Talk:Battle of Yultong

Let us stop historical distortion!

What proof is there that the PVA 34th Division 12th Army composed of 40k Chinese soldiers? President Fidel Ramos, a Korean War veteran (although in a different battalion, the 20th BCT) claimed that the participants were 17 to 1. Here is the source of his speech: Speech of President Ramos on the 42nd anniversary of the Battle of Yultong | Official Gazette of the Republic of the Philippines

It is arguably not the most credible if we're talking about sources, but this is significantly more credible than claims of 40k that came out of nowhere. And here we see social media propagating baseless claims.

The Filipino 10th BCT in this battle composed of 900. Taking the 17 to 1 ratio earlier, 900x17 is 15,000, which is a more likely number. This is a very rough assumption, but since at the moment we're not able to find better sources, we will have to resort to this. It is way better than 40,000.

Here is a Chinese website that discusses the 12th Army of the PVA, including the 34th Division and all its other divisions: https://m.thepaper.cn/baijiahao_9679811

According to the website, the combined 12th Army (3 divisions, including the 34th Division) plus the 6th Artillery Regiment composes of roughly 54,000 men. So, 4 units. 54,000 divided by 4 and we have 13.5k men. Again, a rough estimate, but Ramos' statement is being reinforced with foreign sources. Therefore, it is between 13-15k men of the 34th Division of the PVA against the 900 men of the 10th BCT of PEFTOK. If ultranationalists do not want to trust a Chinese website then it can only mean close-mindedness. Just because you hate the source does not remove the value of what the other side of the story has to say.

So far, there are no credible sources (not even government websites are credible), no books that discusses this battle extensively, and most of them appear to have followed what some random....(can't swear) people has to say on Wikipedia. To show the extent of the impact that Wikipedia can bring, we must take into account that the Vatican City used the Wikipedian flag of the Vatican instead of the real one for several years! It is not unlikely that even government websites moderated by some random employees are susceptible to this kind of disinformation, this urban myth.

We can therefore conclude that 40k Chinese zombies fighting 900 Filipino spartan supersaiyans are nothing short of an ultranationalist myth propagated with an ulterior motive.

Regardless, hopefully all of us can come to a consensus, wake up, stop believing in fairy tales, but also, to not settle with even the estimates that this message states, but to implement critical thinking and an open mind, and find better sources if possible. Thank you for reading! Delirium333 (talk) 05:16, 11 June 2024 (UTC)

@Delirium333

UN victory is also definitely contestable, given that all sources on the topic point to a UN retreat from their positions. We also have no KIA sources on the Chinese side. Should probably be checked for accuracy Skerbs (talk) 14:44, 25 July 2024 (UTC)

It's ridiculous, there are people saying that I am a 'wumao' for being objective during the edit, while not publishing any source at all as a counterargument when they reverted the edit. The copium is strong on this one. And I am Filipino, so being called a wumao is ridiculous on its own. Delirium333 (talk) 16:10, 28 July 2024 (UTC)

So I found another document, which was from a book by the Philippine Army itself, dated 1997, which also talks about the 17 Chinese to 1 Filipino ratio. Unfortunately this ratio is still vague, however this is the most legitimate form of reference that we currently have for this page and this is what we should use over the 40,000 ridiculous claims without references. This means that the 15,000 claim that I've made has some substance after all. Delirium333 (talk) 16:26, 9 November 2024 (UTC)