Talk:Captain Jack (Billy Joel song)

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Captain Jack (Billy Joel song) has been listed as one of the Music good articles under the good article criteria. If you can improve it further, please do so. If it no longer meets these criteria, you can reassess it.

Article milestones
Date	Process	Result
December 24, 2008	Good article nominee	Not listed
April 10, 2009	Good article nominee	Listed

Current status: Good article

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Drugs?

This song is definitely not about drugs. It is about masturbation and he says so directly in the lyrics. --David

I always assumed Captain Jack meant heroin when I listened to the song.. "just a little push and you'll be smiling" is almost definatly a needle reference. --insertwackynamehere 18:14, 18 February 2007 (UTC)[reply]

It's not about heroin at all. At least I've never once made the connection. I keep running across this analogy on various different sites. From the begining, I've associated it with drinking/alcohol. For what it's worth, he mentions pot and masturbation in the lyrics. Hell, he even mentions closet queens. Could we go so far as to say that's what it's about? No. Alcohol. Thats what it's about. He's been a struggling alcoholic for years. I'd give credence to the anti-drug notion if I could see a source... it does seem plausible. But, 'H'? Nah. It just doesn't jive with me. DasGooch 07:25, 17 April 2007 (UTC)[reply]

Meaning

http://www.vh1.com/artists/news/621078/02082000/joel_billy.jhtml

That article states that it's about drugs, and says that he considers it an anti-drug song. Since NOTHING in this article is sourced, I'll rewrite it. DurinsBane87 01:44, 30 May 2007 (UTC)[reply]

GA Nominee

I have nominated this article for Good Article candidacy. Let's hope for the best! CarpetCrawler (talk) 17:41, 22 November 2008 (UTC)[reply]

The following discussion is closed. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.

GA Review

This review is transcluded from Talk:Captain Jack (song)/GA1. The edit link for this section can be used to add comments to the review.

This GA nomination is being failed for the following reasons:

Ideas are thrown together in places; the article doesn't flow well.
Almost nothing is mentioned of the song's recording. That's one of the major aspects deserving of coverage in a good article on a recorded song.
There are a few unsourced statements:
- "mostly ignored LP"
- "'Captain Jack' was immediately embraced by WMMR's audience."
- "By 1980, 'Captain Jack' had mostly disappeared from Joel's concert setlists."
The Clinton campaign song section is borderline trivia and probably only deserves a brief mention while discussing the controversial nature of the lyrics.
While there isn't a content dispute among the editors of this article, there should be. An editor claiming to be Larry Russell has changed a number of referenced statements based on supposed first-hand knowledge. He may well be Larry Russell and his additions may be accurate, but they constitute original research.
This is minor, but there are quite a few formatting issues with album and song titles.

These problems will surely take more than a week to address, so the nomination has to be failed for now. —Zeagler (talk) 03:36, 24 December 2008 (UTC)[reply]

The discussion above is closed. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.

GA Nominee

Tim meh ! 19:10, 10 April 2009 (UTC)[reply]

The following discussion is closed. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.

GA Review

This review is transcluded from Talk:Captain Jack (song)/GA2. The edit link for this section can be used to add comments to the review.

Hello, contributors. I will be reviewing this article for GA status, and I'll have the checklist up with my decision no later than tomorrow if the review doesn't need to be put on hold. Tim meh ! 19:10, 10 April 2009 (UTC)[reply]

OK, I look forward to all comments, and look forward to addressing any concerns that you may have. Thank you very much for reviewing the article! :) CarpetCrawler^{message me} 19:24, 10 April 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Checklist and analysis

GA review (see here for criteria)

It is reasonably well written.
a (prose): b (MoS):
There were some minor grammatical errors, but I did fix them.

Thank you. :) CarpetCrawler^{message me} 02:02, 11 April 2009 (UTC)[reply]

It is factually accurate and verifiable.
a (references): b (citations to reliable sources): c (OR):
The references are good.
It is broad in its coverage.
a (major aspects): b (focused):
It follows the neutral point of view policy.
Fair representation without bias:
There doesn't seem to be any definitive negative review mentioned in the release and reaction section. I'm putting the review on hold until a negative viewpoint toward the song is added here to make it more neutral.

I tried to go and find one, and I think I may have found a good enough one. Does it fit? Honestly, that was actually quite hard to find, since it's an album from 1973, so most reviews of the album that are reliable sources are going to be hard to find... especially from that timeframe. CarpetCrawler^{message me} 02:02, 11 April 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Yes, it looks like it fits reasonably well. That was my main concern about the article. Thanks for finding that review. Tim meh ! 03:07, 11 April 2009 (UTC)[reply]

It is stable.
No edit wars etc.:
It is illustrated by images, where possible and appropriate.
a (images are tagged and non-free images have fair use rationales): b (appropriate use with suitable captions):
I know images for a song such as this would be hard to find, but maybe it would be possible for you to find and add one or two pictures of live performances of the song, just so there's some kind of image here.

Would Joel's picture from his main article work? CarpetCrawler^{message me} 02:02, 11 April 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Probably not. However, I don't think there are very many images that would be appropriate for a song article. The lack of images is not such a big problem, and it can do without any for now. Tim meh ! 03:07, 11 April 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Overall:
Pass/Fail:
After seeing improvements to the article that address my concerns, I am passing this article for GA status. Congratulations, CarpetCrawler and anyone else who contributed to the article. Good luck on this article in the future and on any future endeavors. Tim meh ! 03:07, 11 April 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Wonderful, thanks for the review! :) CarpetCrawler^{message me} 05:55, 11 April 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Other comments

The discussion above is closed. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.

I made two corrections in the article

1. My name was misspelled: It's Dennis Wilen, not Dennis Wyland 2. My title at the time was Music Director, not Program Director.

I don't know whether it needs a citation. I'm new at this.

Thanks,

Dennis Wilen aka VOIDMSTR dwilen@yahoo.com —Preceding unsigned comment added by Voidmstr (talk • contribs) 05:41, 7 December 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Requested move 05:50, 22 July 2013 (UTC)

The following discussion is an archived discussion of a requested move. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made in a new section on the talk page. Editors desiring to contest the closing decision should consider a move review. No further edits should be made to this section.

The result of the move request was: move. -- tariqabjotu 00:02, 30 July 2013 (UTC)[reply]

Captain Jack (song) → Captain Jack (Billy Joel song) – WP:PDAB, disambiguation should not be ambiguous, we have multiple articles on songs called "Captain Jack"; so "Captain Jack (song)" should redirect to the disambiguation page Captain Jack -- 76.65.128.222 (talk) 05:50, 22 July 2013 (UTC)[reply]

Survey

Feel free to state your position on the renaming proposal by beginning a new line in this section with *'''Support''' or *'''Oppose''', then sign your comment with ~~~~. Since polling is not a substitute for discussion, please explain your reasons, taking into account Wikipedia's policy on article titles.

Support (non controversial, could be done as technical request) In ictu oculi (talk) 08:28, 22 July 2013 (UTC)[reply]
Support While I continue to oppose WP:PDAB, I don't think this is worth any sort of primary consideration. I thought first of Jack Sparrow (song), which might belong somewhere on the dab. --BDD (talk) 22:39, 22 July 2013 (UTC)[reply]
Support – Most songs shouldn't be considered as a primary topic in its class. --Article editor (talk) 23:46, 26 July 2013 (UTC)[reply]

Discussion

Any additional comments:

The above discussion is preserved as an archive of a requested move. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made in a new section on this talk page or in a move review. No further edits should be made to this section.

Not about masturbation?

In one of the live performances, at the end after the applause he says "Thank you, you sick bastards". Would he be so tongue in cheek about heroin? Seems pretty obvious the song is about jerking off.

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