Talk:Baizuo/GA1

GA Review

The following discussion is closed. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.

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Reviewer: Sammi Brie (talk · contribs) 04:00, 18 August 2023 (UTC)

GA review (see here for what the criteria are, and here for what they are not)
It is reasonably well written. a (prose, spelling, and grammar): b (MoS for lead, layout, word choice, fiction, and lists): It is factually accurate and verifiable. a (references): b (citations to reliable sources): c (OR): d (copyvio and plagiarism): It is broad in its coverage. a (major aspects): b (focused): It follows the neutral point of view policy. Fair representation without bias: It is stable. No edit wars, etc.: It is illustrated by images, where possible and appropriate. a (images are tagged and non-free images have fair use rationales): b (appropriate use with suitable captions):
Overall: Pass/Fail:
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Copy changes

Etymology

• An article from the Southern Metropolis Daily goes further, referring to the term as originating from a 2010 article, "The Fake Morality of the Western 'White Left' and the Chinese 'Patriotic Scientists'", made by Li Shuo, a Renren Network user, in which he satirized and blamed foreign left-wing youth who came to China to help the Chinese revolution before 1949 and held a sympathetic attitude toward the communist revolution. Split this sentence that is 70 words long.
• Zhang summarizes the commonality of more than 400 relevant responses on Zhihu, which accuses Western leftists and liberals of having no concept of the real world, of being hypocritical, of caring only about topics such as immigration, minorities, and LGBT, of lacking of sense of real problems in the real world, of tolerating the "regressive values" of Islam for the sake of multiculturalism, and of supporting the welfare state at the expense of tolerating lazy people.
  • A 76-word whopper of a sentence.
  • The bolded is one list entry containing commas. Thus, semicolons are called for between the other entries.
  • "LGBT" is not a topic; this should be worded. LGBT rights? The LGBT community?
  • Wikilink Zhihu
  • Does the commonality accuse or do the forum posts, plural, accuse?
• By analyzing, three meanings A bit of an awkward phrasing.

• New! The initial popularity of the term has been attributed by several surveys... This passage probably needs to attribute this theory also to Cheng specifically. We can only say things definitely, in wiki-voice, when that is a multiple-scholar consensus, not a statement likely to be challenged or highly dependent on one source. It is also a long sentence that could be split. Consider this for a number of passages in the article like For liberal intellectuals, the criticism of the white left and the praise of Trump also represent their non-nationalist sentiment and pro-market sentiment.

Usage

• a solid piece of evidence that Chinese netizens blamed on the "white left" ideology of Europe and compared it Drop the redundant "it"
• the Amnesty International's survey either the Amnesty International survey or Amnesty International's survey
• medias should be "media" or "media outlets"
• On June 22, the Guangdong Communist Youth League created a similar questionnaire asking netizens if they were willing to support the Chinese government's acceptance of Middle Eastern refugees and this time, only about 0.5 percent said they did. Comma needed after "refugees". See User:Sammi Brie/Commas in sentences (CinS)
• in the web maybe "on the web" or "online"
• Chinese netizens have adopted the narrative that intervention from the United States and the West instigated the Syrian civil war and caused the refugee crisis, and therefore accuse Western countries of hypocrisy on the refugee issue. Remove this comma ("netizens" is the subject both halves of the sentence) (CinS)
• And for Chinese liberals, or at least some of them, Trump's toughness and conservatism toward China have appealed to them, and they want to use similar conservative ideas to promote a liberal democratic system in China, while both liberals who support Trump and those who criticize him invoke cases like the Cultural Revolution or the Great Leap Forward as an overall critique of the left and believe that the American left will similarly lead to these happening in the United States–the former believe that the removal of Confederate memorials is an act similar to the destruction of the Four Olds, Black Lives Matter to the Red Guards, and MeToo to the big character poster or struggle session, which leads them to conclude that the "white left" is destroying the United States, while the latter compares Trump's populism to Maoism. This sentence is 139 words long.
• Chenchen Zhang assumes that this laissez-faire is a result of government tolerating and even encouraging discussions that portray the West as divisive and declining caused by democratic politics, and would like to see the netizens portray Western politicians as hypocritical and selfish when it comes to human rights. The comma needs to go (CinS), or the sentence should be outright split.

Spot checks

• 3: I can't read Chinese, so instead spotchecking
  • 2: In short, baizuo(白左) is idiot (baichi, 白痴), a naïve, simple, and narrow-minded liberalist. Y
• 4: The question has received more than 400 answers from Zhihu users, which include some of the most representative perceptions of the 'white left'. Although the emphasis varies, baizuo is used generally to describe those who “only care about topics such as immigration, minorities, LGBT and the environment” and “have no sense of real problems in the real world”; they are hypocritical humanitarians who advocate for peace and equality only to “satisfy their own feeling of moral superiority”; they are “obsessed with political correctness” to the extent that they “tolerate backwards Islamic values for the sake of multiculturalism”; they believe in the welfare state that “benefits only the idle and the free riders”; they are the “ignorant and arrogant westerners” who “pity the rest of the world and think they are saviours”. Y
• 7: The two terms resemble the American slang ‘libertard’ but are not as closely tied to the liberal-conservative political spectrum. They are more of a generalisation of the ‘classically Western’ image in Chinese public discourse. Y
• 13: On June 22, 2017, the Guangdong Communist Youth League conducted a similar online survey but phrased the question slightly differently: “The Middle East refugees continue to increase. Does the Chinese government have the responsibility to accept refugees?” Out of 10,000 votes cast, only 51 people, i.e., 0.5%, agreed to “accept the Middle East refugees because they are in need.” Y
• 21: This cites three separate items and is the citation for the 139-word sentence. It requires splitting up, probably three ways or more. The existence of three references here may hint at how to split it.
  • I note the Hendriks-Kim item is not in an academic journal and would recommend in-text attribution for its claims. I can't even find what it is used for in that sentence, such is its size. Lin and Gao are a little more identifiable.
  • Lin: While non-liberal intellectuals in China also fall prey to Trump-mania and Trumpism, they do not as much (re)shape public discourses in China as their liberal counterparts, who, upon absorbing raw Trumpian sentiments supplied by ordinary pro-CCP netizens, are able to theorize, systemize and legitimize those sentiments under the guise of liberal democratic values.; In particular, the longstanding appropriation of the left-political vocabulary by the CCP (which, after all, is a self-styled ‘leftist’ party), and the traumatic horrors and catastrophes of Maoist totalitarianism—the Anti-Rightists Campaign, the Great Leap Forward, the Three-Year Famine, and the Cultural Revolution—committed in the name of ‘revolutionary’ ideals, have continued to overwhelm liberal critics and mold their political perceptions, aversions and imaginations; Projecting their fear ofthe Cultural Revolution onto the imagined West, beaconist liberals have repeatedly analogized, say, removal of Confederate memorials to ‘posijiu [destroying the Four Olds]’, Black Lives Matter activists to ‘hongweibing [Red Guards]’, and the MeToo movement to ‘dazibao [Big-Character Posters]’ and ‘gongshen [show trials]’, and are highly receptive to the idea that the feminist, anti-racist, and anti-colonialist ‘baizuo [white lefties]’ are suffocating Western societies with meticulous and inhibitive norms of ‘political correctness’. Y I would adjust the citation to 88, 94–96.
  • Gao: Second, the horrors and disasters that liberal intellectuals suffered under the Maoist ultra-leftist totalitarian regime pushed them on a blind political pilgrimage to the West as an ideal political destination and catapulted them on a slippery slope from anti-ultra-leftist Maoism to opposition against all leftist progressive politics Y

Earwig mostly catches the Carlson quote box, but it does raise a suggestion. One or two of Zheng's comments probably should be quoted as his own words in long stretches, especially "sense of real problems in the real world".

Images

There are no images. I reiterate as an encouragement Z1720's peer review comment that images would make the page more attractive to readers, if reasonable.

@Sammi Brie: Thanks for checking:

Etymology

1. Done

2. It means "commonality of posts" being summarized.

3. Will give rephrase a try.

Usage

Mostly done, but chopping up the sentences needs some work. As you can see I don't really know that long sentences are a minus rather than a plus haha.

Spot checks

I think it's fine, but probably I'd need a bit of time to think about how best to pick the sentence being quoted?

ときさき くるみ ^{not because they are easy, but because they are hard} 07:09, 18 August 2023 (UTC)

@Tokisaki Kurumi I hadn't gotten to spot checks yet — I ran out of steam last night. I will ping you when those are done. Sammi Brie (she/her • t • c) 15:49, 18 August 2023 (UTC)

@Tokisaki Kurumi: Just completed spot checks on the content. You really really need to clean up that 139-word sentence. Other items come back clean. Sammi Brie (she/her • t • c) 16:17, 18 August 2023 (UTC)

@Sammi Brie: Hi. I have finished splitting sentences and partially rewriting them. For the analysis issue, I will read the original book, and for the picture issue, I would like to know if you have any good suggestions? ときさき くるみ ^{not because they are easy, but because they are hard} 09:21, 20 August 2023 (UTC)

@Tokisaki Kurumi The analysis issue can be simply solved by attributing things to the people that said them: "According to Cheng", "per research by X", etc. It's a matter of presentation more than anything. As for images, the mention of big-character posters was a new one on me. File:1967-04 1967年大字报.jpg could work with a caption such as "Critics of baizuo tend to link trends in Western society to historical events from Maoist China, such as big-character posters." Sammi Brie (she/her • t • c) 17:47, 20 August 2023 (UTC)

@Tokisaki Kurumi: New image additions are great. I'd suggest removing the Weibo quote box, as now you have more material on the right side; the Zhihu one is a bit more incendiary but also conveys the attitude a little better. (I also reduced the width of the quote boxes to be a bit more in line with the images.) Does that work? If so, I think I am ready to pass this. Sammi Brie (she/her • t • c) 04:54, 22 August 2023 (UTC)

I certainly don't have a problem with quote box deletion. Also, you mentioned earlier that I could put Chenchen Zhang's statement in a separate quote box as well as attribute the analysis, so I guess I could refine it a bit in that regard? Because I've been taking a lot of my energy these days on trying to figure out what images would be good to put in and cutting sentences. ときさき くるみ ^{not because they are easy, but because they are hard} 07:48, 22 August 2023 (UTC)

@Tokisaki Kurumi It's fine as is. I never said it should be put in a quote box, just that we mention in text who said it. I'm actually passing this page with that change approved. Sammi Brie (she/her • t • c) 07:57, 22 August 2023 (UTC)

The discussion above is closed. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.