Talk:Be Thou My Vision

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Untitled comments

Why are we citing a source that says Dallan Forgaill wrote it in the 8th century when Forgaill died in 598? 174.252.37.5 (talk) 03:21, 12 February 2012 (UTC)[reply]

I've just removed these sentences:

In 2003 a German version was made by Theo Eissler and Daniel Jacobi, two leading contemporary German worship leaders. This is found in the songbook "In Love with Jesus 2" and with the title "Herr aller Hoffnung"

Unless I'm much mistaken, "Herr aller Hoffnung" is a translation of the English language hymn "Lord of all hopefulness," which just happens to be sung to "Slane," the same tune as "Be Thou my Vision." I don't have access to the German lyrics, so maybe someone who does can confirm this, and if necessary reinstate the two sentences?

Cailean Macleòid 1st September 2006

The german songwriters obviously worked from The text of "Be thou my vision" but may also have been influenced by "Lord of all hopefulness" - which was itself a reworking of the general theme/feel of "Be thou my vision" - IMHO

Herr aller Hoffnung, ich stehe vor dir. Höre mein Bitten und neig dich zu mir. In dir ist das Leben und du bist mein Licht. Herr, deine Nähe gibt mir Zuversicht.

Herr aller Weisheit, ich höre auf dich. Sprich durch dein Wort und leb du selbst durch mich. Du bist mein Vater und ich bin dein Kind. In Liebe verbunden vereint wir nun sind.

Herr aller Wahrheit, ich hoffe auf dich. Was mir auch droht, bitte schütze du mich. Sei du meine Hilfe, mein starker Turm. Du bist meine Kraft, meine Zuflucht im Sturm.

Herr aller Herren, mein Erbe bist du. Was nützen mir Ehre und Reichtum dazu? Nimm in meinem Herzen den ersten Platz ein. Du sollst mein Schatz und mein König sein.

Herr aller Himmel, ich diene dir gern. Und auch im Sterben gehör ich dem Herrn. Der Tod ist besiegt und die Nacht ist vorbei. Was immer geschieht, ich bin dein allezeit.

best hymn ever —Preceding unsigned comment added by 69.67.234.143 (talk) 04:21, 1 October 2007 (UTC)[reply]

The 1982 Hymnal of the Episcopal Church has what seems to be a typo. In the third stanza, instead of "thou in me dwelling," the verse reads "thou in my dwelling," which makes grammatical but not literary sense. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 24.158.154.81 (talk) 12:14, 25 May 2010 (UTC)[reply]

Original Lyrics

I'm having an awful time digging up the original Irish lyrics to the song "Slane," to which "Be Thou My Vision" is sung. Either "Slane" needs its own page, or the lyrics need to be here. — Preceding unsigned comment added by ThoughtFodder (talk • contribs) 08:34, 13 December 2011 (UTC)[reply]

Nearly three years later, but an answer to your question. Slane does not have original lyrics, because it's a tune, not a song. This site says it's "associated with the ballad 'With My Love Come on the Road' in Patrick W. Joyce's Old Irish Folk Music and Songs (1909)". The book is online at Archive.org, and it's actually called "With My Love on the Road" (no "come"), but it only gives the tune, no words. That's evidently just another name for the tune. --Nicknack009 (talk) 11:26, 12 August 2014 (UTC)[reply]

Rend Collective

Should "You Are My Vision" by Rend Collective Experiment go in notable recordings? It's basically akin to The Message translation of the Bible for this song. Ravens freak0624 (talk) 02:26, 4 March 2014 (UTC)[reply]

More adequate german translations

I like to contribute two translations:

A) A more adequate german translation than the one from Eissler/Jacobi 2003 (Projektion J) is done by Wolfgang Müller, 1992 (according to: enominepatris.com/deutschtum/musik/Steh%20mir%20vor%20Augen.htm):

1. Steh mir vor Augen, auf dich will ich seh‘n. Herr, deine Wahrheit allein wird besteh‘n. Sei du mir nahe bei Tag und bei Nacht. Wach oder schlaf ich, hab du auf mich acht.

2. Präge mein Denken, mein Fühlen, mein Sein, ruf mich in deine Gemeinschaft hinein. Du bist mir Vater, ich bleibe dein Kind. Wohne in mir, dass stets eines wir sind.

3. Sei Schutz und Zuflucht mir, Helfer in Not, Kraft und Geduld gib mir, gnädiger Gott. Wenn auch in Ängsten der Sturm mich umtost, schenkt doch dein Wort mir Gewissheit und Trost.

4. Reichtum und Ehre begehre ich nicht, bleibst du nur immer mein Heil und mein Licht. Liebe und Treue, Kraft, Frieden und Ruh, Hoffnung und Freude – mein Alles bist du.

5. Herrscher des Himmels, Vollender der Welt, auf dich ist all mein Vertrauen gestellt. Trotz aller Nöte – auf dich will ich bau‘n. Steh mir vor Augen, Herr, dich lass mich schau‘n.

B) Here is my own - rather literal - german translation which is NOT singable to the rhythm of the song - understanding that the key thought is "be though" = "Sei du" as the authors wish in his prayer: "God / Christ himself may be..." all what he is expressing in allmost every line of the poem:

1. Sei du meine Zukunftshoffnung, o Herr meines Herzens; alles andere sei nichts für mich – ausgenommen, was du selber bist. (Sei) Du mein bester/wichtigster Gedanke bei Tag und bei Nacht, wachend oder schlafend –deine Gegenwart (sei) mein Licht.

2. Sei du meine Weisheit, und du mein wahr(haftig)es Wort. Ich (will) immer mit dir (sein), und du mit mir, Herr. (Sei) du mein groß(artiger) Vater, ich dein echtes Kind. (Sei) Du wohnend in mir, und mit dir (sei) ich eins.

3. Sei du mein Schild im Kampf, (mein) Schwert für das Gefecht. Sei du meine Würde, du meine Wonne/Freude. (Sei) Du der Zufluchtsort meiner Seele, du mein hoher/starker Turm. Erhebe mich himmelwärts, oh Macht meiner Kraft.

4. Weder auf Reichtum achte ich noch auf leere Menschenehre. (Sei) Du mein Erbe, jetzt und für immer. (Sei) Du und du allein zuerst (vor allem anderen) in meinem Herzen. Oberster König der Himmel du bist mein Kleinod/Schatz.

5. Oberster König der Himmel, (du hast) den Sieg für mich errungen. Ich möchte die Freuden des Himmels erlangen, oh helle Himmelssonne! Du bis das Herz meines eigenen Herzens, was immer auch geschieht, sei du immer (noch) meine Zukunftshoffnung, oh Herrscher über alles. — Preceding unsigned comment added by Queso Suizo (talk • contribs) 10:32, 4 October 2013 (UTC)[reply]

4/4 time

Yesterday I added this sentence at the end of the article: "Nowadays the rhythm of Slane is sometimes modified by lengthening the first notes of each measure to dotted quarter notes, changing the time signature to 4/4.^[1]"

This was reverted by user:Dabbler with the comment, "Reference is no evidence that this is more than one blog post describing one single event of this taking place."

I would like to know whether Dabbler doubts that what I wrote is true, or what. I have often heard it played in 4/4 time recently, in fact I think more often than in 3/4 time. So I went and found a reference that supports this. I don't think my edit should be reverted!

^ For example, Be Thou My Vision – revamped

Eric Kvaalen (talk) 07:11, 12 August 2014 (UTC)[reply]

Unfortunately, your personal experience, and your determination that the song is being played in 4/4 by lengthening the first notes of each measure to dotted quarter notes in the video, is original research. No matter how accurate it is, Wikipedia doesn't allow it. It demands Verifiability, not truth. If you could find a reliable third party saying that Be Thou My Vision is often played in 4/4 time by lengthening the first note of the bar to a dotted crotchet, you could put it in, but you can't just say it is and link to a video example of that happening, because many, probably most, Wikipedians don't have the musical expertise to verify that from the video. Sorry.

It would equally true to say that anyone who plays Be Thou My Vision in 4/4 is a musical ignoramus, but we can't put that in there either, because it's opinion, and also counts as original research. --Nicknack009 (talk) 10:08, 12 August 2014 (UTC)[reply]

One blog reference by one person changing the tune to 3/4 time is only an indication that it has been done once and may only be a single unique event in one location. I have never heard it sung in 4/4 time but I do not doubt your statement that it is in your location. Your experience that it is becoming more common, wherever you are, may well be true but I think that Wikipedia requires that you need a more general and reliable source for the practice if you want it to be included here. Dabbler (talk) 11:26, 12 August 2014 (UTC)[reply]

Well, I don't understand why you bother to revert edits by other people when you have no reason to think what the person says is wrong. Nicknack, don't you believe that some people can tell 4/4 time from 3/4 time? Cabbler can also tell the difference! And Dabbler, you say you believe me that I've heard it in 4/4 time in my location (which happens to be the Paris area). Well I've just heard it on Rend Collective#Homemade Worship by Handmade People in 4/4 time – a band from Northern Ireland. So now do you believe that it's often done that way? The Wikipedia rules about verifiability are for people to use when they think a statement is untrue, not when they think a statement is probably true but they just want to keep the article the way it was. No one has charged you folks with enforcing Wikipedia's rules. You choose to do so from your own motivations. Eric Kvaalen (talk) 11:48, 22 September 2014 (UTC)[reply]

Your edits were reverted because, as explained, they were original research which is against Wikipedia's rules. You know have a third party source talking about the song being adapted to 4/4 time, but your explanation about lengthening the first note of each bar to a dotted quarter note is still original research, because you are using your own musical expertise, not a third party source, to determine that (of course some people, even lots of people, can tell 3/4 from 4/4 - but equally lots of people don't have that musical knowledge). Also, you can't use other Wikipedia articles as sources, and even if you could, the article you linked to doesn't support the statement it footnotes. I have reduced your edit to what the cites support. --Nicknack009 (talk) 12:38, 22 September 2014 (UTC)[reply]

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Scan of original hymnal setting

I have a copy of the Church Hymnal with Accompanying Tunes in which "Be Thou My Vision" was first printed as a hymn set to "Slane" in 1919 for use by the Church of Ireland. As this hymnal was published 98 years ago, and songs enter the public domain in Ireland after 70, I have scanned and uploaded this original hymn setting as it first appeared. I think this should be considered a relevant image to be included on the hymn's Wikipedia page. — Preceding unsigned comment added by James.lewis (talk • contribs) 18:38, 1 May 2017 (UTC)[reply]

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Brazilian-Portuguese Version.

There's a Brazilian-Portuguese Version of this song, which was made by "Diante do Trono", a gospel group, in 1999. It's called "Dono do meu coração". Here's the link: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=z7aTKaInYjo I add it in the section "Other Languages". — Preceding unsigned comment added by Isaque Neves (talk • contribs) 23:26, 4 October 2017 (UTC)[reply]

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[1] For example, Be Thou My Vision – revamped

[1]