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Talk:Anglo-Spanish War (1625–1630)

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Edit Warring

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The editors involved in that section need to stop edit warring with constant reverts see: WP:3RR and WP:RV. Use this talk page to come to a consensus based on sources. Include direct quotations to support references to contended conclusions not just page numbers. If the outcome of war is unclear, discuss these aspects in the article and leave that part of the info box blank.Tttom1 (talk) 17:51, 19 August 2010 (UTC)[reply]

James in infobox

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As the article states, Charles I was the one who declared the war. His father James I refused to. As such, James should not be listed in the infobox as a commander. Hairy Dude (talk) 00:55, 22 September 2019 (UTC)[reply]

Result of the war

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@RobertJohnson35 @Eastfarthingan Before continuing with this loop of "undoing" and "redoing," I think it is better to discuss the result of the conflict in this discussion section. Personally, I suggest changing the result of the war from "Status quo ante bellum" to "Spanish Victory" since, analyzing the consequences of the war and the sections of the peace treaty, the events have been beneficial for the Spanish Empire. However, it has been more detrimental for the English monarchy and its allies. You can discuss it here. Unidosporasensio (talk) 13:36, 4 July 2024 (UTC)[reply]

I agree RobertJohnson35 (talk) 13:39, 4 July 2024 (UTC)[reply]
I disagree, the treaty determined nothing that was already set from the 1604 London treaty and if the Status quo ante bellum (please read) is agreed then nothing changes. Eastfarthingan (talk) 14:15, 4 July 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Territorially nothing changed, I agree with that, but as you have seen, England suffered great economic losses and it increased the division between the English monarchy and the parliament (like the wiki says). Spain got benefited since England interrupted its commercial relations with the Netherlands, one of the objectives of Spain. The most important battles were won by Spain (such as the Siege of Breda, the Cádiz Expedition or the Capture of St. Kitts and Nevis). England started the war to weaken Spain and they weakened themselves. It doesn't matter if the treaty was a Status quo ante bellum or not, the war was beneficial for Spain and greatly harmed England (basically a Spanish diplomatic victory). Also, why would there be sources that say it was a Spanish victory if it wasn't?[1][2][3][4][5][6] RobertJohnson35 (talk) 15:49, 4 July 2024 (UTC)[reply]
It makes a huge difference if the treaty was Status quo ante bellum. Did you read the article? There are many sources that cite that too - ergo the war was a draw. I might add that with you're re opinion then perhaps we should change the result of the Anglo-Spanish war of 1654 -70 as an English victory given that Spain won a single battle? The treaties of Madrid of 1667 & 70 gave England big concessions. I digress, and that said, a consensus had to made on the Anglo-Dutch war articles as result of saying it was a win, lose etc & now all have the result with the respective treaty that followed. That should stay here too. Eastfarthingan (talk) 17:11, 4 July 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Yes, I have read it, and in the section of Historical Examples it says that the Seven Years' War (more specifically the Third Silesian War) was a Status quo ante bellum, but Austria failed to take Silesia and the article says it was a Prussian diplomatic victory (casually as in this Anglo-Spanish War), so there can perfectly be a Status quo and a winning side. Although I agree that in the Infobox we should only put the peace treaty, we could add in the aftermath that it was a Status quo but that some sources (the 6 sources that I have mentioned before) consider it as a Spanish diplomatic victory (without confirming or denying anything), I think that would be a good solution. About the Anglo-Spanish War of 1654-1670, if there are sources that say that England won and no source that says that Spain won, then we should do the same. RobertJohnson35 (talk) 17:51, 4 July 2024 (UTC)[reply]
I'm glad we are agreed on that. The infobox result will stay as it is and you can add sourced information in the aftermath. Eastfarthingan (talk) 19:08, 4 July 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Great, I will do it RobertJohnson35 (talk) 20:07, 4 July 2024 (UTC)[reply]

References

  1. ^ Hanlon, Gregory (2020). European Military Rivalry, 1500–1750: Fierce Pageant.
  2. ^ O'Neill, Patrick. Charles I and the Spanish Plot: Anglo-Habsburg Relations and the Outbreak of the War of the Three Kingdoms, 1630-1641 (PDF). p. 29.
  3. ^ Fernández, Pedro (2021). Eso no estaba en mi libro de Historia del Imperio español (in Spanish).
  4. ^ Alcalá-Zamora, José N. (2005). Felipe IV: el hombre y el reinado (in Spanish). p. 192.
  5. ^ Sanz Camañes, Porfirio (2002). Diplomacia hispano-inglesa en el siglo XVII (in Spanish). p. 105.
  6. ^ H. Elliott, John (2017). España, Europa y el mundo de ultramar (1500-1800) (in Spanish).
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