Talk:Billy Boys

Billy Boys has been listed as one of the Music good articles under the good article criteria. If you can improve it further, please do so. If it no longer meets these criteria, you can reassess it.
Review: June 21, 2014. (Reviewed version).

Songs

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A fact from Billy Boys appeared on Wikipedia's Main Page in the Did you know column on 15 May 2014 (check views). The text of the entry was as follows:

Did you know... that the "Billy Boys" was ruled as a tolerated historic song by UEFA despite it being banned in Scottish football grounds due to sectarianism?

A record of the entry may be seen at Wikipedia:Recent additions/2014/May. The nomination discussion and review may be seen at Template:Did you know nominations/Billy Boys.

Wikipedia

Untitled

The lyric is wrong, Where you say Derry boys, it should say Billy Boys 72.136.138.164 04:06, 19 June 2006 (UTC)[reply]

Vote for Deletion

This article survived a Vote for Deletion. The discussion can be found here. -Splash 00:53, 23 July 2005 (UTC)[reply]

Lyrics

The last line of the lyrics seems inconsistent with the commentary below in the lyrics section. I imagine someone has changed it without bothering to read through the article. Can anyone fix, and preferably find citations?--Breadandcheese (talk) 13:25, 16 March 2008 (UTC)[reply]

"The Billy Boys is a loyalist song from Belfast, sung to the tune of "Marching Through Georgia."[1] It originated in the 1930s as the signature song of a Glasgow "

How can it be from Belfast if it originated in Glasgow? —Preceding unsigned comment added by 86.1.194.133 (talk) 02:31, 26 July 2008 (UTC)[reply]

GA Review

This review is transcluded from Talk:Billy Boys/GA1. The edit link for this section can be used to add comments to the review.

Reviewer: Adam Cuerden (talk · contribs) 13:50, 21 June 2014 (UTC)[reply]

First of all, is it possible to include some sort of recording of the tune? Even a MIDI would be better than nothing, and would greatly add to the value of the article.
Secondly, this lacks any illustration. The postcard from Marching through Georgia might do for a start, and a picture of the Rangers' stadium, perhaps?
Thirdly, I don't suppose it's possible to source a comparison between Marching through Georgia and Billy Boys? It's obvious that there's a slight connection in lyrics (Bring on the bugle, boys / We are the Billy Boys), but it may well not be sourcable, and that's fine.

Very heavily leaning towards "Promote". Adam Cuerden ^(talk) 13:50, 21 June 2014 (UTC)[reply]

I've added an external link to a video of Rangers fans singing Billy Boys and added a pic of Ibrox. Unfortunately I can't seem to find a source that compares the two sets of lyrics, most sources that mention both only say that Billy Boys is sung to the tune of MTG. The C of E God Save the Queen! (talk) 14:28, 21 June 2014 (UTC)[reply]

You like tiny, tiny thumbnails, don't you! I've doubled the image sizes. Anyway, Promote. Adam Cuerden ^(talk) 15:00, 21 June 2014 (UTC)[reply]

UK team?

CofE, what are you on about? Gob Lofa (talk) 22:34, 27 November 2015 (UTC)[reply]

The UK does not compete in football together, it competes as separate nations. There is no all British team in competitive football. The C of E God Save the Queen! (talk) 22:37, 27 November 2015 (UTC)[reply]

What has that got to do with giving the impression that GSTQ is Northern Ireland's anthem alone? Gob Lofa (talk) 12:12, 28 November 2015 (UTC)[reply]

Because in that context, it is used as Northern Ireland's anthem in football alone. Given the article about this chant states it is used predominantly in footballing context, it is appropriate that it is referred to as such. The C of E God Save the Queen! (talk) 21:09, 28 November 2015 (UTC)[reply]

Football teams don't have national anthems, nations do. Calling it the Northern Irish national anthem is as accurate as calling it the County Fermanagh national anthem. Gob Lofa (talk) 21:23, 28 November 2015 (UTC)[reply]

Co. Fermanagh is not a nation that is represented internationally. NI on the other hand is. The C of E God Save the Queen! (talk) 21:44, 28 November 2015 (UTC)[reply]

So? Gob Lofa (talk) 21:46, 28 November 2015 (UTC)[reply]

I don't understand where you're coming from, C. The UK has a national anthem; NI doesn't. The NI team use the British national anthem; that's their right, but it doesn't give NI a national anthem. Gob Lofa (talk) 01:07, 1 December 2015 (UTC)[reply]

The point is that since there is no UK football team, it would be out of the context to say it is the British anthem. For it to give correct context it should say it is NI's anthem as makes it clear they compete separately. The C of E God Save the Queen! (talk) 09:39, 1 December 2015 (UTC)[reply]

I don't agree with your reasoning but I think I understand you more clearly now. Your wording still gives the impression that NI (the region, not the team) has a national anthem and it's GSTQ. Gob Lofa (talk) 14:21, 1 December 2015 (UTC)[reply]

C? Gob Lofa (talk) 23:45, 3 December 2015 (UTC)[reply]

I have made a compromise, that is all that change was. The C of E God Save the Queen! (talk) 23:54, 3 December 2015 (UTC)[reply]

My point about the impression you're giving stands; is that your intention? Gob Lofa (talk) 23:56, 3 December 2015 (UTC)[reply]

C? Gob Lofa (talk) 23:02, 10 December 2015 (UTC)[reply]

I have made a compromise. That is all that is needed because your concern was over the issue of national, it no longer says that. The C of E God Save the Queen! (talk) 23:05, 10 December 2015 (UTC)[reply]

But it still gives the impression: is that your intention? I also made a compromise because I don't like the use of the term 'anthem', for the same reason. I reckon 'song' would be better. Gob Lofa (talk) 23:29, 10 December 2015 (UTC)[reply]

If we did that, then we'd need to say that Flower of Scotland is just a song when referring to football context. You did not make your position regarding anthem obvious in the initial discussion that that changing the descriptor is what you wanted. I am happy with the wording as it is because it does not refer to it as a national anthem which you objected to yet makes it clear it is the anthem used by NI in football. The C of E God Save the Queen! (talk) 23:52, 10 December 2015 (UTC)[reply]

Far from clear; you're giving the impression that the song is the anthem of Northern Ireland instead of its football team. What's your objection to 'team'? Gob Lofa (talk) 00:13, 11 December 2015 (UTC)[reply]

My objection is that that insinuates it isn't the national representative side of the country. The C of E God Save the Queen! (talk) 10:32, 11 December 2015 (UTC)[reply]

You think using the word 'team' does that? Gob Lofa (talk) 14:43, 11 December 2015 (UTC)[reply]

Team anthem or Team song would have the connotations of being similar to Follow Follow being the team anthem of Rangers. Anthem on its own makes it clearly understood it is the music played to represent NI in football. The C of E God Save the Queen! (talk) 22:56, 11 December 2015 (UTC)[reply]

I'm not following your logic. The NI team represents NI in football. Gob Lofa (talk) 21:46, 17 December 2015 (UTC)[reply]

That is correct. However it is a national team and thus it uses the national anthem of that country. The C of E God Save the Queen! (talk) 22:24, 17 December 2015 (UTC)[reply]

NI doesn't have a national anthem. The UK does, but not NI. The NI team uses the UK national anthem. Gob Lofa (talk) 22:28, 17 December 2015 (UTC)[reply]

Thus by default the anthem of NI is God Save The Queen. The C of E God Save the Queen! (talk) 22:44, 17 December 2015 (UTC)[reply]

Only because NI is part of the UK. Gob Lofa (talk) 22:49, 17 December 2015 (UTC)[reply]

Still means it is the national anthem. The C of E God Save the Queen! (talk) 22:53, 17 December 2015 (UTC)[reply]

Of the UK. Not Fermanagh or any other part of the UK, but the UK in its entirety. Gob Lofa (talk) 22:58, 17 December 2015 (UTC)[reply]

All the constituent nations of the UK can use GSTQ as their anthem if they so choose. Scotland generally uses Flower of Scotland nowadays and Wales uses Land of my Fathers. England has traditionally used GSTQ but increasingly uses Jerusalem, especially in home internationals. I've heard NI use the Londonderry Air at times but there are no hard and fast rules. --Ef80 (talk) 22:08, 29 January 2016 (UTC)[reply]

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Tim Malloys

There is also a far less-renowned "opposite" to this song, in the form of The Tim Malloys, a song sung to the same tune as Billy Boys, but in honour of The Tim Malloys (q.v.), a Catholic Glasgow gang roughly co-existent in time and place with the original Billy Boys. The lyrics of the latter song basically mirror and satirise those of the former, being sung to an identical rhyme-scheme that in the majority of its lines simply substitutes the name of the Catholic gang for every occurrence of the Protestant one; the one exception being that in response to the word Fenian, its place in the lyric is yeilded to Orange as a descriptor of religious (and hence ideological) affiliation. It has no known author, and likely simply grew together from the contributions of (e.g.) Celtic fans. Its principal purpose has been to be sung to counter performances of Billy Boys and to antagonise its supporters, i.e., often in a footballing context. Nuttyskin (talk) 20:41, 16 October 2021 (UTC)[reply]