); in that case there was not Cambridge University Press books either on the ballades (Jim Samson) or the concertos (John Rink). However, the online edition of Henle-Verlag's preface was available. But there are may other courses, for these outstanding musical works. Mathsci (talk) 18:24, 31 December 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Except for redirects, titles like Chopin's Berceuse, Chopin's Barcarolle, Chopin's Funeral March are not permitted on wikipedia: we use Berceuse (Chopin), Barcarolle (Chopin) and Piano Sonata No. 2 (Chopin). Mathsci (talk) 19:10, 31 December 2020 (UTC)[reply]

You can move it yourself because the history of the redirect only contains one entry. Graham87 04:07, 1 January 2021 (UTC)[reply]

@Graham87: I disagree, imho this page should not be moved without a successful WP:RM. Tx. --Francis Schonken (talk) 05:16, 1 January 2021 (UTC)[reply]

Per comments of User:Graham87. I couldn't see why there should be a RM, since there is nothing contentious. All sorts of strange articles turn up for redirects (Elvira Madigan concerto, Handel's Messiah, etc), but they usually end up at the standard article. Happy New Year. Mathsci (talk) 07:31, 1 January 2021 (UTC)[reply]

I only said you could move it, not that you should ... I don't want to get involved in this any further. Graham87 08:06, 1 January 2021 (UTC)[reply]

(ec) Graham, the title will now be discussed at the talk page of WikiProject Classical Music. Mathsci (talk) 08:27, 1 January 2021 (UTC)[reply]

Applicable guidance is at WP:NCM#Compositions (classical music) and WP:AT. Anyhow, descriptive titles (as opposed to a genre of composition with a clear name), such as "last sonatas" or "compositions for violin and piano", often combine better with natural disambiguation, hence, for instance:

Schubert's last sonatas (this one a WP:GA BTW)
Schubert's compositions for violin and piano
Chopin's compositions for piano and orchestra
Mozart's Berlin journey
Bach's church music in Latin
Bach's Missa of 1733 (the WP:RM deciding on that title is at Talk:Bach's Missa of 1733#Requested move 11 March 2020)

Again, if this has to move anywhere, a WP:RM should be initiated first. --Francis Schonken (talk) 08:21, 1 January 2021 (UTC) (updated 08:31, 1 January 2021 (UTC))[reply]