Talk:Arash (singer)/Archive 1

Archive 1

LOL

He won gold? on Top charts? you sure? --Spahbod 16:23, 16 July 2006 (UTC)

I think that this should be merged with the other article because it is the same persoN!

—Preceding unsigned comment added by 138.88.48.137 (talk • contribs) 19:48, 14 September 2006

Neutrality

This article sounds like it comes directly from material produced by a promotion agency. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 87.96.182.84 (talk) 08:20, 14 May 2008 (UTC)

I have tried very much to improve on the obvious neutrality issues and corrected a lot of the text and its language to make it a more neutral presentation. Hope the neutrality issue can be reconsidered after my further edits on this. werldwayd (talk) 18:22, 18 August 2008 (UTC)

Fair use rationale for Image:Arash pub.jpg

Image:Arash pub.jpg is being used on this article. I notice the image page specifies that the image is being used under fair use but there is no explanation or rationale as to why its use in Wikipedia articles constitutes fair use. In addition to the boilerplate fair use template, you must also write out on the image description page a specific explanation or rationale for why using this image in each article is consistent with fair use.

Please go to the image description page and edit it to include a fair use rationale.

If there is other other fair use media, consider checking that you have specified the fair use rationale on the other images used on this page. Note that any fair use images uploaded after 4 May, 2006, and lacking such an explanation will be deleted one week after they have been uploaded, as described on criteria for speedy deletion. If you have any questions please ask them at the Media copyright questions page. Thank you.BetacommandBot 19:44, 31 May 2007 (UTC)

You might want to use Image:Arash Labaf.JPG instead. --LA2 (talk) 01:56, 8 October 2008 (UTC)

Temptation and Alabina

As an old fan of Alabina I immediately recognised the Arash+Rebecca song "Temptation" the first time I heard it. It seems to partially be a cover of the song "Baila Maria" on Alabina's album named "Alabina" from 1996. The song is also in the end of the "Alabina Megamix" on the Alabina album "The Album II" from 1998.

But I am not complaining, Arash and Rebecca have done a very nice job of it, I like both their and Alabina's version of the song.

--David Göthberg (talk) 00:49, 19 December 2008 (UTC)

His heritage

Please check Arash's own website: http://www.arash.se, under biography. It says he is of "Persian" heritage. —Preceding unsigned comment added by Ddd0dd (talk • contribs) 01:28, 7 March 2009 (UTC) Also I'm gonna translate parts of his song, Iran Iran: "...I'm an Aryan child....Cyrus the great is the king...legendary Arash is an Iranian... I'd die for 2500 years history and culture of my country...". LOL if he is not Persian then I don't know who is!--Ddd0dd (talk) 01:40, 7 March 2009 (UTC)

Nationality, ethnicity, roots?

I think people who have editted this article made some mistakes about the origin of Arash. He is not Iranian in fact, he was born in Tehran but he is Iranian Azerbaijani (Azeri) or simple Azeri. Azeri and Iranian are not the same things, because they are two different nationalities of different origin. However, most Azeris are living in Iran (about 20-25 mln people), and Azerbaijani people are the second largest ethnic group in Iran after Iranians (or Persians to be specific). It is correct to write Iranian in terms of belonging appurtenant or related to Iran but if the goal is to specify nationality it will be correct to write Azerbaijani or Azeri in extremis Iranian Azeri. Giovanni Paradise (talk) 06:57, 7 February 2009 (UTC) Giovanni

Sorry your comments were so weak that I did not like to answer to it first. Azeri is an ethnicity and Iranian is a nationality. Az Azeri can be Iranian and an Azeri is most of the time Iranians. About Arash: It is not important where in Iran he is from. But in this case his mother is from Shiraz and his father from Esfahan.--Babakexorramdin (talk) 22:44, 16 May 2009 (UTC)

I have reported you to the admin for your inflammatory comments as you need to become familiar with Arbcomm I and II, which should restrict exactly your types. . As per Arash, he says here: "He says he chooses to sing in his native language because of his deep attachment to Iran and Persian culture.""[2]. So I think that should be sufficient to respond to your inflammatory comments. In Wikipedia we work with valid sources. Parishan provided one although it seems that the source got its information perhaps from another media. Anyhow these sources seem contradictory so I added and/or. --Nepaheshgar (talk) 16:54, 7 February 2009 (UTC)

I would check his own website also: [[3]](music impresario of Persian Heritage). Many of these news sources can get the wrong information from one bad source and then repeat it. This occurred during the Anoosheh Ansari story as well, when some medias printed wrong information (I am not saying this is the case but it should be double checked). --Nepaheshgar (talk) 16:58, 7 February 2009 (UTC)

People who are putting in that Arash is Azerbaijani are using sources that say nothing of the sort. None of the sources that these editors are using support their claim. Infact, the source from Radio Free Europe said the opposite. I dont really care what Arash is, but seriously, I just can't stand when people just want to come and take advantage of Wikipedia to spread misinformation just because anyone can edit it. And Arash has done songs songs in many languages, he is a very talented artist, but that doesnt say anything about his ethnic background (is Arash Russian?). The article clearly states:

"He says he chooses to sing in his native language because of his deep attachment to Iran and Persian culture. But he says he deliberately writes lyrics that are easy to pronounce, so that people can sing along regardless of whether they speak Persian."

"Platinum-selling singer and producer ARASH stakes his claim as one of the biggest pop music sensations to originate from Sweden, home to such pop pioneers as Abba and Ace of Base. But, it's the distinction of being the only music impresario of PERSIAN heritage whose success has translated into the Western and European mainstream music market that makes his story one for the history books." On his official webpage and myspace. I think that's a reliable source. --Lilyserbia (talk) 06:29, 4 March 2009 (UTC)

Poeple he is NOT Azerbaijani, he is Iranian. That is his nationality. He had said over and over again that Persian is his "MOTHER LANGUAGE". Please do not put your wishful thinking in the article ok?? ok!--74.12.105.44 (talk) 21:37, 6 March 2009 (UTC)

Yes that is is nationality and he has Azerbaijani roots, these are two different things, why is this such a problem? The official Eurovision biography of Arash even says so, I added it as a source.Baku87 (talk) 14:59, 15 May 2009 (UTC)

"roots" are not added to the opening of pages, he is not an Azerbaijani national, everyone has African roots too, so what? —Preceding unsigned comment added by Arashfans (talk • contribs) 23:51, 15 May 2009 (UTC)

Descent, origins, roots whatever you wanna call it, is always mentioned, just take a look at the article of Rebecca Zadig (duet singer of Arash) it clearly says in the first rule of Mexican descent. Baku87 (talk) 17:58, 16 May 2009 (UTC)

The ultimate authority is the interview and his website which were provided [4], His Bibliography on the official site: The only music impresario of Persian heritage. Most Iranian people have different roots with Azeris, etc in their backgrounds, Arash is not an exception and wikipedia is not for listing the genealogy of people. There is a proposed project that you would be able to use latter :Wikipeople--Raayen (talk) 23:40, 16 May 2009 (UTC)

This is regrettable. Iranians in Europe were supporting Aysel and Arash, look what some people wrote: [5]: After initial complaint made by BayBak against the selecting of mentioned song to represent Azerbaijani in “Eurovision 2009”, many Azerbaijani groups have joined in and are condemning that choice by Northern Azerbaijani officials. BayBak also have informed ITV, which is one of the main sponsors of the event, but unfortunately have not received any reply.--Raayen (talk) 00:52, 17 May 2009 (UTC)

In my opinion it was mostly because of Arash - Azerbaijan managed to get 3rd place and I had hoped this would ease tensions between the two nationalities, I guess people will always find something to complain. Anyways back to the topic, I think its only logical to add both Persian aswell as Azeri origins to this article based upon the countless of biographies and interviews with Arash. Baku87 (talk) 08:08, 17 May 2009 (UTC)

Another point, this aritlce should be named Arash Labbaf, since that is his full name. Baku87 (talk) 08:10, 17 May 2009 (UTC)

well there are not two nationalities. Arash might have an ethnicity but his nationality is Iranian. WArash has himself said that his mother is Shirazi and his father is Esfahani. This makes him an Ethnic Fars. But I do not exclude that like most Iranians he is of mixed origins and hshas Azeri, Kurdish, Gilaki etc... roots too. what I suggets is to formulate this as follows: " Though he stated his roots are from Shiraz and Esfahan from maternal and paternal sides respectively, he is likely to be of mixed orifins, like most Iranians and reportedly has some Iranian Azerbaijani roots>: Then link it to Iranian Azerbaijani. But the info that his father and mother are from Esfahan and Shiraz should be there. The fact that he helped republic of Azerbaijan had not anything to do with ethnicty. All Iranians like republic of Azerbaijan and supported Arash and Aysel. All except the Panturkists such as Bay Bak and other extremists. Any way I agree with you that it is Labbf with two Bs and not one. I corrected it once but someone has changed it again.--Babakexorramdin (talk) 10:06, 17 May 2009 (UTC)

Some talks about ethnycities are irrational. As I said, most Iranians have different backgrounds. I can say all of them. For many of them backgrounds have been lost. Only the language has remained and other factors of ethnicity are lacking to a great extent and are vague. Clear cut way of thinking is the human tendency to label things for simplicity (sluggish mind), but the world is not simple. Ethno-engineering is also the other interfering factor in the contemporary time: Colonialism and Stalinist consolidation of socialist nations have found their ways to the content of curriculums of academic institutions, sarcastically showing themselves as the truth to people while even ethnologists know that the ethnicity is more or less misty. Now I don't understand why some of us are so eager to make it sharp! Of course the history shows who has been what to some extent and how changes occurred. BTW "Fars" is not an English word (this is an English Wikipedia) and Persian-speakers of Iran don't call themselves neither "Fars" nor "Persian" or any other thing. The only thing that they identify themselves of is "Iran". "Persian" in English have a more wider range of meanings and it is not exclusive to "Persian-speakers". I propose to only mention that he is from "Iran" and "Sweden", the countries. The present opening (me myself had a hand on it) is childish. Wikipedia don't deserve that.--Raayen (talk) 16:09, 17 May 2009 (UTC)--Raayen (talk) 16:03, 17 May 2009 (UTC)

Raayen the problem is , I think, understanding of ethnicity in Iran is different than that in the Republic of Azerbaijan and Armenia. In Iran it is a cultural concept but in the Republic of Azerbaijan and Armenia it is a static concept and very political. You are either this or that etc.... It is the legacy of Stalins policy.--Babakexorramdin (talk) 16:25, 17 May 2009 (UTC)

I think we can make a compremize like: Though he stated his roots are from Shiraz and Esfahan from maternal and paternal sides respectively, he is likely to be of mixed origins of Persian and Azeri, like most Iranians. - Then link it to both Persian and Azerbaijani people articles. Baku87 (talk) 13:10, 18 May 2009 (UTC)

Yes something like that works well--Babakexorramdin (talk) 17:43, 18

May 2009 (UTC)

that sucks. The word Azeri mut be mentioned.

Infact he is neither. He is a swedish citizen and has never been to Iran since the day he left. The article should say.. is a Swedish singer born in Iran. ..or perhaps only Is a Swedish singer.--MarkusBJoke (talk) 14:44, 27 May 2009 (UTC)

No, that will only open up a can of worms. He calls himself Iranian and there are sources stating this so we can't call him simply a Swedish singer. We usually put Swedish singer born in X when said person came to Sweden when very young or represents Sweden internationally (in sports and such). The Iranian-Swedish fits because he has a dual nationality and was raised in both of these countries. It's the ethnicity (or descent) which is trickier. --Lilyserbia (talk) 23:00, 22 June 2009 (UTC)

Russian Wikipedia

• Please also pursue the article and its talk page on Russian Wikipedia.--Raayen (talk) 00:31, 20 May 2009 (UTC)

• @ Goldorack

"his numerous declarations as well as Eurovision website specifying his Azeri roots are very authoritative, hence his mixed Perso-Azeri heritage should be reflected properly as it is in this version." His great grandfather was Azeri. This is Wikipedia not Wikipeople. This source is dubious. In YouTube, Arash himself doesn't say about it. This source is just there to push. There is nothing about Azeri root there. Overall, we know that his great grandfather was Azeri. Who was the great grand mother of Newton?! Do you see it on his article and especially on its lead. Please use eventual Wikipeople for these roots.--Raayen (talk) 19:32, 19 May 2009 (UTC)

• [6]: "Arash will be in Eurovision 2009, as the first Persian ever !!" 7 sources were provided for "Azeri root", that is for proving a Half Truth, or may I say "one eighth" truth: i.e. great grandfather. I am talking Stalinistic or Darwinistic by th way. :-) Don't get me wrong, I am fine with the present version. I would just like to mention that the lead is not a lead of Wikipedia.--Raayen (talk) 21:35, 20 May 2009 (UTC)

Raayen, the fact that you agree and cite the same evidence of Arash's roots being also ethnically Azeri, shows that it should be reflected in the page, as it's not an obscure or debatable information, but a valid fact. Secondly, it's extremely important insofar as explaining why of all available entertainers Azerbaijan choose Arash, and why Arash decided to agree to this duo, despite it being for neither Iran, nor Sweden. As he explained it numerous times, starting from his solo concert in Baku last year, it is because of his Azeri roots. So this information is very important and makes a lot of sense to be reported in an encyclopedia like Wikipedia. Any attempt to supress it is invalid, is POV, bias, and essentially vandalism. --Goldorack (talk) 10:52, 22 May 2009 (UTC)

just his great grandfather was azery not more.he say always im iranian.even after the uruvison he told to bbc reporter: i saing always i love iran and im iranian.and when reporter asked him why selected azerbaijan he answered: when i was in baku i heared aboute uruvision and i heared aysel selected for this so i send my poem to her and.....he didnt say because im azery!!!i dont think he know azery even!if one man in azerbaijan has a 1 armanian grandfather you think he is armanian??oliver kahn have a one grandmother from latovia.but any boady dont say he is german-latovian.but when he did go to latvia say it because he wanted become closer to them when he was in latvia.--Iroony (talk) 21:18, 22 May 2009 (UTC)

he isnt persian-azery.his mother and father no one isnt azery.who he is azery?!!!for one grandfather any boady dont become to azery.--Iroony (talk) 09:23, 23 May 2009 (UTC)

Yes, it does, one granparent, especially a grandFATHER, is enough to have it reflected, and makes Arash partly Azeri. Especially in Iran, like in Azerbaijan and elsewhere, where nationality passes from a male line. So having an Azeri grandfather, makes Arash at least 25% Azeri. And if that's his father's father, then Arash is Azeri ethnically according to the laws of Iran, Sweden, Azerbaijan, and any other country except Israel. DO NOT REMOVE THIS INFORMATION, THAT IS VANDALISM! --Goldorack (talk) 10:24, 23 May 2009 (UTC)

in iran dont aske than pepole you are persian or azer or other.in iran we have just one nationality and this is iranian and just wrot this in IDcart.you cant say he is azery when he dont know azery even!!he sad every iranian must speaking with persian.you can just say he have one grandfather in azery root not more.you say he is persian azery its mean he is 50-50%.my father is turk.i know turkish im 50-50 no arash.my last name have one part complete turkish and that is gardash.you just can say in this article arsh have one grandfathers azery not more.you wrote in azery wikipedia he is turk complete!!!ama bu yalandi.--Iroony (talk) 10:58, 23 May 2009 (UTC)

What you are saying is completely irrelevant and inconsequential -- this is not Iran, this is Wikipedia, and all authoritative, sourced information must remain. You are repeatedly comitting edit warring and vandalism by supressing major information about Arash's ethnicity, which hints at your bias and POV. --Goldorack (talk) 11:09, 23 May 2009 (UTC)

i just think he sad that for winne and siging in yuruvision not more.in iran we have too much azery singer such as the Dariush Eghbali , googoosh , noshafaryn and davood behbodi.all of them have sing with azery languge but arash dont have even one!percent not is matter!mother languge is main.--Iroony (talk) 11:14, 23 May 2009 (UTC)

but arash is iranian no wikipediaian!!!you sad father is main but i sad not father and not mother in iran arent any matter.ok wirght but i chang it to he have just one grandfather.--Iroony (talk) 11:14, 23 May 2009 (UTC)

If he is not "wikipedian", then we should delete this page compeletely, is that your logic? Once again, Iroony and St Hubert, please refrain from removing this sourced and valid information! If you remove it, it means you are disruptive, edit warring and comitting vandalism - among other things! Please don't do it, or I will be forced to report your disruptions, since you have been doing it for several days now. --Goldorack (talk) 11:19, 23 May 2009 (UTC)

any way his mothers languge is persian and you cant say he is azery!!you must be write he just from one granfather have azery roots not more.and here is wikipedia not wikiroots.befor you we just wrote here he is iranian not more.--Iroony (talk) 11:25, 23 May 2009 (UTC)

First of all, before I engaged, you were busy reverting other users -- I only placed back all the sourced links, information and improved it. Secondly, no one questions his language abilities, although he speaks several languages. Third, you can improve the article if you don't like the way it's worded -- no need to remove the sources, and supress that he has Azeri roots, especially since Persian goes first, and Azeri second, although according to the alphabetic order, it should be the other way around. So you can't explain your edit warring and vadanlism like this - instead of being an EDITOR, you are a REVERTER. Fourth, he can be Iranian, and still have Azeri roots, since Iranian is not ethnic, whilst Azeri is, so there is no problem whatsoever. Fifth, there is no evidence that his other, maternal grandfather and both grandmothers are all ethnically Persian -- and not, for example, Kurdish, Lur, Bakhtiyari, Mazandarani, Gilani, Baluchi, or even Arab, Jewish, Hindi, etc. --Goldorack (talk) 12:03, 23 May 2009 (UTC)

isfihan and shiraz are persian city not gilak or jewish or other.many pepole in iran have azery roots and one of the them is our leadr khamenei.so aysel leved in baki you know her mother or grandmother arent armanian russia or other??!!so you cant say aysel is azery even.i think arash is a lier because first he sad my mother is from afghanistan and my father is persian from isfihan and next say my mother from shiraz and my father from isfihan and now he say my father have azery roots!!!!he is just a insincere.because he wanted become closer to azerbaijanian say it.if it is true why he didnt say it never??why when he speaking with iranian chanel dont say it??he sad i love iran and my languge who is persian and he sad every boady mus speaking with persian but now he say other things.--Iroony (talk) 14:01, 23 May 2009 (UTC)

Dear Iroony, please leave Azeri Wikipedia, that is full of misinformation. What surprised me was Russian Wikipedia: Russian being one of the most important languages of the world and Russia, a country with a great deal of role. That is sad. English Wikipedia has also peoblems but not to such an extent.--Raayen (talk) 15:15, 23 May 2009 (UTC)

fame + politics + ethno-engineering makes all such things happen. [7]: "Här firar Arashs familj i Malmö." (translation: Here, Arash family are celebrating in Malmö.), "Nu hoppas familjen på att Arash ger den svenska Melodifestivalen en chans." (translation: Now the family hopes that Arash gives the Swedish Melodifestivalen a chance.). "now" word has a lot meanings here.--Raayen (talk) 14:55, 23 May 2009 (UTC)

This is a silly dispute. But Arash speaks only Persian and Swedish and English. There seems to be various contradictory sources, so one has to look at Arash's interview in Persian BBC and his own website. It is possible perhaps that as one site said, his great grandfather is Azeri. If his great grandfather is Azeri as the site mentions (although such sites do not meet WP:RS), then that is worth mentioning. But news reports are not necessarily RS. His website simply mentions him of "Persian heritage" and "Persian musician". So I think unless there is something else outside of his website, then one should not bother with what seems to be contradictory sources. Shiraz/Isfahan are Persian speaking cities, if Arash's parents are from there as he states in his Persian (a language he understands) interview, he says he "sings in his native language" which is Persian and his own website (the only one that meets WP:RS) introduces him as Persian, then he is Persian. In his own website, which he has control over (he does not have control over any Russian translated interview or site), he introduces himself as the first Persian in eurovision. But I guess if other sites (which do not meet WP:RS since they are not direct statements from him) mention his great grandfather is Azeri, that should be mentioned too. But that does not make him Azeri, because ethnicity in Iran is a cultural phenomenon and having a great grandfather that is Azeri (if true as that interview with Arash claims although it is not in his site), but being 7/8 non-Azeri seems hard to characterize. Or else, most Azeris ancestry are also old Iranic or someone like Shahryar is a Seyyed (male descendant of prophet Muhammad) but that does not make him an Arab Iranian. Heck Khomeini, Khamenei, Musavi, Khatami are all Seyyeds, but this does not make them Arabs, because ethnicity is a cultural phenomenon. Usually native language is what characterizes ethnicity in Iran, in this case Arash is clear his native language is Persian and in his own website, he says he is the "First Persian in Eurovision". Note I could personally care less about Eurovision and it is not my type of music (neither is even Arash's music although I respect his listeners, but I am not a fan of pop music in general), but information should be from his own website and news sources are not reliable if they contradict each other. One does not characterize ethnicity by "great grandfather" in modern Iran, but this fact is worth mentioning in biography of him, but mentioning it in the first line seems awkward. What other article mentions the ethnicity of the great grandfather of someone in the first line?? --Nepaheshgar (talk) 19:32, 23 May 2009 (UTC)

to night voa persian chanel had a tallking with arash.he dont sad im azerbaijanian or other he sad i only was a guest from iran in yuruvison and azerbaijan.i heard this words than himself no from other.he sad yuru vison just a opportunity for me.aboute russiwiki i think some azerbaijanian know russian yet very good.i sad to one friend from tajikestan.--Iroony (talk) 19:34, 23 May 2009 (UTC)

The only reliable source in this case is Arash's webpage. Or else there are 1000s of sources news reports and etc. that mention him as Persian, and we cannot synthesize. As I mentioned it is noteworthy to mention his great grandfather is Azeri(although the source is not RS in the sense that it is not from Arash's website and news reports these days are full of error), but it seems very awkward for any article to mention the ethnicity of the great grandfather of someone in the first line! None of the news reports are authoritative, meet WP:RS, Newspapers except few like new york times, washington post are not generally deemed reliable [8]. It is possible as he mentions one of his great grandfathers is an Azeri in one source, but this does not make Azeri in the sense that in Iran ethnicity is cultural phenomenon and city phenomenon. I have not seen such an information about him directly in his website. Indeed he only understands English, Persian and Swedish, so one cannot verify Russian/Azeri sources. His native language is Persian as another interview says and he doesn't know Azeri. So what makes sense is mention him as Persian heritage (per his own website and his own native language) but mention his great grandfather has Azeri roots couple of lines later under biography. Anything outside of Arash's own website does not have the same weight of course, and if Arash had mentioned something else in his website, then that should be in the lead. I think the current version where he is mentioned Persian (based on his own website, English(language he understands) interview where he mentions his native language as Persian, and Persian (another language he understands) interview where he mentions his parents from Persian speaking cities of Isfahan/Shiraz is accurate. In addition, it seems we should also mention that his great grandfather is Azeri, but under biography, since no other article mentions the ethnicity of someone's great grandfather in the first line. How he identifies himself is clear in his own website. But again if there is any dispute, it should simply base the information on his own website and get rid off any news sites, etc.(overwhelming majority which do not meet WP:RS) which Arash does not supervise. He is only responsible for the content of his website which is under his direct supervision. His website mentions he is the first Persian in eurovision and says he is of Persian heritage.--Nepaheshgar (talk) 22:04, 23 May 2009 (UTC)

It is not very important what someone's ethnicity in Iran is. It is only a cultural phenomeneon and has no political connotations unlike in the Republic of Azerbaijan, Armenia etc... His identity is such, Iranian lived in Sweden born from Parents from Shiraz and esfahan and has a great grandfather from Iranian Azerbaijan. I do not understand why people are talking this useless discussion about his roots and ethnicity?--Babakexorramdin (talk) 11:53, 24 May 2009 (UTC)

I agree.. ethnicity in Iran is no big deal, but in other places it seems to be, and then actually even eurovision is no big deal and it is an insignificant event... but no one really puts someone's great grandfather on the first line. I think based on how identifies himself in his website (any other source is edited, manipulated or unverifiable) is good enough. And we can mention his great grandfather is Iranian Azeri in the biography section. That is the current locked version is good. --Nepaheshgar (talk) 16:00, 24 May 2009 (UTC)

Most of the sources say it's his grandfather who was Azeri, but even if it were his great-grandfather, that still means that his son, Arash's grandfather, was still Azeri (even if his mother, that is Arash's great-grandma, was not Azeri), since it's the paternal lineage that's most important. Then, it is not trivial (most of you have never edited the page, you just reverted it, removing all that information that even mentioned the word "Azeri"), and can be both in the lead and in the body of the article, since Arash has been talking a lot about his Azeri roots, about his pride, and it explains why he was invited, and accepted, to co-represent Azerbaijan in Eurovision 2009. Because of this, it is not trivial, and important piece of information, which helps explain his and Azerbaijan's decision.

Meanwhile, there is no rule that says that only an official website can be considered, and all other sources, even if they are "1000s", as someone cheerfully wrote above, can be disregarded. Not so fast - those sources are his interviews, and there are even video's of him saying the same on the Internet, plus multiple written interviews to very reputable Azeri newspapers, like Echo. That is why this information should be reflected in the article. Arash became much better known thanks to this opportunity to all Europeans, who would have otherwise never knew him - after all, signing on the same stage, and win, someone like Patricia Kaas, is a huge thing to any Western musician. --Goldorack (talk) 17:38, 24 May 2009 (UTC)

Again the only thing that is reputable, reliable, authoritative or whatever term we want to use to push POV, is his own website. In his own website, he is clear, he is of Persian heritage and is the "First Persian in Eurovision". His website is how he identifies himself. Just saying something is reputable/authoritative does not make it so. Arash in his own website (not Azeri newsreport) is clear that he is proud to be the "first Persian in Eurovision". He does not speak Azeri, so one cannot know what those interviews and etc. He does have one interview where he says his great grandfather is Azeri. If the sources contradict then per WP:BLP, they should not be there. "Paternal lineage" does not determine ethnicity in Iran, or else Khomeini and Shahriyar would be Arab since they are Seyyeds. It is native language. But all those are off side discussions. What matters is that Arash identifies himself in his own website and then he has an interview where he mentions his great grandfather is Azeri (from eurovision site and not Azeri newspapers). These two informations should be there, but something about someone's great grandfather is not part of the lead. How he identifies himself in his website though works for the lead. --Nepaheshgar (talk) 20:50, 24 May 2009 (UTC)

when we say ethnicity is not important in Iran we also mean that it is not important that he is Persian or not. What matters is that he is Iranian. It should be mentioned that he is Iranian, then add all we know about his background. Esfahani Father, Shirazi Mother, Azeri (great) grand father. I do not know maybe Kurdish Grandmother, Mazandarani Great great great grand father. Whatever we know is Ok as long as it is mentioned that he is Iranian--Babakexorramdin (talk) 22:24, 24 May 2009 (UTC)

• It conforms also with the guideline. And I think "Ethnicity here is not relevant to the subject's notability", because it is not worthy to mention that, on the opening, for a minority who believes that we should dig the ancestors.
• Nepaheshgar, A Part of my talk was not so out of point. It was about Wikipedia as a whole, here Russian Wikipedia, with a distorted information about Arash. There is no way to correct that from English Wikipedia but I wanted to draw the attention to the other corners of Wikipedia which are Wikipedia anyway.--Raayen (talk) 00:44, 25 May 2009 (UTC)

I agree with this formula too and that wiki guideline is good. The whole eurovision contest is stupid and Iranians don't care about. The issue is though that when Arash proudly says he is Iranian and of Persian heritage in his own website (the only thing that is reliable out of this mess), there are attempts to minimize this. But Arash furthered his career and the contest is taken religiously in some new countries, so I guess is a win win for both Arash and his sponser country. But Arash in his own site says he is the first Persian in eurovision and etc. If the issue is clear cut, then there is no reason to use that wiki-guideline, but since there is a dispute it is best to leave out of the opening setence. We should simply mention Iranian in the intro. Then under biography we should mention reliable sources (his website is foremost, eurovision site where his great grandfather is mentioned and BBC interview). Any other news site is not reliable, specially when the person does not speak the languages. The stuff about what defines ethnicity is not agreed upon concepts and is not worth arguing. Lets just mention it in the biography based on what he states in his website, BBC interview and interview with eurovision. All other sources are not interviews directly from him and youtube cannot be used as a source (specially if he is not making a statement). To summarize: 1) Mention nothing about ethnicity in the intro per the wiki guideline you introduced, specially since it seems to have been disputed her. 2) In biography the stuff from his own Website has the most authority and goes first. 3) In one direct interview from eurovision site (which we can say is relatively reliable) he says his great grandfather is Azeri and so we can mention he has Azeri roots too, and one of his great grandparents is Azeri. --Nepaheshgar (talk) 01:40, 25 May 2009 (UTC)

The article should only state that Arash is a Swedish singer. he hasnt been in iran since the day he left and he has a swedish passport.--MarkusBJoke (talk) 14:45, 27 May 2009 (UTC)

Sweden treats its minorities rather well. Thats why I said that the Swedish part should be mentioned. Was he living in such countries, as Denmark, the Netherlands, France etc... where they discriminate their minorities (even legally) and they see them as a burden rather than their true citizens and compatriots, then it was not justified to mention the host country as part of its identity IMO. But nevertheless the subject feeling does count and Arash has said in many of his interviews that he sees himself and Iranian and sings for Iran and its poeple. he has even song Iran Iran for the Iranian national team. In addition he has a double nationality Iranian and Swedish.--Babakexorramdin (talk) 21:14, 27 May 2009 (UTC)

Arash has own webpage. The article should start with the way he defines himself in his own webpage. Everything else is secondary. --Nepaheshgar (talk) 21:55, 27 May 2009 (UTC)

every boady know he isn't azery.--Iroony (talk) 21:35, 2 September 2009 (UTC)

References

Iranian vs. Swedish

This should be in the Iranian Artists section not Sewedish

- Sassan —Preceding unsigned comment added by 24.137.119.185 (talk • contribs) 21:38, 4 April 2006

If a foreigner in Sweden becomes famous, the Swedes will claim him. Otherwise, foreigners will remain foreigners. --Candide, or Optimism 21:57, 4 April 2006 (UTC)

Amusing. So much prejudice and ignorance in the discussion section. Arash is not a foreigner to Sweden and having that mentality says more about you than it does about "views of Swedes". He did not migrate to Sweden as an adult. He migrated to Sweden as a child, thereby making him partly Swedish. I'd attempt changing his nationality to Iranian-Swedish yet I know it will only be changed back. --Lilyserbia (talk) 10:49, 17 December 2008 (UTC)

Who doesn't? Now that he is successful, Iranians say he is Irani, otherwise he would be farangi!84.189.12.71 (talk) 14:16, 10 February 2011 (UTC)

Azeri Roots

OK. I can see he stated his Azeri great grand father in an interview. But 8 sources were mentioned 4 of which does not respond and one of which is in fact in Russian and does not even say anything about this and another one is a fan page. So we need to clear these sources and just leave BBC and Eurovision sources.

So if you extranationalist Azeri bros want to say he has an Azeri great grand father, that's Ok as he himself stated and you have sources. However, he also states himself as Persian so labeling him as Azeri is just meaningless. People are what they choose to be not what you want to see. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 78.181.8.57 (talk) 14:32, 20 May 2011 (UTC)

ok

ok — Preceding unsigned comment added by 76.169.49.233 (talk) 17:52, 10 June 2012 (UTC)