Talk:Axel Auriant/Archive 1

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Archive 1

Some suggestions

Hi, I saw your question at the Ref Desk, and thought I'd attempt to help. Well done with the draft so far. I'm fairly fluent in French. I've been editing on WP for over 10 years, and here's a few things I've learned along the way. You may be aware of some the following already.

Cite templates

Although they use {{lien web}}, most of the cites in the French article are pretty rudimentary and should be expanded for English WP. Although you can use a bare url within <ref> </ref>, it's much better to use the en:WP equivalent, {{cite web}}. Although it takes a bit longer, it's easily the best way to create a fully-formed citation; it always correctly formats any ref with the Wikipedia style; a new article reviewer can't question it; and it stops link rot. Here's one chosen at random from the French article (no. 14):

« Axel Auriant » [archive], sur Théâtres Parisiens Associés. This should be done as follows:

<ref>{{cite web |title=Axel Auriant |website=Théâtres et Producteurs Associés |language=French |url=https://tpa.fr/acteurs-theatre/auriant-axel-8339.html |access-date=13 November 2021}}</ref> which ends up like this:^[1]

All parameters are in lower case, ie |title=, not |Title=. Other parameters you should use if they appear on the web page:

|last= author's last name
|first= author's first name
|author-link= title of WP article   eg |author-link=Alexandre Dumas (for example)
|date= date of publication

The French citation includes an archive link, https://archive.wikiwix.com/cache/index2.php?url=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.theatresparisiensassocies.com%2Facteurs-theatre%2Fauriant-axel-8339.html. This isn't strictly necessary, but if you use {cite web}'s |archive-url= you must also use |archive-date=, which isn't shown in the archived url above. There is an automated way to archive all the links in an draft or article at the Wayback Machine on archive.org called IABot, but that can wait for a bit.

Here's another ref (no. 9):

Stéphanie Guerrin, « “Skam”, la série dont les ados et jeunes adultes raffolent », Le Parisien,‎ 24 février 2019 (lire en ligne [archive]).

{{cite web |title='Skam', la série dont les ados et jeunes adultes raffolent |last=Guerrin |first=Stéphanie |website=[[Le Parisien]] |language=French |date=24 February 2019 |url=http://www.leparisien.fr/culture-loisirs/series/skam-les-ados-et-jeunes-adultes-raffolent-de-cette-serie-24-02-2019-8019213.php |access-date=13 November 2021}}, which results in this:^[2]

Note English-language 'Skam' rather than French “Skam”. Also, you can use wikilinks with |website= or its synonym |publisher=.

References

^ "Axel Auriant". Théâtres et Producteurs Associés (in French). Archived from the original on 20 December 2021. Retrieved 13 November 2021.
^ Guerrin, Stéphanie (24 February 2019). "'Skam', la série dont les ados et jeunes adultes raffolent". Le Parisien (in French). Archived from the original on 14 November 2021. Retrieved 13 November 2021.

Links to articles on other WP projects

You - or someone - has used "Axel Auriant-Blot studied at the École Alsacciene [<nowiki/>[[:fr:École_alsacienne|fr]]]"

This quick and dirty method isn't really approved of: the best way to do this is to use {{ill}} (inter-language link}. If in the future an English equivalent article is created, it links to the English one instead. If you actually open the relevant French article and physically copy & paste the title into {{ill}}, it also prevents spelling mistakes...

{{ill|École alsacienne|fr}} which results in École alsacienne. Haha, there is one already!

Pop-ups for refs

If you click on Special:preferences → Gadgets and disable 'Navigation popups' and enable 'Reference Tooltips', when you hover the mouse over a ref (and especially those created with {{sfn}}) will show pop-ups without you having to click your way through the reflist and associated {{cite book}}, {{cite web}} etc. This may be the default for new users anyway.

Also, still in Gadgets, enable 'Display links to disambiguation pages in orange'. This does what it says on the tin, and alerts you to Nicoletta, who is in fact Nicoletta (singer). You may be aware of the wp:pipe trick which suppresses text in a wikilink after a comma or in brackets, thus [[Nicoletta (singer)|]] displays as Nicoletta and [[Boston, Lincolnshire|]] as Boston.

Other stuff

I think that https://conservatoires.paris.fr/conservatoires/ibert is the particular Municipal Conservatoire in the 19th Arrondissement, one of the Conservatoires à rayonnement régional (CRR) which are part of the Conservatoire de musique, danse et art dramatique en France [fr]. A basic {cite web} as above would do the trick.

Argh, there's so much to do: if you use French words as above, it's best to use {{lang}} to help the underlying Mediawiki software understand for meta-data purposes: {{lang|fr|Conservatoires à rayonnement régional}} which results in Conservatoires à rayonnement régional.

Sorry, this has turned out rather longer than I expected, I just needed a change from my current obsessions on WP. Best of luck, ping me here {{re}} or leave a message on my talk page if you need any help. >MinorProphet (talk) 05:52, 13 November 2021 (UTC)

Additional Advice

Great points made above. (MinorProphet: You might consider generalizing it, and spinning it off into an essay, or at least a copy/paste snippet in some user subpage of yours where you can readily retrieve it when needed.)

@EcheveriaJ: Here's a grab bag of additional points, not as well organized as MP's:

Regarding your red links, some of which I've fixed: some exist already in English; if it's an institution in France, and it's popular enough, there may already be an article on en-wiki with an English name (e.g., French National Assembly); if English sources commonly use the French name, then use that (Champs-Élysées, not "Elysian Fields") or, if it's less well known in English, and few or no English sources about it, then use the French name.

Often, there is a choice of an English or a French name, and you can code [[Paris Conservatory]] or [[Conservatoire de Paris]] and both work and go to the same article (Paris Conservatory, Conservatoire de Paris). Watch for the many institutions that have changed names over their history; use the name appropriate for the epoch, it should redirect to the current name. For articles in modern times, like this one, use the common name (Paris Conservatory, or the French common name) not the "official name" (Conservatoire National Supérieur de Musique et de Danse de Paris) except in a formal context (ribbon-cutting ceremony, national speech, etc).

Use Template:Interlanguage link to link an article that exists in French and not in English. Sometimes, you have to search around in fr-wiki to find the article; one misplaced accent, and you may get a red link there, too; case in point: "théâtre de Beliers parisiens" is red in your article because no article exists in en-wiki for that, but you could use an {{interlanguage link}} here, as an article exists for it in fr-wiki; but note: *not* with those accents: that's red in fr-wiki, too. See if you can find the French article under that name, and when you do, add an {{ill}} to link to it here.

Translation sometimes leaves text that is completely opaque to English readers for cultural reasons, such as "Etoile du Parisien",^[a] where the original would need no explanation because all French readers would have the cultural knowledge required to understand it. In English, such expressions need some kind of treatment to aid the English-speaking reader. In rough order of preference:

a wikilink (blue link) if an article exists in en-wiki explaining it (none exists in this case)
use Template:Interlanguage link if an article about it (or a redirect) exists in fr-wiki but not here (nope)
explain it inline in the running text (possibly in a parenthetical) if it's important enough (not in this case; nobody cares what "Etoile Parisien" is here)
use an explanatory footnote to describe it, with Template:Efn. (I'd use this one, here)

That's about it; hope this helps! Feel free to ask me questions about Wikipedia (or French translation) on my Talk page. Mathglot (talk) 20:25, 14 November 2021 (UTC)

Many thanks MinorProphet and Mathglot - your advice is a great help, though I'm a little bamboozled by bits of it so I'll no doubt bother you about it in the near future! I've deliberately not pinged you directly since I'm not asking anything, but please know my gratitude for your help, it really it is invaluable. EcheveriaJ (talk) 20:48, 14 November 2021 (UTC)

Notes

^ l’Etoile du Parisien is a top rating or recognition awarded by the French newspaper Le Parisien.

Ready for Mainspace?

Mathglot,MinorProphet Hi, do you think that the draft is now ready for the main space? Is there anything that should be fixed, added/removed? Thanks again for the help so far! I'm not quite sure what's gone wrong with citation 7... Also, is there anyway to link this article to the French original? In French WP there seems to be links to the pages in other languages, but there doesn't seem to be a similar function in the English WP. Many thanksEcheveriaJ (talk) 22:24, 15 November 2021 (UTC)

Oh! I forgot, ehm, do you think that the citation banner can go now? I've got a conflict of interests so don't think it's appropriate that I touch it. Thanks EcheveriaJ (talk) 22:27, 15 November 2021 (UTC)

@EcheveriaJ:, Looking better already. Make sure to use {{re}} with curly braces {{ to ping users, rather than [[, which are wikilinks, and you can't ping an article... There are a number of stylistic conventions which WP uses: I'll try to point out my changes as I go along.

However, you say you have a WP:Conflict of interest (COI). Well done for saying so. This is particularly important, but it unfortunately makes it considerably more difficult to get the article approved, especially if you are the subject of the article. I strongly suggest you *don't* reveal your identity or your relationship to the subject. I was previously involved in one similar article which was published, but things have changed since then. Please make sure to read the COI article and the Wikipedia:Plain and simple conflict of interest guide. You should wp:DISCLOSE your interest, and you should not make any more edits to this draft or the article if/when it gets published. You can make a {{request edit}} for substantial addititions. I will check whether the subject of the article is even WP:Notable by English WP's standards, which are fairly ruthless. I hope that the article does get published, but it may be harder than I had thought. In my opinion, the article seems relatively balanced - it's partly a question of whether the sources are wp:RELIABLE enough. Bonne chance! MinorProphet (talk) 13:58, 17 November 2021 (UTC)

@EcheveriaJ: Well, having had a look, I would personally say that Auriant is easily notable enough for an article: the refs seem OK, and some are substantial. Please don't be discouraged after all the good work you have done, I was just making the rules plain for everyone's benefit. COI is strongly cautioned against on English WP: there are probably thousands of attempts a week to create articles on WP by people with shameless self-promotion in mind who have little idea about whether they deserve one. Please join in the discussion, and comment on my remarks etc. However, I think any major additions to the draft should have their own section with =={{Edit request}}== as the section title, to be on the safe side. Anway, some thoughts on the draft:

Pretty much every statement should have a ref. You didn't include some of the later ones, I've done that for you. I think that all the refs now have a consistent style.
In {cite web}, |website= can include wikilinks (eg |website=Le Parisien but not urls |website=https://www.leparisien.fr - this is the cause of the red error when {cite web} displays the output. My preference for the name of the website is for its actual name in English or French (etc.) of the website, not its abbreviated url. Again, there may be rules but I don't think anyone is going to complain.
Names of plays, films, etc. are italicised. I've just put a single quote around the English translation.
All Capitals should be avoided: thus 'En Images', not 'EN IMAGES', even if this is how it appears on the web page.
I used to think that the titles in French of books, plays, and films only used lower case except for proper nouns, but a quick scan of French WP shows that this is evidently not the case (e.g. fr:Les Onze Mille Verges but most printed French editions have Les onze mille verges. . . My copy of Camus' novel has all capitals on the cover, and L'étranger on the title page. A novel by Gilbert Cesbron has c'est Mozart qu'on assasine on the cover.) The poster for Beaulieu's play reads Les 1001 vies des Urgences, so I'm going with that. I wonder what the Académie Française has to say on the subject.
Titles of web pages should contain just the title, not the name of the website as well: Not "Axel Auriant et son parcours avec Yamaha - Yamaha - France" but just "Axel Auriant et son parcours avec Yamaha". The |website= in this case can be "Yamaha France", not yamaha.fr. This is my personal opinion, I haven't looked up the specific rule in the WP:Manual of Style.
Again, this is my personal opinion, but in English, a colon is more than adequate to separate the main and subtitles. Thus "Axel Auriant: Rêves, passion et détermination" rather than "Axel Auriant | Rêves, passion et détermination". Different editors may have other feelings, and may express them quite forcefully. Consistency is probably best. If you prefer the pipe sign | , please say so, it's your article after all.
You have used dates in the YY-MM-DD style, that's fine. My own preference is for DD-MM-YY, because I can't count dates backwards...
"In 2021, he worked in Charlène Favier's Slalom" - this is probably a mistake for 2020. I was wrongly informed about Interlanguage links, the Help file shows many different ways to make them and none seem to be deprecated.
I found a ref (in English, for once) for the Deauville Festival. I'm not sure about the ref for the Cartier campaign. I made the ref but the site is just a collection of agent's pages etc., and not an independent 3rd party source. If there no other ref you can find, the whole sentence needs to go.
The final paragraph in the fr:wp article has a ref, but it's about Une vie sur mesure. You may have omitted it here for that reason. Can you find any refs about these concerts? Just a plain url is fine, I can make the full refs no problem.

Well, I think that's about done for now, what do you think? You just need to make a COI declaration, and I'll ask a friendly Article Reviewer if they can have a look. MinorProphet (talk) 05:24, 18 November 2021 (UTC)

Clear Up Confusion & Thanks

@MinorProphet: Thank you for your invaluable guidance again. I want to very quickly apologise and clear up a mistake of mine. I think I've majorly mislead you accidentally: I am in no way related to Auriant nor do I know him in even the slightest of capacities. Having now read WP's COI documentation, I must now correct myself and say that I do not have a COI. I am a Scot who speaks French to a B2 level, and I'm a French cinephile. I took a keen interest in the SKAM France TV series, that is why I though to make this draft as I was surprised there wasn't one for this actor. I have completely misunderstood what WP means by a COI - I thought I had a COI because I have played a heavy role in making the draft, I didn't understand COI means a person has a connection to the article's subject. Greatest of apologies, I should really read up on the definition of jargon before blindly using it. Hence, I take it since I do not have a conflict of interest, I remain free to edit the article?

Concerning formatting in the draft, I hadn't noticed a few of them so thanks for clearing that up.

Concerning citations for some of the French page's claims, I've been struggling to find some for the later claims so if I can't find any in the coming while,I will just delete the sentences.

Apologies and regards --EcheveriaJ (talk) 21:52, 18 November 2021 (UTC)

I don't know why I indented all those comments above, anyway. I noticed you changed one of my translations, no problems. Just to clear it up, I have not used a translation device at any time - I have only used a dictionary for the odd word or phrase I didn't know. Any error in translation/sloppiness is as a result of my human error, not machine error. The only time I have to work on this is after a ten hour day so my mind isn't always 100% sharp. The only time a machine has done anything is in generating citations - I use the visual editing, auto-generate citation tool and just try and fix any mistakes it makes. Apart from that, it's all human error. Thanks and apologies again, --EcheveriaJ (talk) 22:06, 18 November 2021 (UTC)

@EcheveriaJ: That's great to have sorted your non-COI out. Welcome back to the land of the living.

Translations from other language pages should have a banner stating so on the talk page, I'll check it out later. One of the purposes is to acknowledge the original French article, which is copyright in itself, including translations.
Which translation of yours did I change? It's a very personal thing. My underlying purpose in translation is to produce natural-sounding English, but I could go on about that for ever.
It wasn't I who suggested machine translation.
I've always done all my articles by hand, learning the {cite} templates etc. the hard way. It makes fixing mistakes much easier when you know what's going on underneath.
When we're done with the refs I can run Iabot to archive them all - it works well with the {cite} templates, and is good practice anyway.
What's your fave French film/director? I could reel off a whole list - no particular order - Les visiteurs, Le diner des cons, Alphaville, Les quatre cent coups, Du rifi chez les hommes, Pépé le moko (much better than Casablanca), L'Atalante, Taxi, Buffet froid, Danton, Jean de Florette, King Lear (1987 film) is a particular obsession although it's in English, Play Time/Trafic, Amélie, A bout de souffle, La haine, Le samourai, Themroc, etc. MinorProphet (talk) 07:14, 19 November 2021 (UTC)

@MinorProphet: I was wondering if I had to acknowledge the French page or not - so thanks for the clearup there. How do we acknowledge the page?

The changes in the translations are absolutely no problem, they're fair improvements on my verbose and clunky English!

Ye, I see it was Mathglot who thought I had used machine translation - sorry for the confusion. The names all run together when I'm reading through the draft history.

Favourite film would have to be La Haine. Not just favourite French film. Amélie however is terrible. Les Misérables (2019) would be second, but the final shot of the film is meant to be a cliff-hanger that just fades out pitifully. Somewhat detracts from the film. À Bout de Souffle is superb, though her accent irritates me quite a bit. My dad has had the poster for that film hanging up for 25 years or so - I grew up below the damned thing! Then there's also Les Intouchables, Les Choristes, Jonas, The three colour trilogy, Taxi (like you say), 120 battements par minute, C'est arrivé près de chez vous, Ernest et Celestine, Bienvenue à Marly-Gomont... I've watched a fair amount of Godard: I find his cinematography, use of colour and composition beautiful, but his storylines are just too conceptual for my feeble mind! Kassovitz is great too and Luc Besson is very good. You mention quite a few famous films there that I have on a list to see - so thanks for the recommendations! --EcheveriaJ (talk) 17:54, 19 November 2021 (UTC)

I put the template at the top of the page, {{Translated page}} shows the parameters. Other relevant pages are Wikipedia:Translation and Help:Translation. If you make another translation, the first edit summary of the draft should contain a credit to the source article: see Help:Translation#License requirements. I've done this retrospectively.

La haine is very powerful, raw, brutal. Didn't know what to expect when I first saw it. Amélie is trite, but somehow very French. Thanks for your recommendations, I'll have a look. I enjoyed Besson's La Femme Nikita and Léon: The Fifth Element is pretty good as well. I thought Kassovitz's Les rivières pourpres was pretty dire.

If we're done I'll run Iabot through it and see about a review. What about the lists at the end of the French article? It's only a case of finding the wikilinks, and {{ill}} will take care of the English ones. MinorProphet (talk) 03:52, 20 November 2021 (UTC)

Lists etc.

@MinorProphet: Hi, thanks for the guidance again. I'm a bit confused in what you're saying about the edit summaries. I've found nice little article that contradicts the French article (*sigh*). Une vie sur mesure did play in the Festival Off D'Avignon but (given it's a one-man show) not with Auriant. Somewhat throws that out the window so will go back and remove that false/misleading info. Concerning the lists, they're pretty bare of citations in the French original and seems to lack notability. I'll happily type out the rest, but I'm not sure if it'll stand up to review. Certainly, could get rid of the dubs section since it's a translation of a credit for reading a translation - with a credit! --EcheveriaJ (talk) 23:08, 20 November 2021 (UTC)

Thoughts on translating: mise en scène de l'auteur ?? Is it he is the stage director who wrote the piece, or the script writer who directed the piece? I.e. is there a primacy to the order? Probably overthinking it... Is it simply he is the scriptwriter and the stage director? I think I ought to go sleep. Speak later. Thanks --EcheveriaJ (talk) 23:16, 20 November 2021 (UTC)

@EcheveriaJ: I would say it all looks pretty good. I'm being lazy and just pointing out things, leaving you to do most of the work... Help:Translation#License requirements contains this:

The new, translated article must credit the source article:
(a) Provide in the first edit summary of the target article a statement of your translation, together with an interlanguage link to the source (translated-from) article. Example: Content in this edit is translated from the existing French Wikipedia article at fr:Exact name of French article; see its history for attribution.

Your first edit summary didn't actually give the exact name of the French article, is all. Just being picky.

Re Filmography lists: Providing sources can be carried to extremes. For example, the statement "2+2=4" doesn't need a ref, nor does "Clint Eastwood starred in Dirty Harry". Often the wikilinked article will provide the necessary refs, and they don't need duplicating. If you are going to keep the dubbing section, Dumbo should probably have the allodoublage ref.

Jojo's Bizarre Adventures: this page says it was the TV series, and seems to be JoJo's Bizarre Adventure: Golden Wind (2018); See no. 130/17 for Babyhead. It first aired in Japan in 2018, in English in 2019, and the date of 2021 in the French Auriant article is probably the date for airing in French.

Translation: mise en scène de l'auteur in this case definitely means "stage production by the author". I'm fairly sure that theatres have stage producers and films have directors, although the distinction is often blurred.

It appears that you still haven't gone to Special:preferences → Gadgets and clicked/enabled 'Display links to disambiguation pages in orange' and saved preferences. When you do this, you will see that Slalom, Nina and Plan B are all disambiguation pages which refer to more than one article. They need fixing to point to the correct WP article. Basically, every single time you make a wikilink (WL), you must absolutely open the link to make sure that it's the one you wanted, physically copy the title and paste it into the WL. This took me about five years to learn. The 'orange' gadget alerts you to this. If you link to disambig pages in live articles, an annoying bot will tell you on your talk page. If you really mean to link to the disambig page, put Nina (disambiguation): with the pipe trick, [[Nina (disambiguation)|]] will result in Nina. MinorProphet (talk) 13:39, 21 November 2021 (UTC)

@MinorProphet: Ok, I now understand what you mean by the edit summary thing - thanks. You're not being lazy at all, I'm more than happy to type things up and then just have it double checked - your guidance is most valuable. Concerning citing lists, I'm most glad to hear you say that - I've had a reviewer and someone on the Biology Helpdesk berate me for not citing every single item in a list of sampling techniques. I created a list of links of sampling techniques to organise them in a singular place, and was told to cite every single link - even though clicking on the link would give you a whole page about the technique with citations!

Thanks for the advice on disambiguation pages - I will go and change my settings.

Concerning JoJo's Bizarre Adventure (I feel so daft for writing that name) do you want me to move it to TV or change the year? Should I create a note saying that the year corresponds to the release of the dubbed work?

Concerning the translation, thanks. My theatre jargon is non-existent: I've seen a few online recordings of plays (Macbeth, Slab Boys, Romeo and Juliet) by I seldom go to the theatre - far too expensive!

Concerning the links/disambiguation pages - I think I've fixed them all but there are a few things I'd like to clear up - the Meurtres à Lille links to the episode of the same name, however the French article decided to link to the TV series as a whole - and not that individual episode. Which is better? Also, for TV ought I put in what series he played in - or can we leave that out?

I need to think of a different way to start sentences.... Regarding my new note on dubbing work - if I put it inline, it breaks the subheading. So, how to get around this?

In regards to the updated links for Nina and Plan B, how do I get rid of the unimportant French text that follows it?

Many thanks once again --EcheveriaJ (talk) 19:50, 21 November 2021 (UTC)

WikiShits

Although Wikipedia can be one of the most satisfying places to contribute to the sum of human knowledge, there are inevitably a small number of complete fuckwits who actually enjoy denigrating the sincere efforts of newcomers and anyone else who hasn't yet learned how to defend themselves here. It doesn't take long to identify these complete assholes and their power-crazed attitudes: it appears that you have already come across some of their species. There is no point in fighting back directly: it merely enrages their tiny mindset. Another term for these loud-mouthed fools is barrack-room lawyer. They tend to disappear in the end, consumed by their own self-importance. Just to make this plain, I'm going to re-instate a previously-deleted section of my user page which deals with just this type of troll: User:MinorProphet#Recipients of the Most Gracious Order of the WikiPile™. I'll come back to the draft soon. MinorProphet (talk) 22:16, 21 November 2021 (UTC)

Latest thoughts

@EcheveriaJ: Hi, I left the draft alone for a while, often a good idea. Hope you are coping with the increased workload. I think you have made excellent progress with the draft, well done. Some final touches:

Dubbing work: I would turn the note [d] into ordinary article text.

I went to the trouble of identifying the specific spin-off series and episode of JoJo, as above: I would paste that link into the draft. BTW, I have enjoyed many animés, most of them well-known such as Ghost in the Shell 1 & 2, Howl's Moving Castle, Princess Mononoke, Porco Rosso etc. Plus Naruto series.

Theatre: In general, the WP guidelines suggest to reduce all wikilinks to a minimum, certainly repeating the same WL no more than once per paragraph. I would pare down the multiple links so that there is no more than one WL, especially red ones. Turn all the rest into plain text. In French, théâtre du X has a lower-case 't', but in English it is always e.g. Théâtre des Béliers with a capital 'T'.

I think all the notes and refs are looking good, and consistently formatted.

Once you have done the above, I think I shall be wp:Bold, simply move the draft into mainspace (Click More next to History tab) and wait for a reviewer to cast a super-critical eye over it. Google and similar search engines won't pick it up until it has been reviewed, but in my experience it may speed things up.

PS Hot damn, those blue eyes! MinorProphet (talk) 03:28, 7 December 2021 (UTC)

Danke & Clarifications

Thank you for the help - hope all's well. I got the last pieces of work done today, a real weight is now off my shoulders. No more paperwork for a fortnight, then not a few weeks later until the next flood of it comes in. 5 years since the ultimate episode of SKAM Season 3 (the original Norwegian show) came out - so I "obviously" watched that. I'll go through your points in order:

Dubbing work - done: the format seems a bit odd this way, but it'll suffice.

Concerning JoJo - I'm a bit confused: if you've found the episode, would you mind if I asked as to which episode it is (so it can be included in the article?). Many pals of mine rave about Naruto and various other animés: I might watch Naruto soon. Must admit, the only cartoon I've ever really enjoyed is the French film, "Ernest et Celestine"

Theatre: So, would you like me to capitalise everything as per English rules on proper nouns or maintain lowercases as per French? Fine with either, just confused as to what you are suggesting. I'm guessing the English version, but not entirely certain (I'm half falling asleep rn).

Otherwise, multo bene! If I don't speak to you before then, Merry Christmas in advance. Merci bien og takk EcheveriaJ (talk) 23:16, 16 December 2021 (UTC)

@MinorProphet: - forgot to ping you, sorry. I really was sapped last night! EcheveriaJ (talk) 18:17, 17 December 2021 (UTC)

@EcheveriaJ: Copied from several sections above: " Jojo's Bizarre Adventures: this page says it was the TV series, and seems to be JoJo's Bizarre Adventure: Golden Wind#Babyhead (2018); See no. 130/17 for Babyhead. It first aired in Japan in 2018, in English in 2019, and the date of 2021 in the French Auriant article is probably the date for airing in French. "

English capitalisation, please. Ping when you're done, and I'll archive all the links with IAbot. You should register yourself - you don't need it too often, but it's very satisfying when you do. After that, there's no reason why you shouldn't make the move into mainspace yourself, it's your article after all. Glad you're done with the paperwork for the time being. Stay well. MinorProphet (talk) 23:34, 17 December 2021 (UTC)

@MinorProphet: - aah! Babyhead is the episode - not the character! That makes sense - I'll not bother altering it then. I think that's me finished the capitalisation. I've created an account with IABot but to become a basic user, you need to make edits but I don't know what the edits refer to (plus the ten day delay): might you have any advice concerning such? Forgive my use of Norwegian in my last edit: I've recently rewatched Season 3 of the original SKAM and my goodness, it's so much better than the French remake! Many thanks once again for all your help, it has been really insightful and you've been so patient with me despite my stubborn ignorance. EcheveriaJ (talk) 19:15, 19 December 2021 (UTC)

@EcheveriaJ: The TV animé series is different to the manga of the main article. The name of the episode and the character is the same. I've added the link. I attempted to put an {{anchor}} in the table (fixed by another editor) which takes you straight to the relevant entry. Anchors work exactly like subsections in any article, thus Draft talk:Axel Auriant#Hi. Edit to see how it works. You have to actually save/publish the article before it takes effect. I also added some more WLs.

Don't worry about using Norwegian, I also speak German and Russian and have travelled to all the Skandi countries on business (teaching PC server hardware} including Oslo. My daughter is doing a master's degree at Malmö uni, and she throws lots of Swedish into our convos (the Skåne dialect, anyway), and I've translated some Danish poetry for my sins as well. <polishes halo>

Re Iabot: What exactly is the message you get telling you that you need to make some edits? I'm not an expert, but I know someone who is. You have made lots of edits in mainspace already, so I'm not quite sure what the problem might be. Checking out your contribs, I saw you edited the Edwin Morgan article: "Strawberries" is one of my faves, and the Loch Ness Monster one <chuckle>. I ran Iabot against the draft anyway, and it made the archive links as expected. They can be always reverted if you'd like to try for yourself. Otherwise, it's all looking pretty good now, and I think you should attempt the move into mainspace. Select (Article) as the new title, and put "Moving draft article into mainspace" (or similar) in 'Reason', which will appear in the edit history. It's been lots of fun working on the draft with you. MinorProphet (talk) 15:00, 20 December 2021 (UTC)

@MinorProphet:So I'm completely confused about the animé now, but it seems like you've fixed it so I'll just leave it at that.

I know a person who speaks 4 languages, I've never met anyone who speaks more languages to a proficient degree! I'd quite like to live in Norway for a few years, but then again I couldn't cope with the pitifully few hours of sunlight in Winter - I struggle with the sun setting at 1545 as it is.

Having thought about it a bit longer, I think my permission is being denied on IABot because of the time lag required to register a user, not the 10 edit threshold (though the site doesn't specify). That one I just need to wait out a bit, so sorry for bothering you about it.

The number of Edwin Morgan poems I've analysed is ridiculous, and the number of essays I had to write up on his works.... not fun. The most interesting poems are maybe Glasgow Sonnet i, King Billy, Glasgow Green, In Glasgow, Stobhill. Canedolia is a good laugh (as are all the concrete poems) and provided me light relief from the more the more austere poems. I've made the move to mainspace. Thank you again for all of your help on this, I couldn't have completed it without you, and it has been great fun - I've now got a lot of pop culture to catch up on. EcheveriaJ (talk) 20:33, 20 December 2021 (UTC)

The article JoJo's Bizarre Adventure is about the manga, the printed graphic series. It spawned a load of animé spin-offs and films, detailed at JoJo's Bizarre Adventure (disambiguation). The episode(s) of the TV version which Auriant dubbed are part of JoJo's Bizarre Adventure: Golden Wind, but yer average reader would be be unlikely to find it, if the only link was to the manga. The Morgan poems are great, raw and accusatory. The sonnet is full of genuine pity, heightened by the restrictions of the classical form. Canedolia is hilarious. I've been tae Smoo cave and Scrabster the noo, while on holiday in Kinlochbervie; seen Eigg, Rum an' Muck, and passed through "pure Strontían" on the way tae anither holiday by Locháline; stayed in Largs on a business trip to Greenock; and discovered the joys of a pint of 90/ in Stirling, although it's not mentioned in the poem. NB The talk page is meant to be for improving the article, not a general chit-chat, so perhaps scribble on my talk page in future. Congratulations on the article move, I'm quite happy with it at last. We'll just have to wait and see. MinorProphet (talk) 00:25, 21 December 2021 (UTC)

@Mathglot: Really appreciate your helpful comments and edits as well. >MinorProphet (talk) 08:51, 21 December 2021 (UTC)

[1] "Axel Auriant". Théâtres et Producteurs Associés (in French). Archived from the original on 20 December 2021. Retrieved 13 November 2021.

[2] Guerrin, Stéphanie (24 February 2019). "'Skam', la série dont les ados et jeunes adultes raffolent". Le Parisien (in French). Archived from the original on 14 November 2021. Retrieved 13 November 2021.

[3] l’Etoile du Parisien is a top rating or recognition awarded by the French newspaper Le Parisien.

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